[AccessD] Deploying Runtime

Charlotte Foust cfoust at infostatsystems.com
Tue Jan 26 18:36:15 CST 2010


You've been incredibly lucky then, Reuben.  I gave up on the wizard around Access 2.0 and switched to InstallShield to get done what I needed.  I found the wizard in 97 and 2000 no improvement.

Charlotte Foust

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Reuben Cummings
Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 6:58 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime

I hate to leave what continues to work...

Still running A2000.  Have always used the built in Package and Deployment
Wizard without failure.
And my installs co-exist with other versions of Access without trouble.
Newer versions are installed in folders numbered to indicate their version
and the runtime will install in a folder named ART.
The only problem, which I have never had, is that the user has A2000 at
installation time so runtime does not install and the user then upgrades and
removes 2000 in the process.

Reuben Cummings
GFC, LLC
812.523.1017


> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Andy Lacey
> Sent: Monday, January 25, 2010 4:06 PM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
>
> Given that I'm going to have to move to a newer version of
> Access in order
> to get some solid deployment tool can someone remind me which
> are the good,
> the bad and the ugly Access versions since, say, A2000?
>
>
> Andy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
> Sent: 24 January 2010 23:18
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
>
> Hi Andy,
> Have used Wise/Sagekey for years now and was the answer to
> all of these
> issues. Now, as Doug mentioned, Wise recommends theirs MSI
> Script rather
> than their Wise scrip. This is because Wise had been bought
> by two companies
> in the last couple of years. The first was committed to it -
> the second is
> Symantec and they seem to have no desire to carry on the Wise
> installer
> excellence. (Is that a surprise to anyone?)
>
> Given my experiences with Barry and the Sagekey group I'd
> highly recommend
> you contact them for all of your installers needs.
>
> John B
> PS I get no kickbacks from this ;o)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Doug Murphy
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 12:25 PM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> Hello Andy,
>
> With the scripts for Wise or Instalshield you had to purchase
> either Wise or
> Instalshield and then purchase the script that Sagekey
> developed to creat
> the installation package with which ever install package you
> had. I am not
> familiar with the MSI product but Sagekey indicated in one of
> their mailings
> that this was the approach to use now. Their wizard may use
> this technology
> to create the installation package. As I indicate, I have not
> used it so
> can't comment. I only have experience with the script for
> Wise Installer 9.
> I do have faith in Sagekey products to produce reliable installation
> packages which ever one you choose.
>
>
> Doug
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Andy Lacey
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2010 2:08 AM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> That's encourgaing Doug. I'm a little unclear though what I'd
> be buying from
> here http://www.sagekey.com/installation_access.aspx . You
> speak of Sagekey
> scripts. Is that different from the Sagekey Deployment Wizard
> then? I had
> assumed the wizard was a tool they supplied to generate the
> scripts but
> maybe not. If I click "Buy" on that link am I buying the
> ability to use
> either method?
>
> Andy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Doug Murphy
> Sent: 23 January 2010 20:30
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
>
> Andy,
>
> We are still using the Access 2002 runtime with Wise and the
> most current
> Sagekey scripts that take into account Vista, and I assume
> Win. 07 security
> issues. We have stayed with 2002 because that is where our
> investment is and
> don't need any of the new features. We have not had any
> issues with Vista
> installs or with installs of our package in Windows 07. The
> reason for using
> the Sagekey scripts is that then your application can run on
> a machine with
> other versions of Office installed and not cause the issue with Office
> trying to reinstall every time you run another version of one of its
> applications. The scripts also install all the runtime stuff
> in a separate
> directory so they don't get overwritten or interfere with
> anything else.
> Just be aware that they accomplish the compatiblity stuff by
> opening your
> application through a little program called runAccess.exe, in
> our version
> anyway. This takes care of registry settings, security and
> what ever else
> needs tweeking. The shortcut their installation puts on the
> desktop goes to
> this program with the proper keys, etc. If you look at the
> shortcut you can
> figure out what it does.
>
> There have been issues with the Access installation wizard in
> past versions.
> Not sure if that is true now.
>
> Doug
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Andy Lacey
> Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 12:00 PM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> Now I'm getting worried. Will the "Sagekey Access 2007
> Deployment Wizard"
> install my app on any machine, whatever its OS, and whether or not it
> already has Access installed? Oh and if it does already have
> Access will it
> behave itself and not upset the existing installation?
>
> If I can't guarantee that it's a non-starter.
>
> Rocky, you must have this issue with your product. Do all of
> your installs
> run smoothly or do some get problems?
>
> Andy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Robert
> Sent: 23 January 2010 19:39
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
>
> Rocky,
>
>   That's part of it, and a big one, but they also handle the
> permission
> system issues very well also..
>
> Yea the Sagekey Access 2007 Deployment Wizard works well, but
> it is not
> ANYWHERE near as flexible as the Wise / Sagekey solution,
> which is of course
> not recommended for Windows 7 (and for me Vista) Installations.
>
> They have also chosen, IMO, some really odd default path
> structures for
> Windows XP installations. (They choose the "C:\Documents and
> Settings\All
> Users\AppData\....." for the <COMMON_APP_DATA> Variable).
> Which in my case
> will not work because the string that is created is too long
> for a windows
> desktop shortcut.
>
> I've talked with them about it, and suggested that they make
> the Windows XP
> location user adjustable, but they claim that it will destroy the
> foundations of programming and won't make the change.. I keep
> saying it
> won't make one bit a difference on a Windows XP installation,
> but alas they
> won't budge... :-)
>
> They are currently working on their 2010 version.
>
>
> WBR
> Robert
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
> Rocky Smolin
> Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 2:16 PM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> Sounds like I may be a bit behind the curve on Sagekey's
> product line.  Doug
> says you can use their script for MSI - but IIRC there's some
> problem with
> MSI that the Wise/Sagekey combo finesses and I think it has to do with
> multiple version of Access on the same box with the run time
> or perhaps any
> version of Access and the runtime coexisting.  But I can't
> remember exactly.
>
> R
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Andy Lacey
> Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 9:32 AM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> Ok, so I need Sagekey to create the script (wow, lot of money
> for a script!)
> and then Wise to do the actual install. Clear. And you say
> Sagekey provides
> the Access runtime files too? So, I develop my Access system
> as normal and
> need nothing other then Sagekey and Wise to deploy it. Is
> that right? Then
> my 'only' problem is that I don't have a version of Access
> later than 2002!
> Damn.
>
> Andy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
> Rocky Smolin
> Sent: 23 January 2010 16:55
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
>
> Andy:
>
> Yeah you still need Wise.  I believe Sagekey supplies you with all the
> Access files you need.  Mostly those run-time files are stuff
> in Access
> already.  The runtime, IIUC, is a subset of Access - just the
> stuff you need
> to run an mdb or mde without the files you need to do development - no
> design view of anything.
>
> The script you buy from Sagekey is a Wise script and like a
> template - very
> well commented so you can easily modify it for your own
> purposes.  I was
> able to do it with a bit of help from their tech support - which is
> excellent, BTW - and didn't really have to learn the Wise scripting
> language.
>
> I have the script for 2003.  I think they'll still sell it.
>
> Doug Murphy also is a user of the Wise/Sagekey combo and he can answer
> questions probably better than I.
>
> Rocky
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Andy Lacey
> Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 8:13 AM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> Thanks Rocky
> I've been to the Sagekey site
> http://www.sagekey.com/installation_access.aspx . The Lite
> and Pro versions
> appear to be complete installers which bypass the need for
> Access Deployment
> but presumably you still nned the Access Runtime. But you
> still need Wise,
> right? Sorry to be dense but can you briefly take me through
> what I need and
> the steps involved in building an installation?
>
>
> I also note they refer to a single license for Access 2007.
> What if I'm
> using an earlier version of Access? Any idea?
>
> Andy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
> Rocky Smolin
> Sent: 23 January 2010 14:59
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
>
> I have used the Wise/Sagekey combo for years with no
> problems.  For that
> many installs it's probably well worth the bucks.
>
> Rocky
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Andy Lacey
> Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 6:42 AM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: [AccessD] Deploying Runtime
>
> Hi all
> I know this has been kicked around before so apoogies for
> raising it again
> but time's moved on so the current situation may have too.
> Anyway, a quick
> look at the the archives didn't illuminate me.
>
> I'm proposing to take an app written in Excel and rewrite it
> in Access.
> Problem is that it will need distributing to 200+ machines
> Europe-wide, most
> of which won't have Access. Now I haven't used Access Runtime
> for about 15
> years so am well out-of-date and could do with an update. I guess my
> questions are;
>
> 1. Any chance of me getting hold of whatever's needed (Access
> Developer
> Edition is it?) to create runtimes for older versions (Access
> 2000, 2002)?
>
> Have in fact just looked and there's a copy of "Microsoft Office 2000
> Developer Tools for PC" on ebay in UK. Is that what I need?
> There's a copy
> of "Microsoft Office XP 2002 Developer 269-04560 COMMERCIAL"
> too. Is that
> the 2002 equivalent? If I buy either/both of these am I
> getting the right
> software?
>
> 2.If I get those is that all I need? I've seen a post on a
> forum which says,
> and I quote:
> "There can definitely be conflicts when installing ART to
> machines with full
> versions of Access. I use the 2002 ART and deploy those apps
> with the Wise
> Installer and use Sagekey scripts (www.sagekey.com) ... this script is
> designed specificially to install my application with the ART
> on a machine
> with an exisiting version of Access so that they can both
> co-exist. They're
> not cheap - the scripts are around $400 USD, the Wise
> installer runs between
> $400-$1000 USD - but they make your life a lot easier. Since
> switching to
> these scripts and the Wise Installer, my support calls for
> installation have
> been reduced to almost nothing; "
>
> Do others back up this experience?
>
> Id appreciate you guys' wise advice as always.
>
> Andy
>
>
>
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