[AccessD] CBO Not In List

John Colby jcolby at colbyconsulting.com
Thu Oct 2 12:00:12 CDT 2003


That's true for data entry, but I am building a search combo for data that
is more than one field, thus a form has to open.

And my original solution isn't working for all instances.  8-(

John W. Colby
www.colbyconsulting.com

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Charlotte
Foust
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 12:51 PM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD] CBO Not In List


That's generally the way I handle it as well, although I may create the
basic new record from code and then pop up a form so they can add any
additional data that's needed if the situation warrants it.

Charlotte Foust

-----Original Message-----
From: Developer [mailto:Developer at ultradnt.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 8:41 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: RE: [AccessD] CBO Not In List


As a terrible typist, I agree with Charlotte.  I actually like that it
waits until you leave; in some apps I grab that "NewData", pop a msgbox,
and if the user responds yes, perform an insert of the NewData (avoiding
the input form) , grab the new id, re-query the cbo, and select the
newly added item.  If they answer No, I clear what they typed and drop
down the cbo.

Just my .02,
Steve


-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte
Foust
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 11:46 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD] CBO Not In List


Wouldn't that get annoying if someone was simply not a very good typist?
Waiting for the afterupdate event at least allows the user to correct
their typing errors.

Charlotte Foust

-----Original Message-----
From: John Colby [mailto:jcolby at colbyconsulting.com]
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 7:22 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: RE: [AccessD] CBO Not In List


>The behavior you propose would be more beneficial for combos that are
limited to list, enabling users to get early warning that their entry is
invalid or miskeyed.

Precisely, and that is what I was trying to say.  If the properties for
LimitToList and AutoExpand are set true, then some event (LimitToList?)
should IMMEDIATELY fire if the user is no longer matching data in the
combo. In fact it only seems to fire if the user attempts to LEAVE the
combo and the data doesn't match something in the list.  Seems silly to
me to not fire immediately.

John W. Colby
www.colbyconsulting.com

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Henry Simpson
Sent: Thursday, October 02, 2003 11:05 AM
To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: Re: [AccessD] CBO Not In List


I have implemented a similar scheme based on a callback combo source.
When the form initially loads, it opens with a narrow set of values and
as items are  not found in the list, the combo is repopulated with a
progressively wider range of possible values.  The logic behind the
method was that users spent over 95% of their time working on active
records but occasionally needed to look up records that might become
active, records that have been closed and records that have been
archived all from a single lookup.  It the item ulimately was 'not in
list', the procedure allowed for adding the item.
  The approach allowed for checking a single record 'current' flag for
each globally available list source meaning that the data was all cached
locally and only refreshed when a single record time stamp indicated the
necessity resulting in a drastic reduction in overall LAN congestion.

I disagree with your statement that the combo should beep when a not in
list is discovered.  One of the parameters for the not in list is the
contents of the combo when the list fires and I always use this
parameter to populate fields in the new record.  It would be very
annoying to users accustomed to entering new records in a combo to have
it beep 30 or 50 times at them as they add new records.  I believe that
the purpose of the implementation of the event is to allow users to
enter new records directly into the combo rather than notify them to get
out, yet still use the combo as a record locator.

The counter argument to allowing such easy entry of new items is that
miskeyed or misspelled text strings are easily accidentally entered as
duplicate records but it is possible to use the same, 'as you type'
record checking routine to search for likely matches and for the
ultimate not in list event to first pop a list of soundex matches from
which to choose before permitting the addition of the record.  None of
my data entry forms have a 'new record' button as I make them search/add
new records via combo boxes exclusively.  I also find it peculiar that
those who argue that misspellings and the ease of adding new records in
this fashion makes for the liklihood of accidental duplicate records, it
is just as easy for a person to punch the new record button on a data
entry form and never see whether the record had been previously entered.
Also, the use of a single record table flag to indicate that records
have been edited or added ensures that if the possiblity exists of
multiple users getting the same data concurrently and each adding the
same record since there combo was last filled is greatly reduced.

The behaviour you propose would be more beneficial for combos that are
limited to list, enabling users to get early warning that their entry is
invalid or miskeyed.

Hen

>From: "John Colby" <jcolby at colbyconsulting.com>
>Reply-To: Access Developers discussion and problem
>solving<accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
>To: "AccessD" <AccessD at databaseadvisors.com>
>Subject: [AccessD] CBO Not In List
>Date: Thu, 2 Oct 2003 09:29:40 -0400
>
>I want to use the NotInList to open an initial data entry form if the
>person searched for isn't in the database, else open a tabbed form if
>they are.  I have this working using NotInList to open the IDE form and

>the after update to open the tabbed form to the record of the person
>found in the combo.
>
>However, what I want to do now is to have the combo start beeping as
>the person types if the item is not in the list.  IOW, NotInList only
>fires as the user EXITS the combo and the item is not in the list.
>However if the user is typing in a person's name - JOHN COLBY, and by
>the time she types the O in COLBY the combo is not finding the name,
>the combo should start beeping so that the user is notified to stop
>typing and tab out to trigger NotInList and open the data entry form -
>or even programatically tab out and trigger the NotInList.
>
>It seems like it could be accomplished by checking the insertion point
>and the length of the data in the combo.  If the data exists, the
>insertion point is in the middle of the data that the combo is
>following, whereas as soon as the data is not found, the insertion
>point is at the end of the data.  IOW, if the insertion point is at the

>end of the data TWICE, then we are at a true "not found" and trigger
>NotInList.  In fact it seems like the combo should have been built this

>way to begin with.
>
>Has anyone ever done this?
>
>John W. Colby
>www.colbyconsulting.com

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