[AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com

Jim Dettman jimdettman at earthlink.net
Wed Jul 30 09:08:23 CDT 2003


Mark,

  Very nice idea!

Jim Dettman
President,
Online Computer Services of WNY, Inc.
(315) 699-3443
jimdettman at earthlink.net

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Mitsules, Mark
Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 9:59 AM
To: '[AccessD]'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


Bruce,

If you are referring to .hta (HTML Applications), then you'll be glad to
know I actually wrote and implemented a simple application for our
department.  From our departmental webpage, users can now install printers,
set them as default, or remove them.  The user interface consists of a list
box and 3 buttons.  I also include a zoom-able map to show the locations.
This approach is much simpler than browsing through the enterprise's
~10,000(?) computers and printers in the "Add Printer" wizard.  The user no
longer has to know details like; "which" computer a printer is attached to,
nor the "exact" share name of a networked printer.

Unfortunately, my ability to do more with .hta's is limited by security.
Accomplishing most WSH scripting methods requires full admin privileges on
each remote computer.


Mark


-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Bruen [mailto:bbruen at bigpond.com]
Sent: Wednesday, July 30, 2003 12:39 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


BTW: What ever happened to hta?.  There was a technology that I though may
have had real promise. B

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Haslett, Andrew
Sent: Wednesday, 30 July 2003 1:40 PM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


Sure, its implementing a couple of OO concepts, but its still a Hybrid
language.

It doesn't support the four 'biggies' of pure OO languages like Java and the
.Net breed and cannot be considered a pure OO language.

That said, a large majority of web coders don't know or will never use OO
principals in their applications and will stick to procedural programming,
so it won't matter!

Cheers,
Andrew


-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Lawrence (AccessD) [mailto:accessd at shaw.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, 30 July 2003 12:57 PM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


Andrew:

You are partly right but the current version is Object-Oriented. See the
article: http://www.devx.com/webdev/Article/10007 written by the actual
developers of PHP.

Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Haslett, Andrew
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 7:49 PM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


PHP is not object orientated..

-----Original Message-----
From: Arthur Fuller [mailto:artful at rogers.com]
Sent: Wednesday, 30 July 2003 1:42 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


I'm pretty sure that is an accurate percentage. Why? Because far and away
the most popular web server on the market is Apache. No one else is even
close. Add to that the Linux factor (almost all large sites use Linux not
IIS), the ease of combining php and Linux (and MySQL, for data-driven
sites), and the cost factor, and it all adds up to a formidable combination.
Notice that Dreamweaver MX added support for
php+mySQL in the latest rev. Php is easy to learn and is object
oriented. There are free on-line courses and stuff available, too.

Not that I have any current clients who use this combination. Most are small
businesses and are afraid to go Linux, or even to combine Oses. But at home
I have one Linux-dedicated box and another Win2K Advanced Server that houses
an instance of both MySQL and SQL 2K, so I can run .NET from one workstation
and Apache/php/mySQL from another.

A.

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence
(AccessD)
Sent: July 29, 2003 1:18 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


Hi All:

I have seen a recent claim, have no way to validate it but the assertion
goes as follows: PHP as a server based web language now has almost forty
percent of the general market...

This claim seems outrageous but that would leave PHP holding the largest
single market share of that genre of products.

Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Marcus, Scott
(GEAE, Contractor)
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 10:00 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


John,

Thanks for your optimism on .Net. All I ever here are negative things about
MS products (which I make my living with). It is a good point you make about
being on the leading edge. I think the same way. I just get discouraged
cause very few tend to agree with that statement. It seems that most think
that software development will eventually be all off shore. I say that
moving off shore totally won't happen (small business needs physical
presence). JM2C

Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: jcolby at colbyconsulting.com [mailto:jcolby at colbyconsulting.com]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 12:49 PM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


Scott,

>My only doubts about .Net is that I'm not seeing very many job postings

>for
.Net developers (but allot more than Access development).

I am seeing more and more .net openings, at least more and more "ya need the
kitchen sink and oh, by the way, ya need .net too" ads.  I get the feeling
that not many companies really understand it yet - momentum. However my
feelings are that MS has spent a TON of money on developing the concept, and
are pushing .net big time.  If they put their muscle behind it, it won't be
long till it's a "requirement" to get a job and I want to be on the leading
edge of this one.  PLUS, the .net framework is truly impressive in the
capability it gives me "out of the box".

>You must have read the same article as me (actually editors comments).
>I'm
leaning VB.Net first and then adding C# to my skills. Seems silly to me that
C# pulls in more money.

Yea, it is silly considering the reality of the new .net environment. I'm
betting that it won't be long before managers start to listen to M$ saying
that any language is equally capable and stop paying more for C#. There are
still a very small handful of indirection capabilities that C# has that VB
doesn't, and if you need them then fine, go there. Otherwise VB is probably
faster to get something up and running in.

And finally, no, my framework has no equivalents in .net for the simple
reason that my framework is about making form development in Access easier
(even more RAD).  Since .net is so very different from Access, much of what
I do simply doesn't even make sense in .net.  For example, I have a function
in my framework that keeps a record selector combo synced to the form
(bound) and the form synced to the combo.  It turns out that in .net if you
set the form (or a data grid) and a combo to the same dataset, selecting a
record in the combo will just cause the two things to stay in sync (be on
the same record).  AFAICT, that is because the combo actually sets a
"current record" property in the dataset object.

Another example, in my framework I want to prevent the user from moving into
a subform if the main form goes to the new record.  .Net doesn't even HAVE
subforms.

Things like that.

I am in the process of rewriting something that would "make sense" to port -
my Sysvars.  Assuming that I leave my error handlers in place, that port is
really fairly straightforward.  However I don't really have much hope of
"just porting" my framework.  In the end though, there is enough work to be
done making .net as "database friendly" as Access that I am sure I will have
plenty of similar projects.

John W. Colby
www.colbyconsulting.com

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Marcus, Scott
(GEAE, Contractor)
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 12:03 PM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


John,

You must have read the same article as me (actually editors comments). I'm
leaning VB.Net first and then adding C# to my skills. Seems silly to me that
C# pulls in more money. Like you, that is why I'm going to learn it also.
Have you seen any silly job postings like "C# developer with 5 years
experience..."?

Have you found that your Access framework already has equivalents in .Net
framework?

I'm not far enough into .Net to have an opinion yet. I can say that if it is
similar to how Java works, I won't like it. I hear that C# is very close to
Java.

What I've learned in VB.Net so far seems pretty straight forward.

My only doubts about .Net is that I'm not seeing very many job postings for
.Net developers (but allot more than Access development).

Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: jcolby at colbyconsulting.com [mailto:jcolby at colbyconsulting.com]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 11:47 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD]OT: C# was no-ip.com


Scott,

Not yet, though I think I will end up there.  I'm thinking that learning
VB.Net and more importantly the .net framework FIRST will be most useful to
me.  The framework is massive and being comfortable with that is a
requirement regardless of the language you then use for your programming.

Once that is done I will probably move to C# for the simple reason that the
polls indicate C# programmers get better money.  I did a controller project
down in Mexico in a custom 'C' language so it isn't totally foreign.

Again though, the whole point of the .Net concept is that the framework
really provides about 90% of the functionality and it is used EXACTLY the
same regardless of the language you use.  The language itself is really a
thin veneer over the top of the framework.  Even things like variables are
framework objects so that any .net language can literally pass their
variables back and forth without the silly problems like you see with VB and
C not treating strings the same way.

John W. Colby
www.colbyconsulting.com

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