[AccessD] New SQL Server license scheme is RADICALLLY moreexpensive

Hans-Christian Andersen hans.andersen at phulse.com
Wed Nov 16 17:40:15 CST 2011


Jim,

Wow, it happened again, eh?

- Hans


On 2011-11-16, at 3:29 PM, jwcolby wrote:

> I absolutely agree.  MS has a lot of nerve assuming that they can reboot any server without permission.
> 
> John W. Colby
> Colby Consulting
> 
> Reality is what refuses to go away
> when you do not believe in it
> 
> On 11/16/2011 5:18 PM, Jim Lawrence wrote:
>> Hi John:
>> 
>> One example, last weekend that particularly annoyed me was that my Server
>> 2008 rebooted without asking. It had been set that upgrades were manual but
>> through some MS Update that setting was modified.
>> 
>> I am sure the server was prompting me with a reboot, in ten minutes type
>> request, but I was not there to observe it so the server rebooted. I have a
>> MSSQL running on the box and it of course disconnected from my web server.
>> It was not until a client and friend called saying he could not see his data
>> that I knew anything was wrong.
>> 
>>> From my perspective, unless that box is on fire it should not reboot...and
>> it had better not install updates without my explicit agreement.
>> 
>> Jim
>> 
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of jwcolby
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2011 10:33 AM
>> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] New SQL Server license scheme is RADICALLLY
>> moreexpensive
>> 
>>  >With Windows, it is constantly rebooting after updates and if left alone
>> for too long it will
>> start acting strangely and need to be rebooted.
>> 
>> I certainly don't find this to be true.  Windows is much better about
>> "needing to reboot after
>> updates" though that certainly still happens upon occasion, but my Windows
>> Server 2008 and SQL
>> Server 2008 runs for months on end without a reboot.
>> 
>> One day I will be building a multi-core mega server to run Linux and a MySQL
>> variant.  Then I will
>> truly see how it goes.  I entirely expect for it to "just work", or as much
>> so as any system can expect.
>> 
>> John W. Colby
>> Colby Consulting
>> 
>> Reality is what refuses to go away
>> when you do not believe in it
>> 
>> On 11/16/2011 12:16 PM, Jim Lawrence wrote:
>>> Hi Shamil:
>>> 
>>> The TCO is an old and out of date concept. The phase was used when Linux
>> had
>>> no GUI and most of its configuration had to be done at the command prompt.
>>> Linux products are now much more mature than they were in the late
>> nineties
>>> when the phrase was coined. Note; just like any Windows or Linux, it
>>> sometimes requires you go under the hood but not for a basic or standard
>>> configuration.
>>> 
>>> If a person is fully skilled at either Windows serversxx, IISx, SQL 20xx
>>> they can set up an operational system in a very short time but OTOH, this
>> is
>>> also true for some person versed in Debian Linux sever (with Ubuntu Linux
>>> desktop), Apache and MySQL. Both the high end products are fully 64 bit
>> and
>>> capable of managing multi-core processes. (The current Debian server OS
>> has
>>> the capability to use a petabyte of memory, 128 to 256 cores(?) and could
>>> host over 10,000 users...it will take many years before the hardware
>> catches
>>> up.)
>>> 
>>> I would think that it would take the same amount of time for the basic
>>> configuration of both.
>>> 
>>> This is also true for a station whether Windows7 or Ubuntu Linux 11.x. All
>>> will have the standard group of applications. Full Office, communications,
>>> music and video players, full networking, full list of internet products
>> and
>>> on and on. Both Systems are incredible simple to setup, both systems have
>>> regular updates and both are easy to use and navigate around in and any
>> user
>>> can get use to using either as they are very similar.
>>> 
>>> I would think that it would take the same amount of time for the basic
>>> configuration of both.
>>> 
>>> I have worked for years with various versions of Oracle and to install it
>> is
>>> relatively easy. OTOH, to really optimize the DB you have to go in a tweak
>>> it very carefully to hardware and user requirements. In MSSQL, most(many)
>> of
>>> these features are automated. Is that good or not, I do not know but MySQL
>>> can be the same. Many people just install and run it, as is but it can be
>>> tweaked to any requirement but like Oracle that takes a bit of training
>> and
>>> investigation. Is that potential a plus or minus to the novice?
>>> 
>>> If you have a problem with either MSSQL or MySQL or Linux or Windows there
>>> are plenty of books, Forums and blog sites with everything you will ever
>>> need to know. OTOH, if you have a serious melt down with in either Windows
>>> or Linux environment there is always an expert as close as the phone to
>>> help...and it is pay as you go...so much per incident.
>>> 
>>> Therefore, in summary as far as I can see, there is no difference in TOC.
>>> The only cost is in how much time it takes to become an expert in either
>> or
>>> in both and how much the initial products cost.
>>> 
>>> Some other points to consider:
>>> 1. Linux is a very rugged product (it will run for years with little or no
>>> intervention). With Windows, it is constantly rebooting after updates and
>> if
>>> left alone for too long it will start acting strangely and need to be
>>> rebooted. (20+ years from NT to 2008 server and still the same...at least
>> it
>>> is consistent.) 2. Almost no malware can survive in the Linux environment.
>>> 3. The Linux footprint is very small. (About a third the size of Windows?)
>>> 4. Bugs in Open Source products can take days to fix while in proprietary
>>> products they may take years, if ever. A single OS product can have 1000
>>> contributors while I would suspect much fewer resources for the equivalent
>>> Windows products.
>>> 5. Linux can out perform Windows on a computer with much less resources.
>>> 
>>> Does this mean I am recommending everyone just abandon Window...hardly.
>> They
>>> are the current standard and many of our clients use Windows products but
>>> OTOH I would suggest that every IT guy, who is planning to be around for
>> the
>>> next ten to twenty years, become familiar with Linux as well.
>>> 
>>> Jim
>>> 
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