[AccessD] Performance tips anyone?

Charlotte Foust cfoust at infostatsystems.com
Thu Jul 5 12:08:48 CDT 2007


I just KNEW you wouldn't be able to resist that comment, John!  LOL

I agree with you thought (mostly).  I made heavy use of unbound forms
and controls in Access, and it was easier for me to switch to .Net than
it might be for some.  However, I still think every Access wannabe
should learn how to deal with unbound objects as well, and not simply
use the cookie cutter bound approach. 

Charlotte Foust


-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of jwcolby
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 9:30 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Performance tips anyone?

Jim,

>You mentioning this will not cause near the stir as it did 10 years ago

>as
most (all?) have now accepted the reality. ;-)

LOL, no not quite.  Access is a tool built from the ground up for bound.
To even discuss unbound for Access NOW, when much more robust unbound
tools are available is ... well... kinda silly.  Unless of course you
have been doing unbound with Access for the last 10 years in which case
you have the expertise to do so.  Telling the average Access nubee to
use Access unbound is IMHO a disservice to the nubee.  He might as well
just go learn VB.Net.

As for me, if I need unbound it will be in VB.Net, NOT in Access (and I
am not an Access nubee).

The right tool for the job so to speak.   


John W. Colby
Colby Consulting
www.ColbyConsulting.com
-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:13 PM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Performance tips anyone?

Yes, Drew you have hit on the key to performance... 'unbound'. 

You mentioning this will not cause near the stir as it did 10 years ago
as most (all?) have now accepted the reality. ;-)

Jim     

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Drew Wutka
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 8:52 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Performance tips anyone?

It narrows down to a few factors:

Backend Design (well indexed and normalized) Front End Design (Hit and
run designs, don't stay connected to the backend unless you have too)
Network Speed (far more important then hardware speed/memory.  Sure, the
more your interface leans on the processor/ram, the more you need CPU
speed and ram, but for actual database work, the network speed and
server hard drive access time are far more criticl)

Did I mention 'unbound'.

Of course, most of these concerns go out the window when using a web
based interface with the .mdb running locally.... ;)

Drew

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of jwcolby
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:43 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Performance tips anyone?

Anita,

>You are very brave

It doesn't feel that way.  Access works very well for what it does.

>A form will open fast if designed well.

You are right there.  You can grind everything to a halt by trying to
use bound forms pulling tens of thousands of records.  I had to go to
the "single record" thing for this form, but it worked and worked well.

>You can keep throwing hardware at Access applications to will make them
perform faster. The real trick is to get your database to perform fast
regardless.

That is just a silly thing to say.  Try getting a modern real database
running on an old 100 mhz machine with 64 meg.  You have to face facts
and the facts are that the machine makes the difference.  A modern
machine can be had for peanuts from Dell.  If the business owner is
complaining that his Celeron 1ghz machines running 256 megs of ram,
windows 98 and Access 2000 is running slow.... My only response will
be... "and your point is?"

I use a framework which makes it very easy for me to do things like time
form openings and log what machine is doing the opening.  I showed my
client that his users complaining about slow databases were ALL on slow
machines.
And yep, he is buying new modern "workstations", a few a month, to get
rid of the old junk he was running with.  And the users have quit
complaining.

Sorry, facts is facts.  You can index till the cows come home but that
is never going to fly on ancient hardware.  Now, you can certainly move
the whole shooting match to a modern server running Windows server 2003
and SQl Server and pay through the nose for that machine, OS and SQL
Server, and then pay through the nose for SQL Server and OS notworking
experts.
That is
certainly an option.  Or you can update your workstations for less money
and have good performance for many (MANY) more than 10-12 users.  

And no, I am not arguing that an MDB is the solution for hundreds of
users but 10-12 users?  C'mon!

John W. Colby
Colby Consulting
www.ColbyConsulting.com
-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Anita Smith
Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2007 12:57 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Performance tips anyone?

John,
My comments in line:

 Errrrr!  Wrong answer.

I have a database with 25 users in the database every day.  The BE is
currently about 800 mbytes.  This BE has tables with hundreds of
thousands of records in some tables, 30K-50K records in the main tables
(claimant / claim).  I open a VERY complex tabbed form with about 20
tabs on it, with subforms on each tab (JIT subforms).
***************************************
You are very brave
***************************************
I open a VERY complex tabbed form with about 20 tabs on it, with
subforms on each tab (JIT subforms).

Users on fast machines open the form in about 1.2 seconds.  Users on
very old slow machines take about 5 to 6 seconds.
***************************************
A form will open fast if designed well.
***************************************

Speed of the individual workstation is the single largest determinate of
acceptable speed.  A high speed processor and LOTS of memory (1 gig for
Windows XP Pro) are essential.  Moving to a 1 gbit lan made a big
difference as well (which requires a gigabit NIC in the machines as
well).
***************************************
You can keep throwing hardware at Access applications to will make them
perform faster. The real trick is to get your database to perform fast
regardless.
***************************************

Anita
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