Erwin Craps
Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be
Tue Jul 29 08:30:33 CDT 2003
Ueh yes I know, that what I wrote... For the server software. Not for dev soft. -----Original Message----- From: Marcus, Scott (GEAE, Contractor) [mailto:scott.marcus at ae.ge.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 3:18 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com Erwin, The reason you don't hear much about .Net anymore is that MS determined that the .Net label confuses all but the IT sector. Look hear... http://www.xtremepccentral.com/forums/archive/47/2003/04/3/4420 Scott -----Original Message----- From: Erwin Craps [mailto:Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 8:55 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com That is so true.. But there are a lot more not's like that.... Before the internet became popular they where investing to connect you kitchen toaster to your computer. They had a whole interface already build for that (just before W95), infact the W95 interface was partialy based on that. Anything heard of that... Well, yes, they are now busy again with Windows Embedded... First refrigirators and Microwaves detected with a (windows) computer in it... I pay attention to little things like when advertising money is stopping... Microsoft is nog longer putting large effort (in Europe) in .NET advertising. Infact I do'nt hear a thing anymore about .NET. I only knew a new version is coming up (or is in the meanwhile) (2003) because I saw it standing in the pricelist of my distributor. I didn't received a single message from MS... X-box same story, Isn't it very quit around X-box? All stores are reducing shelf space for X-box and selling their stocks with a big discounts.. .NET server too, they silently changed the name back to Windows 2003 server, if that is not a clue... Dont misunderstand me, I'm pro .NET, I have several apps in ASP and one in C#. I see a lot of websites in ASP, the only aspx website I 've seen is mine.... And thats the market, .NET is marketwyse 2 to 3 years behind on the market place, dispite all marketing efforts with .Net they are not getting anywhere today or very slow. But it is true, I they really want it, they do get it. But not at any cost even MS stops at a certain point (if not profitable). I believe we, AccessD'rs, should use .NET, for me there no doubt about that. Erwin -----Original Message----- From: jcolby at colbyconsulting.com [mailto:jcolby at colbyconsulting.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 2:32 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com Erwin, MS was nobody in networks. They decided to be somebody in Networks. MS are now a HUGE somebody in networks. MS was nobody in Databases. They decided to be somebody in Databases. They are now a HUGE somebody in databases. MS was nobody on the WWW. MS decided to be somebody on the WWW....... I heard all the same arguments back when they were nobody in networks. "They simply can't unseat the existing systems..." etc. I heard all the same arguments in Database servers. "They simply can't unseat the existing systems..." etc. In both cases, they wanted that market and they now own huge slices of that market. They want the web. .net is the tool they have built to dominate the Web. They WILL be a somebody in the WEB! John W. Colby www.colbyconsulting.com -----Original Message----- From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Erwin Craps Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 3:23 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com That will be probably true. C# / .NET is no big deal in Europe (not yet). A friend freelance developper (bodyshop) whom works for big institutes in the financial world was absolutly convinced about c#/.net. It a great developersenviroment. This is what he said about 1,5 years ago when he was developing an internet interface for an Access app I wrote. It was against my will in C# because I don't believe in new technology until proven (and I can't program in c#)... But it was MS and it was the folow up for Visual Interdev. In the back of my mind I knew I had to go there and he convinced me. He wanted to write this as a test case and a reference to higher up his price in bodyshopping market... A couple of months ago he told me that he quitted developping in C#, because no demand, because MS was way to late on the market with this product. Every major company has been developping in Java since a few years because of no equivalent in the market (at that time). MS does not push the .NET platform enough in to businesses. Plus big businesses have same attitude as me. Proven technology first. There is a big disadvantage for .NET. You need a at least a 2K server (or WS on small scale). Did you compared the price of a stupid Linux server and W2k or higher server? As I recall MS also announced to change the license policy for the IIS server for what concerns .NET, 1 internet user 1 license... I can be wrong with this but I do recall to have read something in this kind. I believe the Linux hype has made them change there mind. I'm not pro Linux, infact I don't like it, had to work a couple of times with it, and I feel myself in the dark ages of DOS 1.1 (thats as far as I go) again when working with the OS. But I must admit, they have created a huge market and there are some pretty nice webservers out there. And all the tools are for free. And thats why PHP/MYSQL is so dominant on the market. What do you thing all those kids work with during education? W2K/IIS or a linux server? I had a student asking me for Turbo-Pascal because they can't offord some current languages in school. Don't get me wrong, I don't like PHP, MYSQL, Linux and others because, because, because, I don't know, but I don't like it. Probably because it's free, and I lost my confidence in free stuff (no such thing...). Probably because most of the stuff I hear from Linux/PHP/MysQL comes from those Internet Wiz kids who are telling so much inconsistancees... Like PHP is secure because it open source., there are no Virusses on Linux, etc... The last one we already (we as in DOS/NT people) know, everyone should know that when you have an OS, you gonna have virusses... The first one (secure 'cause opensource) I find funny. If someone uses that as an argument I always ask, "Did you checked every program line to see if any trojan Horses are embedded in the code?". I never got a "yes" as an answer. I wonder if someone puts a trojan horse in 30000 lines of code, if anyone would notice that? Probably there will be some geek, but would anybody (low cost users) care it's in there? Some people rather like to die then pay for something. And to conclude, it's my believe today that Java is and will stay the dominant player for serious web developping. It's is also my believe that there is a gigantic Internet market for less serious developping, I would guess 60% of the total market, and that will be for the wizz kids (that have now an age around 30) and low cost apps. And than you have those SME businesses that want a serious develoment but the application is to 'minor' or the budget is to low. Typecally our (Access) market, and what are whe gonna use? Seems evident to me. .NET and probably VB.NET. Why? Lower entrence. You seen C# code? Pff I not gonna start with that. Just give me my plain old basic. Proven technology you know. Always been there, always will be there and everybody knows it... And if you have made it to this line I would like to felicitate you to keep on reading my kr*p... Huumm, I feel better now :-) Erwin _______________________________________________ AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com _______________________________________________ AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com _______________________________________________ AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com