From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Wed Apr 1 11:07:53 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 09:07:53 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Message-ID: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky From jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk Wed Apr 1 11:31:34 2015 From: jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk (James Button) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 17:31:34 +0100 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Thinking around your problem: You need to assemble a list of all persons that are not in a list of persons with the selected mailing list It seems to me that you will need to go for the list of persons in the mailing list with that ID first, and then from a list of all the persons, exclude all persons that are in that list. Maybe select from a list of all persons with marker to indicate they have the mailing list ID associated with them, or they don't have that list id And then extract from that Left - inner outer joins - whatever JimB -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 5:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From jerbach.db at gmail.com Wed Apr 1 11:33:10 2015 From: jerbach.db at gmail.com (Janet Erbach) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 11:33:10 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Rocky - Can all that really be done in one query? I have always broken down something like that into 2 steps... Janet On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 11:07 AM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit > of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID > FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people > not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to > the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from > tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a > person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as > well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out > anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's > selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to > populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Wed Apr 1 11:47:22 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 09:47:22 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: I've also used queries in queries. Very useful technique. And I've tried a couple of approaches that way as well in this case. Tried the unmatched query wiz. But when a thing gets too snaky with queries I just write a bit of code to do it. So either it's a brain fart or I'm going the code route. Code route is real easy but as there will be a couple thousand persons in the person table I don't want to have the delay when the user selects the list to be displayed or selects one of the options in the option frame 1) all 2) only list member, 3) only Not Members. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 9:33 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Rocky - Can all that really be done in one query? I have always broken down something like that into 2 steps... Janet On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 11:07 AM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > code to populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk Wed Apr 1 11:58:50 2015 From: jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk (James Button) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 17:58:50 +0100 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: If you can specify a limit to the number of mailing ID's that can be associated with any person, then you could, perhaps go for the non-normalised view And/or if the number of possible lists is not excessively large, maybe assign the lists numeric references and associate them with positional markers in a text string associated with the person, so each person has a marker string that can include all the ID's Remembering that a lot of the BD theory is based on constrained storage resources of a few years ago, and far slower I/O into much smaller memory allocations for searching with slower CPU's - So do you really need to have the data normalised to reduce space usage JimB -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 5:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query I've also used queries in queries. Very useful technique. And I've tried a couple of approaches that way as well in this case. Tried the unmatched query wiz. But when a thing gets too snaky with queries I just write a bit of code to do it. So either it's a brain fart or I'm going the code route. Code route is real easy but as there will be a couple thousand persons in the person table I don't want to have the delay when the user selects the list to be displayed or selects one of the options in the option frame 1) all 2) only list member, 3) only Not Members. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 9:33 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Rocky - Can all that really be done in one query? I have always broken down something like that into 2 steps... Janet On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 11:07 AM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > code to populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Wed Apr 1 12:03:55 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 10:03:55 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: <2E644367292E4C30B776339B9894CCAE@HAL9007> Probably not but the schema's pretty simple here - the both FKs in the connecting table are indexed. I think I'll go the code route. Already spent an hour trying to construct a query or queries to do this - which I really can't charge the client for. Code probably take half as long. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of James Button Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 9:59 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query If you can specify a limit to the number of mailing ID's that can be associated with any person, then you could, perhaps go for the non-normalised view And/or if the number of possible lists is not excessively large, maybe assign the lists numeric references and associate them with positional markers in a text string associated with the person, so each person has a marker string that can include all the ID's Remembering that a lot of the BD theory is based on constrained storage resources of a few years ago, and far slower I/O into much smaller memory allocations for searching with slower CPU's - So do you really need to have the data normalised to reduce space usage JimB -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 5:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query I've also used queries in queries. Very useful technique. And I've tried a couple of approaches that way as well in this case. Tried the unmatched query wiz. But when a thing gets too snaky with queries I just write a bit of code to do it. So either it's a brain fart or I'm going the code route. Code route is real easy but as there will be a couple thousand persons in the person table I don't want to have the delay when the user selects the list to be displayed or selects one of the options in the option frame 1) all 2) only list member, 3) only Not Members. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 9:33 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Rocky - Can all that really be done in one query? I have always broken down something like that into 2 steps... Janet On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 11:07 AM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another > mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > code to populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Wed Apr 1 12:32:13 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 17:32:13 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Wed Apr 1 13:47:19 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 11:47:19 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Wed Apr 1 14:08:33 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 19:08:33 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov Wed Apr 1 14:34:23 2015 From: DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov (McGillivray, Don) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 19:34:23 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Also, if necessary: Not In/In () Such as . . . Where Format(Table.SomeDate,"ddd") in("Mon","Wed","Fri") -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Wed Apr 1 15:06:05 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 20:06:05 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Yup. Use that too, but within Access it's quite easy to hit the limit of 2000 characters in an SQL string. Not an issue with a pass-through query though. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 3:34 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Also, if necessary: Not In/In () Such as . . . Where Format(Table.SomeDate,"ddd") in("Mon","Wed","Fri") -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From bensonforums at gmail.com Wed Apr 1 16:16:24 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 17:16:24 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: This could also work, perhaps if tweaked correctly. SELECT A.ID, A.STREMAIL, A.STRFIRSTNAME, A.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons as A WHERE Not Exists (select B.ID from tblMailingListPersons as B where B.MailListID=1 and A.ID = B.FKPersonID) This assumes that tblPersons.ID is represented in tblMailingListPersons as FKPersonID, and that the field ID is the PK of each respective table. I have aliased the table names in honor of Lambert's comment about SQL string length limitations :-D On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd > think I'd know pretty much the whole language. > > I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert > > R > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Heenan, Lambert > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub > query on the user ID. Like this > > SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, > tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In > (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where > tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); > > (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the > where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form > where the mail list is chosen. > > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Rocky Smolin > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit > of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID > FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people > not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to > the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from > tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a > person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as > well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out > anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's > selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to > populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov Wed Apr 1 17:14:23 2015 From: DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov (McGillivray, Don) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2015 22:14:23 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Surprised by a limit of 2k characters, I searched and found the following relevant to Access 2010: https://support.office.com/en-za/article/Access-2010-specifications-1e521481-7f9a-46f7-8ed9-ea9dff1fa854 "Number of characters in an SQL statement Approximately 64,000* *Maximum values might be lower if the query includes multivalued lookup fields." Earlier versions may have had lower limits, but let's hope that 2010 and beyond are at least as much as this. This particular spec relates to Query objects. Does anybody know if a similar limit exists for SQL that's built and executed in code? Just wondering if there may be a difference. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bill Benson Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:16 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query This could also work, perhaps if tweaked correctly. SELECT A.ID, A.STREMAIL, A.STRFIRSTNAME, A.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons as A WHERE Not Exists (select B.ID from tblMailingListPersons as B where B.MailListID=1 and A.ID = B.FKPersonID) This assumes that tblPersons.ID is represented in tblMailingListPersons as FKPersonID, and that the field ID is the PK of each respective table. I have aliased the table names in honor of Lambert's comment about SQL string length limitations :-D On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd > think I'd know pretty much the whole language. > > I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert > > R > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Heenan, Lambert > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a > sub query on the user ID. Like this > > SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, > tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In > (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where > tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); > > (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to > replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a > reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. > > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Rocky Smolin > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > code to populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Thu Apr 2 07:45:00 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 12:45:00 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Interesting. I could swear I hit the limit recently with a large, comma delimited In() clause which would not run in JET but was OK as pass-through query. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 6:14 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Surprised by a limit of 2k characters, I searched and found the following relevant to Access 2010: https://support.office.com/en-za/article/Access-2010-specifications-1e521481-7f9a-46f7-8ed9-ea9dff1fa854 "Number of characters in an SQL statement Approximately 64,000* *Maximum values might be lower if the query includes multivalued lookup fields." Earlier versions may have had lower limits, but let's hope that 2010 and beyond are at least as much as this. This particular spec relates to Query objects. Does anybody know if a similar limit exists for SQL that's built and executed in code? Just wondering if there may be a difference. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bill Benson Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:16 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query This could also work, perhaps if tweaked correctly. SELECT A.ID, A.STREMAIL, A.STRFIRSTNAME, A.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons as A WHERE Not Exists (select B.ID from tblMailingListPersons as B where B.MailListID=1 and A.ID = B.FKPersonID) This assumes that tblPersons.ID is represented in tblMailingListPersons as FKPersonID, and that the field ID is the PK of each respective table. I have aliased the table names in honor of Lambert's comment about SQL string length limitations :-D On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd > think I'd know pretty much the whole language. > > I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert > > R > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Heenan, Lambert > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a > sub query on the user ID. Like this > > SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, > tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In > (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where > tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); > > (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to > replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a > reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. > > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Rocky Smolin > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > code to populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Thu Apr 2 07:50:24 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 12:50:24 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: Just checked with a very simple query and the limit I hit was a 1024 character limit for the Query By Design grid. The query runs, but can only be viewed as SQL in design mode. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:45 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Interesting. I could swear I hit the limit recently with a large, comma delimited In() clause which would not run in JET but was OK as pass-through query. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 6:14 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Surprised by a limit of 2k characters, I searched and found the following relevant to Access 2010: https://support.office.com/en-za/article/Access-2010-specifications-1e521481-7f9a-46f7-8ed9-ea9dff1fa854 "Number of characters in an SQL statement Approximately 64,000* *Maximum values might be lower if the query includes multivalued lookup fields." Earlier versions may have had lower limits, but let's hope that 2010 and beyond are at least as much as this. This particular spec relates to Query objects. Does anybody know if a similar limit exists for SQL that's built and executed in code? Just wondering if there may be a difference. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bill Benson Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:16 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query This could also work, perhaps if tweaked correctly. SELECT A.ID, A.STREMAIL, A.STRFIRSTNAME, A.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons as A WHERE Not Exists (select B.ID from tblMailingListPersons as B where B.MailListID=1 and A.ID = B.FKPersonID) This assumes that tblPersons.ID is represented in tblMailingListPersons as FKPersonID, and that the field ID is the PK of each respective table. I have aliased the table names in honor of Lambert's comment about SQL string length limitations :-D On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Rocky Smolin wrote: > Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd > think I'd know pretty much the whole language. > > I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert > > R > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Heenan, Lambert > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a > sub query on the user ID. Like this > > SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, > tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In > (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where > tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); > > (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to > replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a > reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. > > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Rocky Smolin > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Dear List: > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > I have > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > used the > criteria: > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > code to populate the temp table. > > MTIA > > Rocky > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From bensonforums at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 08:14:14 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 09:14:14 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: So the 1024 limit is by "design" hehe. But the increased the limit for those who SQueaLed. On Apr 2, 2015 8:52 AM, "Heenan, Lambert" wrote: > Just checked with a very simple query and the limit I hit was a 1024 > character limit for the Query By Design grid. The query runs, but can only > be viewed as SQL in design mode. > > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Heenan, Lambert > Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:45 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Interesting. I could swear I hit the limit recently with a large, comma > delimited In() clause which would not run in JET but was OK as pass-through > query. > > Lambert > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > McGillivray, Don > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 6:14 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Surprised by a limit of 2k characters, I searched and found the following > relevant to Access 2010: > > > https://support.office.com/en-za/article/Access-2010-specifications-1e521481-7f9a-46f7-8ed9-ea9dff1fa854 > > "Number of characters in an SQL statement Approximately 64,000* > > *Maximum values might be lower if the query includes multivalued lookup > fields." > > Earlier versions may have had lower limits, but let's hope that 2010 and > beyond are at least as much as this. > > This particular spec relates to Query objects. Does anybody know if a > similar limit exists for SQL that's built and executed in code? Just > wondering if there may be a difference. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Bill Benson > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:16 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > This could also work, perhaps if tweaked correctly. > > SELECT A.ID, A.STREMAIL, A.STRFIRSTNAME, A.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons as > A WHERE Not Exists (select B.ID from tblMailingListPersons as B > where B.MailListID=1 and A.ID = B.FKPersonID) > > This assumes that tblPersons.ID is represented in tblMailingListPersons as > FKPersonID, and that the field ID is the PK of each respective table. > > I have aliased the table names in honor of Lambert's comment about SQL > string length limitations :-D On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 2:47 PM, Rocky Smolin < > rockysmolin at bchacc.com> wrote: > > > Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd > > think I'd know pretty much the whole language. > > > > I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert > > > > R > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > > Of Heenan, Lambert > > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM > > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > > > You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a > > sub query on the user ID. Like this > > > > SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, > > tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In > > (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where > > tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); > > > > (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to > > replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a > > reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. > > > > > > Lambert > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > > Of Rocky Smolin > > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM > > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > > Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > > > Dear List: > > > > I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a > > bit of code and am having some difficulty. > > > > I have > > 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), > > 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and > > 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons > > ID FK. Pretty standard stuff > > > > So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. > > > > I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the > > people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can > > assign them to the selected mailing list. > > > > So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records > > from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and > > used the > > criteria: > > > > MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. > > > > This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if > > a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this > > list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria > > filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). > > > > I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the > > user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing > list. > > > > And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some > > code to populate the temp table. > > > > MTIA > > > > Rocky > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From jwcolby at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 09:09:19 2015 From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John W. Colby) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2015 10:09:19 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: <551D4D8F.8000001@gmail.com> Using a sql string in a source property of a control or form is where I always ran into issues. No idea whether that is now opened up beyond 2K characters. John W. Colby On 4/2/2015 8:45 AM, Heenan, Lambert wrote: > Interesting. I could swear I hit the limit recently with a large, comma delimited In() clause which would not run in JET but was OK as pass-through query. > > Lambert > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don > Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 6:14 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query > > Surprised by a limit of 2k characters, I searched and found the following relevant to Access 2010: > > https://support.office.com/en-za/article/Access-2010-specifications-1e521481-7f9a-46f7-8ed9-ea9dff1fa854 > > "Number of characters in an SQL statement Approximately 64,000* > > *Maximum values might be lower if the query includes multivalued lookup fields." > > Earlier versions may have had lower limits, but let's hope that 2010 and beyond are at least as much as this. > > This particular spec relates to Query objects. Does anybody know if a similar limit exists for SQL that's built and executed in code? Just wondering if there may be a difference. > > > From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 09:33:09 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 07:33:09 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again Message-ID: I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields to the PK, which is a nuisance. Charlotte From gustav at cactus.dk Thu Apr 2 09:39:28 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 14:39:28 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> Hi Charlotte Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a grouping append query using the linked file as source? /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Charlotte Foust Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields to the PK, which is a nuisance. Charlotte From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 09:52:10 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 07:52:10 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> Message-ID: ?I'm not sure what you mean, Gustav. I've certainly tried append queries but with the same uneven results. The problem seems to be on the Access table end in the accdb. It isn't keeping duplicates out even though the unique key is set and none of the fields is null and all are required. If someone slips and re-imports the same data file, we wind up with duplicate records when the unique compound key should have kept them out.? The text file is one big flat file of about 75 fields. It's getting broken into chunks on the import but there has to be a unique transaction (and ID) in the primary table to keep the data straight. Filtering a query on about six fields to avoid duplicates is asking for "query too complex" responses, if it runs at all. I've used this technique forever in Access to keep duplicates out, and suddenly it isn't working. My hair can't get any grayer, but I'm pulling it out in handfuls over this! Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 7:39 AM, Gustav Brock wrote: > Hi Charlotte > > Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a grouping > append query using the linked file as source? > > /gustav > > ________________________________________ > Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Charlotte > Foust > Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 > Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again > > I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on > multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data > repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique > values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. > > Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields to > the PK, which is a nuisance. > > > Charlotte > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Thu Apr 2 09:53:39 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 07:53:39 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> Message-ID: <07CC6CB8E415448FA2BD5657CE686355@HAL9007> How about a follow up question? :) Just trying to up my game, here. I'm using your Not In approach to create the list in the temp table: db.Execute "INSERT INTO tblMailListTemp ( fldPersonsID, fldMailListTempPersonsFirstName, " _ & "fldMailListTempPersonsLastName, fldMailListTempCompany ) " _ & "SELECT tblPersons.fldPersonsID, tblPersons.fldPersonsFirstName, " _ & "tblPersons.fldPersonsLastName, " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyName FROM tblCompanies RIGHT JOIN tblPersons ON " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyID = tblPersons.fldCompanyID WHERE (" _ & "((tblPersons.fldPersonsID) Not In (Select fldPersonsID from " _ & "tblMailListPersons Where tblMailListPersons.fldMailListID = " _ & Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) & " )));" Works a treat. Now, when the user selects one of those records to be included in the selected mail list I'm using DAO to add it and that's works just fine. If Me.fldMailListTempSelected = True Then ' add to list Set rsMLP = db.OpenRecordset("Select * FROM tblMailListPersons ") rsMLP.AddNew rsMLP!fldPersonsID = Me.fldPersonsID rsMLP!fldMailListID = Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) rsMLP.Update rsMLP.Close Set rsMLP = Nothing Else . . . So, just trying to up my game here I tried to do this append with a SQL statement but couldn't figure out a way. I played with it in the QBE grid but no cigar. Is there a simple way to insert a record using SQL when you have the values in hand (in this case the selected Mail List and the fldPersonsID, the selected Person's PK). MTIA Rocky Smolin Beach Access Software 858-259-4334 www.bchacc.com www.e-z-mrp.com Skype: rocky.smolin -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From gustav at cactus.dk Thu Apr 2 10:29:19 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 15:29:19 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk>, Message-ID: <1427988558869.26447@cactus.dk> Hi Charlotte Oh, I missed that you hadn't dupes in the text file itself. Then you may have to create an outer join to the existing data and rule matches out. Strange though. I can't recall having seen issues with unique compound indexes. /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Charlotte Foust Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:52 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again ?I'm not sure what you mean, Gustav. I've certainly tried append queries but with the same uneven results. The problem seems to be on the Access table end in the accdb. It isn't keeping duplicates out even though the unique key is set and none of the fields is null and all are required. If someone slips and re-imports the same data file, we wind up with duplicate records when the unique compound key should have kept them out.? The text file is one big flat file of about 75 fields. It's getting broken into chunks on the import but there has to be a unique transaction (and ID) in the primary table to keep the data straight. Filtering a query on about six fields to avoid duplicates is asking for "query too complex" responses, if it runs at all. I've used this technique forever in Access to keep duplicates out, and suddenly it isn't working. My hair can't get any grayer, but I'm pulling it out in handfuls over this! Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 7:39 AM, Gustav Brock wrote: > Hi Charlotte > > Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a grouping > append query using the linked file as source? > > /gustav > > ________________________________________ > Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Charlotte > Foust > Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 > Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again > > I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on > multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data > repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique > values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. > > Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields to > the PK, which is a nuisance. > > From DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov Thu Apr 2 10:34:00 2015 From: DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov (McGillivray, Don) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 15:34:00 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: <07CC6CB8E415448FA2BD5657CE686355@HAL9007> References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007> <07CC6CB8E415448FA2BD5657CE686355@HAL9007> Message-ID: Assuming that your form is bound to the temp table, fldMailListTempSelected is bound to a column in that table, and the user is selecting the fldMailListTempSelected flag(s) to indicate those records to include, how about something like (air code): INSERT INTO tblMailListPersons (column1, column2, column3, . . .) SELECT column1, column2, column3, ... FROM tblMailListTemp WHERE fldMailListTempSelected = TRUE -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 7:54 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query How about a follow up question? :) Just trying to up my game, here. I'm using your Not In approach to create the list in the temp table: db.Execute "INSERT INTO tblMailListTemp ( fldPersonsID, fldMailListTempPersonsFirstName, " _ & "fldMailListTempPersonsLastName, fldMailListTempCompany ) " _ & "SELECT tblPersons.fldPersonsID, tblPersons.fldPersonsFirstName, " _ & "tblPersons.fldPersonsLastName, " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyName FROM tblCompanies RIGHT JOIN tblPersons ON " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyID = tblPersons.fldCompanyID WHERE (" _ & "((tblPersons.fldPersonsID) Not In (Select fldPersonsID from " _ & "tblMailListPersons Where tblMailListPersons.fldMailListID = " _ & Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) & " )));" Works a treat. Now, when the user selects one of those records to be included in the selected mail list I'm using DAO to add it and that's works just fine. If Me.fldMailListTempSelected = True Then ' add to list Set rsMLP = db.OpenRecordset("Select * FROM tblMailListPersons ") rsMLP.AddNew rsMLP!fldPersonsID = Me.fldPersonsID rsMLP!fldMailListID = Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) rsMLP.Update rsMLP.Close Set rsMLP = Nothing Else . . . So, just trying to up my game here I tried to do this append with a SQL statement but couldn't figure out a way. I played with it in the QBE grid but no cigar. Is there a simple way to insert a record using SQL when you have the values in hand (in this case the selected Mail List and the fldPersonsID, the selected Person's PK). MTIA Rocky Smolin Beach Access Software 858-259-4334 www.bchacc.com www.e-z-mrp.com Skype: rocky.smolin -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From jwcolby at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 10:41:38 2015 From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John W. Colby) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2015 11:41:38 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> Message-ID: <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> If you have a unique id and you are getting "duplicates" then the key isn't truly unique. All making it a PK does is set a unique ID. John W. Colby On 4/2/2015 10:52 AM, Charlotte Foust wrote: > ?I'm not sure what you mean, Gustav. I've certainly tried append queries > but with the same uneven results. The problem seems to be on the Access > table end in the accdb. It isn't keeping duplicates out even though the > unique key is set and none of the fields is null and all are required. If > someone slips and re-imports the same data file, we wind up with duplicate > records when the unique compound key should have kept them out.? The text > file is one big flat file of about 75 fields. It's getting broken into > chunks on the import but there has to be a unique transaction (and ID) in > the primary table to keep the data straight. Filtering a query on about > six fields to avoid duplicates is asking for "query too complex" responses, > if it runs at all. > > I've used this technique forever in Access to keep duplicates out, and > suddenly it isn't working. My hair can't get any grayer, but I'm pulling > it out in handfuls over this! > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 7:39 AM, Gustav Brock wrote: > >> Hi Charlotte >> >> Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a grouping >> append query using the linked file as source? >> >> /gustav >> >> ________________________________________ >> Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Charlotte >> Foust >> Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 >> Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving >> Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again >> >> I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on >> multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data >> repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique >> values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. >> >> Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields to >> the PK, which is a nuisance. >> >> >> Charlotte >> >> -- >> AccessD mailing list >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >> From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Thu Apr 2 10:46:46 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 08:46:46 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007><07CC6CB8E415448FA2BD5657CE686355@HAL9007> Message-ID: <29DBC3B884114357A463D93FC6EAE401@HAL9007> Your assumptions are correct. I think that will work! Thank you. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:34 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Assuming that your form is bound to the temp table, fldMailListTempSelected is bound to a column in that table, and the user is selecting the fldMailListTempSelected flag(s) to indicate those records to include, how about something like (air code): INSERT INTO tblMailListPersons (column1, column2, column3, . . .) SELECT column1, column2, column3, ... FROM tblMailListTemp WHERE fldMailListTempSelected = TRUE -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 7:54 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query How about a follow up question? :) Just trying to up my game, here. I'm using your Not In approach to create the list in the temp table: db.Execute "INSERT INTO tblMailListTemp ( fldPersonsID, fldMailListTempPersonsFirstName, " _ & "fldMailListTempPersonsLastName, fldMailListTempCompany ) " _ & "SELECT tblPersons.fldPersonsID, tblPersons.fldPersonsFirstName, " _ & "tblPersons.fldPersonsLastName, " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyName FROM tblCompanies RIGHT JOIN tblPersons ON " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyID = tblPersons.fldCompanyID WHERE (" _ & "((tblPersons.fldPersonsID) Not In (Select fldPersonsID from " _ & "tblMailListPersons Where tblMailListPersons.fldMailListID = " _ & Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) & " )));" Works a treat. Now, when the user selects one of those records to be included in the selected mail list I'm using DAO to add it and that's works just fine. If Me.fldMailListTempSelected = True Then ' add to list Set rsMLP = db.OpenRecordset("Select * FROM tblMailListPersons ") rsMLP.AddNew rsMLP!fldPersonsID = Me.fldPersonsID rsMLP!fldMailListID = Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) rsMLP.Update rsMLP.Close Set rsMLP = Nothing Else . . . So, just trying to up my game here I tried to do this append with a SQL statement but couldn't figure out a way. I played with it in the QBE grid but no cigar. Is there a simple way to insert a record using SQL when you have the values in hand (in this case the selected Mail List and the fldPersonsID, the selected Person's PK). MTIA Rocky Smolin Beach Access Software 858-259-4334 www.bchacc.com www.e-z-mrp.com Skype: rocky.smolin -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Thu Apr 2 10:54:01 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 08:54:01 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: <29DBC3B884114357A463D93FC6EAE401@HAL9007> References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007><07CC6CB8E415448FA2BD5657CE686355@HAL9007> <29DBC3B884114357A463D93FC6EAE401@HAL9007> Message-ID: <9524A902C8E741638DAAE8537A9D53D3@HAL9007> Eric: To delete a record from a list, uncheck the Selected box. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:47 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Your assumptions are correct. I think that will work! Thank you. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:34 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Assuming that your form is bound to the temp table, fldMailListTempSelected is bound to a column in that table, and the user is selecting the fldMailListTempSelected flag(s) to indicate those records to include, how about something like (air code): INSERT INTO tblMailListPersons (column1, column2, column3, . . .) SELECT column1, column2, column3, ... FROM tblMailListTemp WHERE fldMailListTempSelected = TRUE -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 7:54 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query How about a follow up question? :) Just trying to up my game, here. I'm using your Not In approach to create the list in the temp table: db.Execute "INSERT INTO tblMailListTemp ( fldPersonsID, fldMailListTempPersonsFirstName, " _ & "fldMailListTempPersonsLastName, fldMailListTempCompany ) " _ & "SELECT tblPersons.fldPersonsID, tblPersons.fldPersonsFirstName, " _ & "tblPersons.fldPersonsLastName, " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyName FROM tblCompanies RIGHT JOIN tblPersons ON " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyID = tblPersons.fldCompanyID WHERE (" _ & "((tblPersons.fldPersonsID) Not In (Select fldPersonsID from " _ & "tblMailListPersons Where tblMailListPersons.fldMailListID = " _ & Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) & " )));" Works a treat. Now, when the user selects one of those records to be included in the selected mail list I'm using DAO to add it and that's works just fine. If Me.fldMailListTempSelected = True Then ' add to list Set rsMLP = db.OpenRecordset("Select * FROM tblMailListPersons ") rsMLP.AddNew rsMLP!fldPersonsID = Me.fldPersonsID rsMLP!fldMailListID = Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) rsMLP.Update rsMLP.Close Set rsMLP = Nothing Else . . . So, just trying to up my game here I tried to do this append with a SQL statement but couldn't figure out a way. I played with it in the QBE grid but no cigar. Is there a simple way to insert a record using SQL when you have the values in hand (in this case the selected Mail List and the fldPersonsID, the selected Person's PK). MTIA Rocky Smolin Beach Access Software 858-259-4334 www.bchacc.com www.e-z-mrp.com Skype: rocky.smolin -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Thu Apr 2 10:57:24 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 08:57:24 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query In-Reply-To: <9524A902C8E741638DAAE8537A9D53D3@HAL9007> References: <1C4CCD3B3DCA435F86B0805327A45D5D@HAL9007><07CC6CB8E415448FA2BD5657CE686355@HAL9007><29DBC3B884114357A463D93FC6EAE401@HAL9007> <9524A902C8E741638DAAE8537A9D53D3@HAL9007> Message-ID: <65577670F21B4AA58783A279CE8ED117@HAL9007> Ooops - sorry - wrong address. r -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:54 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Eric: To delete a record from a list, uncheck the Selected box. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:47 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Your assumptions are correct. I think that will work! Thank you. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of McGillivray, Don Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 8:34 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Assuming that your form is bound to the temp table, fldMailListTempSelected is bound to a column in that table, and the user is selecting the fldMailListTempSelected flag(s) to indicate those records to include, how about something like (air code): INSERT INTO tblMailListPersons (column1, column2, column3, . . .) SELECT column1, column2, column3, ... FROM tblMailListTemp WHERE fldMailListTempSelected = TRUE -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 7:54 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query How about a follow up question? :) Just trying to up my game, here. I'm using your Not In approach to create the list in the temp table: db.Execute "INSERT INTO tblMailListTemp ( fldPersonsID, fldMailListTempPersonsFirstName, " _ & "fldMailListTempPersonsLastName, fldMailListTempCompany ) " _ & "SELECT tblPersons.fldPersonsID, tblPersons.fldPersonsFirstName, " _ & "tblPersons.fldPersonsLastName, " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyName FROM tblCompanies RIGHT JOIN tblPersons ON " _ & "tblCompanies.fldCompanyID = tblPersons.fldCompanyID WHERE (" _ & "((tblPersons.fldPersonsID) Not In (Select fldPersonsID from " _ & "tblMailListPersons Where tblMailListPersons.fldMailListID = " _ & Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) & " )));" Works a treat. Now, when the user selects one of those records to be included in the selected mail list I'm using DAO to add it and that's works just fine. If Me.fldMailListTempSelected = True Then ' add to list Set rsMLP = db.OpenRecordset("Select * FROM tblMailListPersons ") rsMLP.AddNew rsMLP!fldPersonsID = Me.fldPersonsID rsMLP!fldMailListID = Val(Me.cboMailList.Column(0)) rsMLP.Update rsMLP.Close Set rsMLP = Nothing Else . . . So, just trying to up my game here I tried to do this append with a SQL statement but couldn't figure out a way. I played with it in the QBE grid but no cigar. Is there a simple way to insert a record using SQL when you have the values in hand (in this case the selected Mail List and the fldPersonsID, the selected Person's PK). MTIA Rocky Smolin Beach Access Software 858-259-4334 www.bchacc.com www.e-z-mrp.com Skype: rocky.smolin -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:09 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query My pleasure. :-) Not In(select foo from bar) or In(select foo from bar) Is a very handy tool in the SQL kit. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 2:47 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query Not In? Wow. Who knew? (well you, of course). :) After 20 years you'd think I'd know pretty much the whole language. I'll give that a try. Thanks Lambert R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Heenan, Lambert Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 10:32 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Need help with a query You don't need any joins, just a query on tblMailingListPersons with a sub query on the user ID. Like this SELECT tblPersons.ID, tblPersons.STREMAIL, tblPersons.STRFIRSTNAME, tblPersons.STRLASTNAME FROM tblPersons WHERE (((tblPersons.ID) Not In (select PersonsID from tblMailingListPersons where tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1 ))); (made some guesses about field names). So all that's need is to replace the where "tblMailingListPersons.MailListID=1" with a reference to the form where the mail list is chosen. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2015 12:08 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Need help with a query Dear List: I'm trying to make a query do something I would usually just do with a bit of code and am having some difficulty. I have 1) a table tblMailLists (PK, list name), 2) a table tblPersons (PK & Persons Name) and 3) a connecting table tblMailingListPersons (MailListID FK and Persons ID FK. Pretty standard stuff So people can be assigned to one or more mailing lists. I need to assemble into a temp table and display in a form all the people not already on a specific mailing list so that the user can assign them to the selected mailing list. So I connected tblPersons with tblMailingListPersons - all records from tblPersons and only those records in tblMailingListPersons - and used the criteria: MailListID <> (user's selected list) OR Is Null. This gives me all the people not assigned to the selected list. But if a person is assigned to another list, of course they show up on this list as well (Person A is assigned to lists 1 and 2 - so the criteria filter out anyone who's on List 1 but passes through someone on List 2). I can't figure out how to suppress all the people who are on the user's selected mailing list even if they're assigned to another mailing list. And direction appreciated. If it's too snaky I'll just write some code to populate the temp table. MTIA Rocky -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 12:24:52 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 10:24:52 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> Message-ID: I know that John. The autonumbers is used strictly for joins. Today , on my machine it's working perfectly and as I world expect. Yesterday, on their machine it didn't. That pounding you may hear is my head meeting the wall. On Apr 2, 2015 8:43 AM, "John W. Colby" wrote: > If you have a unique id and you are getting "duplicates" then the key > isn't truly unique. All making it a PK does is set a unique ID. > > John W. Colby > > On 4/2/2015 10:52 AM, Charlotte Foust wrote: > >> ?I'm not sure what you mean, Gustav. I've certainly tried append queries >> but with the same uneven results. The problem seems to be on the Access >> table end in the accdb. It isn't keeping duplicates out even though the >> unique key is set and none of the fields is null and all are required. If >> someone slips and re-imports the same data file, we wind up with duplicate >> records when the unique compound key should have kept them out.? The text >> file is one big flat file of about 75 fields. It's getting broken into >> chunks on the import but there has to be a unique transaction (and ID) in >> the primary table to keep the data straight. Filtering a query on about >> six fields to avoid duplicates is asking for "query too complex" >> responses, >> if it runs at all. >> >> I've used this technique forever in Access to keep duplicates out, and >> suddenly it isn't working. My hair can't get any grayer, but I'm pulling >> it out in handfuls over this! >> >> Charlotte Foust >> (916) 206-4336 >> >> On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 7:39 AM, Gustav Brock wrote: >> >> Hi Charlotte >>> >>> Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a >>> grouping >>> append query using the linked file as source? >>> >>> /gustav >>> >>> ________________________________________ >>> Fra: AccessD p? vegne af >>> Charlotte >>> Foust >>> Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 >>> Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving >>> Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again >>> >>> I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on >>> multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data >>> repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique >>> values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. >>> >>> Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields to >>> the PK, which is a nuisance. >>> >>> >>> Charlotte >>> >>> -- >>> AccessD mailing list >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>> >>> > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From bradm at blackforestltd.com Thu Apr 2 15:37:28 2015 From: bradm at blackforestltd.com (Brad Marks) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 20:37:28 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Access 2007 Applications on Apple MacBook Pro In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: All, Our company president has an Apple MacBook Pro at home which he would like to use at work. We have a number of Access 2007 applications which access both Firebird and Pervasive databases via OBDC. I have never work with Apple hardware before. I have heard of other people running Windows applications on Macbooks, but I have never explored this area. I am curious if others have been down this path. What new software will be needed? Any advice or insights would be appreciated. Thanks, Brad From bensonforums at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 15:54:38 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 16:54:38 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Access 2007 Applications on Apple MacBook Pro In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The only way I have heard to run Access on a mac is with a virtual machine with windows. If running that, all ms office products should work as expected - but it may take a fairly sophisticated person to make sure the virtual machine is set up correctly with all the updated. On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 4:37 PM, Brad Marks wrote: > All, > > Our company president has an Apple MacBook Pro at home which he would like > to use at work. > > We have a number of Access 2007 applications which access both Firebird > and Pervasive databases via OBDC. > > I have never work with Apple hardware before. I have heard of other > people running Windows applications on Macbooks, but I have never explored > this area. > > I am curious if others have been down this path. > > What new software will be needed? > > Any advice or insights would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Brad > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From dbdoug at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 16:10:45 2015 From: dbdoug at gmail.com (Doug Steele) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 14:10:45 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Access 2007 Applications on Apple MacBook Pro In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I do all my Access development on macs. I've used both VMWare Fusion and Parallels to set up Windows VMs. They both work well, and are quite comparable. Set up usually isn't much of a problem, as long as you have Windows/Office setup disks or DVD iso files. You can mount an iso file as if it were a DVD. I have separate VMs set up for each version of Office, which really helps. Doug On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 1:54 PM, Bill Benson wrote: > The only way I have heard to run Access on a mac is with a virtual machine > with windows. If running that, all ms office products should work as > expected - but it may take a fairly sophisticated person to make sure the > virtual machine is set up correctly with all the updated. > > On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 4:37 PM, Brad Marks > wrote: > > > All, > > > > Our company president has an Apple MacBook Pro at home which he would > like > > to use at work. > > > > We have a number of Access 2007 applications which access both Firebird > > and Pervasive databases via OBDC. > > > > I have never work with Apple hardware before. I have heard of other > > people running Windows applications on Macbooks, but I have never > explored > > this area. > > > > I am curious if others have been down this path. > > > > What new software will be needed? > > > > Any advice or insights would be appreciated. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Brad > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From rockysmolin at bchacc.com Thu Apr 2 19:32:22 2015 From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2015 17:32:22 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Access 2007 Applications on Apple MacBook Pro In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <88D6FBD5D1B14CEAA712F2171B55E0CE@HAL9007> I have a couple of users running my commercial product (A2003 mde - native and run-time) using Parallels. Seems to work just fine. R -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Brad Marks Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2015 1:37 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] Access 2007 Applications on Apple MacBook Pro All, Our company president has an Apple MacBook Pro at home which he would like to use at work. We have a number of Access 2007 applications which access both Firebird and Pervasive databases via OBDC. I have never work with Apple hardware before. I have heard of other people running Windows applications on Macbooks, but I have never explored this area. I am curious if others have been down this path. What new software will be needed? Any advice or insights would be appreciated. Thanks, Brad -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From paul.hartland at googlemail.com Thu Apr 2 21:33:01 2015 From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland) Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2015 03:33:01 +0100 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> Message-ID: Charlotte, So you have a table which has a unique key on one or more fields ?...If so one of these isn't an autonumber is it ? (done this myself in the past...banged head against wall many time for school boy errors like this) Paul On 2 April 2015 at 18:24, Charlotte Foust wrote: > I know that John. The autonumbers is used strictly for joins. Today , > on my machine it's working perfectly and as I world expect. Yesterday, on > their machine it didn't. That pounding you may hear is my head meeting the > wall. > On Apr 2, 2015 8:43 AM, "John W. Colby" wrote: > > > If you have a unique id and you are getting "duplicates" then the key > > isn't truly unique. All making it a PK does is set a unique ID. > > > > John W. Colby > > > > On 4/2/2015 10:52 AM, Charlotte Foust wrote: > > > >> ?I'm not sure what you mean, Gustav. I've certainly tried append > queries > >> but with the same uneven results. The problem seems to be on the Access > >> table end in the accdb. It isn't keeping duplicates out even though the > >> unique key is set and none of the fields is null and all are required. > If > >> someone slips and re-imports the same data file, we wind up with > duplicate > >> records when the unique compound key should have kept them out.? The > text > >> file is one big flat file of about 75 fields. It's getting broken into > >> chunks on the import but there has to be a unique transaction (and ID) > in > >> the primary table to keep the data straight. Filtering a query on about > >> six fields to avoid duplicates is asking for "query too complex" > >> responses, > >> if it runs at all. > >> > >> I've used this technique forever in Access to keep duplicates out, and > >> suddenly it isn't working. My hair can't get any grayer, but I'm > pulling > >> it out in handfuls over this! > >> > >> Charlotte Foust > >> (916) 206-4336 > >> > >> On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 7:39 AM, Gustav Brock wrote: > >> > >> Hi Charlotte > >>> > >>> Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a > >>> grouping > >>> append query using the linked file as source? > >>> > >>> /gustav > >>> > >>> ________________________________________ > >>> Fra: AccessD p? vegne af > >>> Charlotte > >>> Foust > >>> Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 > >>> Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > >>> Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again > >>> > >>> I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on > >>> multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data > >>> repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique > >>> values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. > >>> > >>> Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple fields > to > >>> the PK, which is a nuisance. > >>> > >>> > >>> Charlotte > >>> > >>> -- > >>> AccessD mailing list > >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > >>> > >>> > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- Paul Hartland paul.hartland at googlemail.com From jwcolby at gmail.com Thu Apr 2 22:45:39 2015 From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John W. Colby) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2015 23:45:39 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> Message-ID: <551E0CE3.8060205@gmail.com> LOL, good one. That would definitely kill the uniqueness factor. John W. Colby On 4/2/2015 10:33 PM, Paul Hartland wrote: > Charlotte, > > So you have a table which has a unique key on one or more fields ?...If so > one of these isn't an autonumber is it ? (done this myself in the > past...banged head against wall many time for school boy errors like this) > > Paul > > On 2 April 2015 at 18:24, Charlotte Foust wrote: > >> I know that John. The autonumbers is used strictly for joins. Today , >> on my machine it's working perfectly and as I world expect. Yesterday, on >> their machine it didn't. That pounding you may hear is my head meeting the >> wall. >> On Apr 2, 2015 8:43 AM, "John W. Colby" wrote: >> >>> If you have a unique id and you are getting "duplicates" then the key >>> isn't truly unique. All making it a PK does is set a unique ID. >>> >>> John W. Colby >>> From paul.hartland at googlemail.com Fri Apr 3 04:17:44 2015 From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland) Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2015 10:17:44 +0100 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: <551E0CE3.8060205@gmail.com> References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> <551E0CE3.8060205@gmail.com> Message-ID: I can LOL now....but was scratching my head for hours on this once, followed by (when I realised what I had done) a selfie slap of the head and mumbled cursing to myself lol..... On 3 April 2015 at 04:45, John W. Colby wrote: > LOL, good one. That would definitely kill the uniqueness factor. > > John W. Colby > > On 4/2/2015 10:33 PM, Paul Hartland wrote: > >> Charlotte, >> >> So you have a table which has a unique key on one or more fields ?...If so >> one of these isn't an autonumber is it ? (done this myself in the >> past...banged head against wall many time for school boy errors like this) >> >> Paul >> >> On 2 April 2015 at 18:24, Charlotte Foust >> wrote: >> >> I know that John. The autonumbers is used strictly for joins. Today >>> , >>> on my machine it's working perfectly and as I world expect. Yesterday, on >>> their machine it didn't. That pounding you may hear is my head meeting >>> the >>> wall. >>> On Apr 2, 2015 8:43 AM, "John W. Colby" wrote: >>> >>> If you have a unique id and you are getting "duplicates" then the key >>>> isn't truly unique. All making it a PK does is set a unique ID. >>>> >>>> John W. Colby >>>> >>>> > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- Paul Hartland paul.hartland at googlemail.com From jerbach.db at gmail.com Fri Apr 3 15:40:52 2015 From: jerbach.db at gmail.com (Janet Erbach) Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2015 15:40:52 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question Message-ID: Hello all - I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior in a database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was one line of code in the menu form that opens with the app: Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database Set dbsAlwaysOpen = OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes being dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to be manually refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the menu. This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the backend and everything seems back to normal now. Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was pursuing serious speed issues with the app. Thanks! Janet Erbach From jimdettman at verizon.net Fri Apr 3 16:17:17 2015 From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman) Date: Fri, 03 Apr 2015 17:17:17 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7F027C66560D45E892D904722A775A56@XPS> Janet, I can't think of any reason why that should bother anything. While it would not be my first choice (just open recordset on a table), there's nothing per say wrong with this. Your chewing up another connection to the DB, but that's it. There's a little more overhead in your app of course, but still, that should not amount to anything. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Friday, April 03, 2015 04:41 PM To: Database Advisors Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question Hello all - I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior in a database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was one line of code in the menu form that opens with the app: Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database Set dbsAlwaysOpen = OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes being dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to be manually refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the menu. This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the backend and everything seems back to normal now. Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was pursuing serious speed issues with the app. Thanks! Janet Erbach -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From df.waters at outlook.com Fri Apr 3 16:32:57 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2015 16:32:57 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Janet, I do the same thing with one important difference. The variable dbsAlwaysOpen should be Static. Static dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database This maintains the connection to the back end data tables. I have tested this and your users will definitely notice an improvement. The reason is that it takes time for Access to open connections to the data tables on the server - maintaining a Static variable to that database means that Access only needs to establish the connection once, not every time it wants to do any CRUD operation. I think that Jim's suggestion to open a recordset will do the same thing, as long as a Static recordset variable is used. Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Friday, April 03, 2015 3:41 PM To: Database Advisors Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question Hello all - I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior in a database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was one line of code in the menu form that opens with the app: Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database Set dbsAlwaysOpen = OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes being dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to be manually refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the menu. This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the backend and everything seems back to normal now. Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was pursuing serious speed issues with the app. Thanks! Janet Erbach -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Sat Apr 4 01:11:43 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2015 23:11:43 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again In-Reply-To: References: <1427985567893.67598@cactus.dk> <551D6332.1030209@gmail.com> Message-ID: No, Paul, I didn't make make that mistake. I did a go back and carefully make sure each field was required though. Maybe that explains why it worked on mine. On Apr 2, 2015 7:34 PM, "Paul Hartland" wrote: > Charlotte, > > So you have a table which has a unique key on one or more fields ?...If so > one of these isn't an autonumber is it ? (done this myself in the > past...banged head against wall many time for school boy errors like this) > > Paul > > On 2 April 2015 at 18:24, Charlotte Foust > wrote: > > > I know that John. The autonumbers is used strictly for joins. Today > , > > on my machine it's working perfectly and as I world expect. Yesterday, on > > their machine it didn't. That pounding you may hear is my head meeting > the > > wall. > > On Apr 2, 2015 8:43 AM, "John W. Colby" wrote: > > > > > If you have a unique id and you are getting "duplicates" then the key > > > isn't truly unique. All making it a PK does is set a unique ID. > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > On 4/2/2015 10:52 AM, Charlotte Foust wrote: > > > > > >> ?I'm not sure what you mean, Gustav. I've certainly tried append > > queries > > >> but with the same uneven results. The problem seems to be on the > Access > > >> table end in the accdb. It isn't keeping duplicates out even though > the > > >> unique key is set and none of the fields is null and all are required. > > If > > >> someone slips and re-imports the same data file, we wind up with > > duplicate > > >> records when the unique compound key should have kept them out.? The > > text > > >> file is one big flat file of about 75 fields. It's getting broken > into > > >> chunks on the import but there has to be a unique transaction (and > ID) > > in > > >> the primary table to keep the data straight. Filtering a query on > about > > >> six fields to avoid duplicates is asking for "query too complex" > > >> responses, > > >> if it runs at all. > > >> > > >> I've used this technique forever in Access to keep duplicates out, and > > >> suddenly it isn't working. My hair can't get any grayer, but I'm > > pulling > > >> it out in handfuls over this! > > >> > > >> Charlotte Foust > > >> (916) 206-4336 > > >> > > >> On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 7:39 AM, Gustav Brock > wrote: > > >> > > >> Hi Charlotte > > >>> > > >>> Haven't seen this, but couldn't you link the textfile, then run a > > >>> grouping > > >>> append query using the linked file as source? > > >>> > > >>> /gustav > > >>> > > >>> ________________________________________ > > >>> Fra: AccessD p? vegne af > > >>> Charlotte > > >>> Foust > > >>> Sendt: 2. april 2015 16:33 > > >>> Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > >>> Emne: [AccessD] Compound Unique Keys...Again > > >>> > > >>> I'm beating my head against the wall on this. I set a unique key on > > >>> multiple fields and Access 2010 allows me to import the same data > > >>> repeatedly! Since the import is from a text file which has no unique > > >>> values in it, I'm finding it impossible to keep duplicates out. > > >>> > > >>> Anyone else encountered this? I may have to set those multiple > fields > > to > > >>> the PK, which is a nuisance. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> Charlotte > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> AccessD mailing list > > >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > >>> > > >>> > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Paul Hartland > paul.hartland at googlemail.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From mcp2004 at mail.ru Sat Apr 4 19:11:34 2015 From: mcp2004 at mail.ru (=?UTF-8?B?U2FsYWtoZXRkaW5vdiBTaGFtaWw=?=) Date: Sun, 05 Apr 2015 03:11:34 +0300 Subject: [AccessD] =?utf-8?q?MS_Access_everywhere_and_forever_-_they=27ve_?= =?utf-8?q?made_it_finally=3F?= Message-ID: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? From accessd at shaw.ca Sat Apr 4 23:17:47 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Sat, 4 Apr 2015 22:17:47 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <313281887.39988565.1428207467076.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Brilliant. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Janet Erbach" To: "Database Advisors" Sent: Friday, April 3, 2015 1:40:52 PM Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question Hello all - I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior in a database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was one line of code in the menu form that opens with the app: Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database Set dbsAlwaysOpen = OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes being dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to be manually refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the menu. This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the backend and everything seems back to normal now. Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was pursuing serious speed issues with the app. Thanks! Janet Erbach -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From df.waters at outlook.com Sun Apr 5 11:00:40 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2015 11:00:40 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Sun Apr 5 19:53:34 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2015 17:53:34 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 Message-ID: I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a recordset object from a select * query based on a UD system table runs in the query design window but returns no records on db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind drifting away, or what? Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 From df.waters at outlook.com Sun Apr 5 20:04:01 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2015 20:04:01 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of your variable 'SQLstr'. Also, what is a UD System Table? Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte Foust Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a recordset object from a select * query based on a UD system table runs in the query design window but returns no records on db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind drifting away, or what? Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Sun Apr 5 20:37:35 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2015 18:37:35 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's what I tried first. Same result. I know back the mdb days you sometimes had to set the query to run with owner's permissions, but that went out with workgroup security. I work with this stuff all the time, but I don't usually roll out a sort-of security system for clients, and that's what this is for. UD = "User-defined", a USys table. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:04 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of your > variable 'SQLstr'. > > Also, what is a UD System Table? > > Dan > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Charlotte Foust > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 > > I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a recordset > object from a select * query based on a UD system table runs in the query > design window but returns no records on db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, > dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind drifting > away, > or what? > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From df.waters at outlook.com Sun Apr 5 20:55:02 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2015 20:55:02 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: What about trying an ADO recordset instead of a DAO recordset? (or vice-versa) -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte Foust Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:38 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 That's what I tried first. Same result. I know back the mdb days you sometimes had to set the query to run with owner's permissions, but that went out with workgroup security. I work with this stuff all the time, but I don't usually roll out a sort-of security system for clients, and that's what this is for. UD = "User-defined", a USys table. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:04 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of your > variable 'SQLstr'. > > Also, what is a UD System Table? > > Dan > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Charlotte Foust > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > 2010-2013 > > I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a recordset > object from a select * query based on a UD system table runs in the > query design window but returns no records on db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, > dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind drifting > away, or what? > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Sun Apr 5 21:00:04 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2015 19:00:04 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I gave up and did a dlookup instead, which works just fine. Go figure. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:55 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > What about trying an ADO recordset instead of a DAO recordset? (or > vice-versa) > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Charlotte Foust > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:38 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 > > That's what I tried first. Same result. I know back the mdb days you > sometimes had to set the query to run with owner's permissions, but that > went out with workgroup security. I work with this stuff all the time, but > I don't usually roll out a sort-of security system for clients, and that's > what this is for. > > UD = "User-defined", a USys table. > > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:04 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of your > > variable 'SQLstr'. > > > > Also, what is a UD System Table? > > > > Dan > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > > Of Charlotte Foust > > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM > > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > > 2010-2013 > > > > I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a recordset > > object from a select * query based on a UD system table runs in the > > query design window but returns no records on db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, > > dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind drifting > > away, or what? > > > > > > Charlotte Foust > > (916) 206-4336 > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Mon Apr 6 08:34:29 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 13:34:29 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Share some code? :-) I just ran this code on one of my USYS tables and it behave correctly. Dim rs As DAO.Recordset Set rs = Currentdb.OpenRecordset("SELECT USYS_LinkedTables_tbl.* FROM USYS_LinkedTables_tbl;", dbOpenSnapshot) rs.MoveLast Debug.Print rs.RecordCount rs.Close Set rs = Nothing This is in Access 2010. Without rs.MoveLast the output is '1', but that's normal too. :-) Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte Foust Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 10:00 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 I gave up and did a dlookup instead, which works just fine. Go figure. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:55 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > What about trying an ADO recordset instead of a DAO recordset? (or > vice-versa) > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Charlotte Foust > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:38 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > 2010-2013 > > That's what I tried first. Same result. I know back the mdb days you > sometimes had to set the query to run with owner's permissions, but > that went out with workgroup security. I work with this stuff all the > time, but I don't usually roll out a sort-of security system for > clients, and that's what this is for. > > UD = "User-defined", a USys table. > > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:04 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of > > your variable 'SQLstr'. > > > > Also, what is a UD System Table? > > > > Dan > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On > > Behalf Of Charlotte Foust > > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM > > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > > 2010-2013 > > > > I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a > > recordset object from a select * query based on a UD system table > > runs in the query design window but returns no records on > > db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, > > dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind > > drifting away, or what? > > > > > > Charlotte Foust > > (916) 206-4336 > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Mon Apr 6 09:55:10 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 07:55:10 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Right, and what I expected. Not. On Apr 6, 2015 6:36 AM, "Heenan, Lambert" wrote: > Share some code? :-) > > I just ran this code on one of my USYS tables and it behave correctly. > > Dim rs As DAO.Recordset > Set rs = Currentdb.OpenRecordset("SELECT USYS_LinkedTables_tbl.* FROM > USYS_LinkedTables_tbl;", dbOpenSnapshot) > rs.MoveLast > Debug.Print rs.RecordCount > rs.Close > Set rs = Nothing > > This is in Access 2010. Without rs.MoveLast the output is '1', but that's > normal too. :-) > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Charlotte Foust > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 10:00 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 > > I gave up and did a dlookup instead, which works just fine. Go figure. > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:55 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > What about trying an ADO recordset instead of a DAO recordset? (or > > vice-versa) > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > > Of Charlotte Foust > > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:38 PM > > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > > 2010-2013 > > > > That's what I tried first. Same result. I know back the mdb days you > > sometimes had to set the query to run with owner's permissions, but > > that went out with workgroup security. I work with this stuff all the > > time, but I don't usually roll out a sort-of security system for > > clients, and that's what this is for. > > > > UD = "User-defined", a USys table. > > > > > > > > Charlotte Foust > > (916) 206-4336 > > > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:04 PM, Dan Waters > wrote: > > > > > Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of > > > your variable 'SQLstr'. > > > > > > Also, what is a UD System Table? > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On > > > Behalf Of Charlotte Foust > > > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM > > > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > > Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > > > 2010-2013 > > > > > > I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a > > > recordset object from a select * query based on a UD system table > > > runs in the query design window but returns no records on > > > db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, > > > dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind > > > drifting away, or what? > > > > > > > > > Charlotte Foust > > > (916) 206-4336 > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 10:13:22 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 10:13:22 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Perhaps this table is corrupt in some way? Recreate an empty Usys table that duplicates the structure of the one you're working on. Put in some data and run your query. Then import the original data to see if that also works. I once was unable to upsize an Access table to SQL using the Access upsizing wizard. I was able to finally find the problem using a program call MUST. With that I found a single field in one row that had the wrong type of data for that field (text in a date field or something ...). I fixed that and then was able to upsize successfully. Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte Foust Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 9:55 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc 2010-2013 Right, and what I expected. Not. On Apr 6, 2015 6:36 AM, "Heenan, Lambert" wrote: > Share some code? :-) > > I just ran this code on one of my USYS tables and it behave correctly. > > Dim rs As DAO.Recordset > Set rs = Currentdb.OpenRecordset("SELECT USYS_LinkedTables_tbl.* > FROM USYS_LinkedTables_tbl;", dbOpenSnapshot) > rs.MoveLast > Debug.Print rs.RecordCount > rs.Close > Set rs = Nothing > > This is in Access 2010. Without rs.MoveLast the output is '1', but > that's normal too. :-) > > Lambert > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Charlotte Foust > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 10:00 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > 2010-2013 > > I gave up and did a dlookup instead, which works just fine. Go figure. > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:55 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > What about trying an ADO recordset instead of a DAO recordset? (or > > vice-versa) > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On > > Behalf Of Charlotte Foust > > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 8:38 PM > > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > > 2010-2013 > > > > That's what I tried first. Same result. I know back the mdb days > > you sometimes had to set the query to run with owner's permissions, > > but that went out with workgroup security. I work with this stuff > > all the time, but I don't usually roll out a sort-of security system > > for clients, and that's what this is for. > > > > UD = "User-defined", a USys table. > > > > > > > > Charlotte Foust > > (916) 206-4336 > > > > On Sun, Apr 5, 2015 at 6:04 PM, Dan Waters > wrote: > > > > > Just as a check, try using "SELECT * FROM [tablename]" instead of > > > your variable 'SQLstr'. > > > > > > Also, what is a UD System Table? > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On > > > Behalf Of Charlotte Foust > > > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 7:54 PM > > > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > > > Subject: [AccessD] Querying user-defined system tables in Acc > > > 2010-2013 > > > > > > I'm running into peculiar behavior where attempting to set a > > > recordset object from a select * query based on a UD system table > > > runs in the query design window but returns no records on > > > db.OpenRecordset(SQLstr, > > > dbopensnapshot) in code. Is it just another piece of my mind > > > drifting away, or what? > > > > > > > > > Charlotte Foust > > > (916) 206-4336 > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From BWalsh at acumentra.org Mon Apr 6 10:33:50 2015 From: BWalsh at acumentra.org (Bob Walsh) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 15:33:50 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. From gustav at cactus.dk Mon Apr 6 10:41:12 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 15:41:12 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> , Message-ID: <1428334872319.42603@cactus.dk> Hi Dan Did you notice the date of that blog entry? /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Bob Walsh Sendt: 6. april 2015 17:33 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 11:41:20 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 11:41:20 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: Hi Bob, There is no Follow tab anywhere on the page. ??? Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bob Walsh Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:34 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 11:44:39 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 11:44:39 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: <1428334872319.42603@cactus.dk> References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> , <1428334872319.42603@cactus.dk> Message-ID: Hi Gustav, I did! But none of the commenters had anything but typical responses. I'm going to pursue this at some point. If I works then perhaps I could make my own mobile apps for my phone. Along the way I'll find out if using this is feasible with my potential customers. Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gustav Brock Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:41 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi Dan Did you notice the date of that blog entry? /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Bob Walsh Sendt: 6. april 2015 17:33 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From dw-murphy at cox.net Mon Apr 6 12:24:03 2015 From: dw-murphy at cox.net (Doug Murphy) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 10:24:03 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Code gone from db Message-ID: <005701d0708e$7a918b10$6fb4a130$@cox.net> Folks, Seems I have seen something similar discussed in the past on this list. I have a customer running Access 2007 in their office. I send them a front end file that works on my 2007 machine. A few days later I get a message indicating the application can't find the AutoExec function I run on database open to check table links. I had them send a copy of the file back. I look in the file and all the code is gone from behind the forms and none of the modules will open. As I said in my opening sentence I have a vague recollection that there is some type of corruption or file incompatibility that will cause similar symptoms. Am I remembering correctly, and if so what could cause this? Doug From RRANTHON at sentara.com Mon Apr 6 12:29:47 2015 From: RRANTHON at sentara.com (RANDALL R ANTHONY) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 17:29:47 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Code gone from db In-Reply-To: <005701d0708e$7a918b10$6fb4a130$@cox.net> References: <005701d0708e$7a918b10$6fb4a130$@cox.net> Message-ID: Doug, Have the customer check their anti-virus settings. We had a similar occurrence that started happening on a regular basis and it turned out to be an updated virus checker was cleaning out the container. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Doug Murphy Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 1:24 PM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] Code gone from db Folks, Seems I have seen something similar discussed in the past on this list. I have a customer running Access 2007 in their office. I send them a front end file that works on my 2007 machine. A few days later I get a message indicating the application can't find the AutoExec function I run on database open to check table links. I had them send a copy of the file back. I look in the file and all the code is gone from behind the forms and none of the modules will open. As I said in my opening sentence I have a vague recollection that there is some type of corruption or file incompatibility that will cause similar symptoms. Am I remembering correctly, and if so what could cause this? Doug -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From BWalsh at acumentra.org Mon Apr 6 13:17:25 2015 From: BWalsh at acumentra.org (Bob Walsh) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 18:17:25 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: There is also a "Register" hotlink at the bottom of the Archives list -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 9:41 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi Bob, There is no Follow tab anywhere on the page. ??? Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bob Walsh Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:34 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. From BWalsh at acumentra.org Mon Apr 6 13:29:04 2015 From: BWalsh at acumentra.org (Bob Walsh) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 18:29:04 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: <0476615951aa414e9e95a3a61b5aa7d6@Rigel.ompro.org> Ignore that last comment. It doesn't take you to the same place... -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bob Walsh Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 11:17 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? There is also a "Register" hotlink at the bottom of the Archives list -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 9:41 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi Bob, There is no Follow tab anywhere on the page. ??? Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bob Walsh Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:34 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. From jerbach.db at gmail.com Mon Apr 6 15:05:23 2015 From: jerbach.db at gmail.com (Janet Erbach) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 15:05:23 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question In-Reply-To: <313281887.39988565.1428207467076.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> References: <313281887.39988565.1428207467076.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: The users certainly do notice a speed difference with the persistent connection, that's for sure. That, combined with changing the main tables in the app to have 'none' for the subdatasheet name, have made a huge difference. But this flaky behavior when running the app from the menu has eaten up almost all of my time for the last 3 weeks and it seems it was all because of that line of code when the form opened. I wonder if it was because the variable was NOT a static one... Anyway, things have settled down now that I've bound the form to the backend by way of keeping the connection persistent. On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:17 PM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > Brilliant. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Janet Erbach" > To: "Database Advisors" > Sent: Friday, April 3, 2015 1:40:52 PM > Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question > > Hello all - > > I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior in a > database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was one line of > code in the menu form that opens with the app: > > Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database > Set dbsAlwaysOpen = > OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) > > Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes being > dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to be manually > refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. > The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the > menu. > > This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the backend > and everything seems back to normal now. > > Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause > issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was pursuing > serious speed issues with the app. > > Thanks! > > Janet Erbach > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 15:05:36 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 15:05:36 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: <1428334872319.42603@cactus.dk> References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> , <1428334872319.42603@cactus.dk> Message-ID: Hi Gustav, I checked with Dick Moffat - his blog on April 1st was real! Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gustav Brock Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:41 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi Dan Did you notice the date of that blog entry? /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Bob Walsh Sendt: 6. april 2015 17:33 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Salakhetdinov Shamil Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? Hi All -- FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 Thank you. -- ???????????? ?????? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 15:13:53 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 15:13:53 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question In-Reply-To: References: <313281887.39988565.1428207467076.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: This is a procedure I wrote a while back to quickly set all tables to have None in the Subdatasheet property. '-------------------------------------------- Private Sub ChangeTableProperties() Dim tdf As TableDef Dim prp As DAO.Property Dim dbs As DAO.Database Dim stg As String Dim blnPropertyExists As Boolean Dim stgPropertyName As String Dim intPropertyType As Integer Dim varPropertyValue As Variant Dim intCount As Integer Dim intTableCount As Integer Dim var As Variant stgPropertyName = "SubDatasheetName" intPropertyType = dbText varPropertyValue = "[None]" Set dbs = CurDB intTableCount = dbs.TableDefs.Count var = SysCmd(acSysCmdInitMeter, "Setting " & stgPropertyName & " Property", intTableCount) intCount = 0 For Each tdf In dbs.TableDefs intCount = intCount + 1 var = SysCmd(acSysCmdUpdateMeter, intCount) stg = tdf.Name If Left$(stg, 4) <> "MSys" Then For Each prp In tdf.Properties If prp.Name = stgPropertyName Then blnPropertyExists = True Exit For Else blnPropertyExists = False End If Next If blnPropertyExists = False Then Set prp = tdf.CreateProperty(stgPropertyName, intPropertyType, varPropertyValue) tdf.Properties.Append prp End If End If Next tdf dbs.TableDefs.Refresh var = SysCmd(acSysCmdRemoveMeter) MsgBox "Done!" Set prp = Nothing Set tdf = Nothing Set dbs = Nothing Exit Sub EH: MsgBox Err.Number & ": " & Err.Description End Sub '-------------------------------------------- -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 3:05 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question The users certainly do notice a speed difference with the persistent connection, that's for sure. That, combined with changing the main tables in the app to have 'none' for the subdatasheet name, have made a huge difference. But this flaky behavior when running the app from the menu has eaten up almost all of my time for the last 3 weeks and it seems it was all because of that line of code when the form opened. I wonder if it was because the variable was NOT a static one... Anyway, things have settled down now that I've bound the form to the backend by way of keeping the connection persistent. On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:17 PM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > Brilliant. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Janet Erbach" > To: "Database Advisors" > Sent: Friday, April 3, 2015 1:40:52 PM > Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question > > Hello all - > > I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior > in a database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was > one line of code in the menu form that opens with the app: > > Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database > Set dbsAlwaysOpen = > OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) > > Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes > being dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to > be manually refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. > The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the > menu. > > This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the > backend and everything seems back to normal now. > > Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause > issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was > pursuing serious speed issues with the app. > > Thanks! > > Janet Erbach > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 16:35:05 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 16:35:05 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question In-Reply-To: References: <313281887.39988565.1428207467076.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Sorry to hear about the three weeks, but glad it's all working now. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Janet Erbach Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 3:05 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question The users certainly do notice a speed difference with the persistent connection, that's for sure. That, combined with changing the main tables in the app to have 'none' for the subdatasheet name, have made a huge difference. But this flaky behavior when running the app from the menu has eaten up almost all of my time for the last 3 weeks and it seems it was all because of that line of code when the form opened. I wonder if it was because the variable was NOT a static one... Anyway, things have settled down now that I've bound the form to the backend by way of keeping the connection persistent. On Sat, Apr 4, 2015 at 11:17 PM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > Brilliant. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Janet Erbach" > To: "Database Advisors" > Sent: Friday, April 3, 2015 1:40:52 PM > Subject: [AccessD] Persistent Connection question > > Hello all - > > I've finally discovered what's been causing extremely flaky behavior > in a database I've been wrestling with for the past 3 weeks. It was > one line of code in the menu form that opens with the app: > > Dim dbsAlwaysOpen As DAO.Database > Set dbsAlwaysOpen = > OpenDatabase("S:\MAINT\ToolingTech\dbToolingTechData.accdb", False) > > Some forms were not populating consistently, records were sometimes > being dropped during select and insert queries, other forms needed to > be manually refreshed repeatedly in order to display all records, things like that. > The app worked fine when opened in design view - not when run from the > menu. > > This morning I bound the menu form to a small, 'fake' table in the > backend and everything seems back to normal now. > > Why would this method of establishing a persistent connection cause > issues? I found code like this on a couple of websites when I was > pursuing serious speed issues with the app. > > Thanks! > > Janet Erbach > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Mon Apr 6 18:46:07 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 16:46:07 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: It's a WordPress blog and I see a +Follow in the band at the top of the page. I'm using Chrome to view it. Charlotte Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Mon, Apr 6, 2015 at 9:41 AM, Dan Waters wrote: > Hi Bob, > > There is no Follow tab anywhere on the page. ??? > > Dan > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Bob Walsh > Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:34 AM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it > finally? > > Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at > http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Dan Waters > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it > finally? > > Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? > > And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Salakhetdinov Shamil > Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it > finally? > > > Hi All -- > FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: > > http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 > Thank you. -- > ???????????? ?????? > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The information > contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, and protected > from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not the intended > recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for delivering this message > to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, > distribution, or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If > you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately > and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From df.waters at outlook.com Mon Apr 6 19:23:55 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 2015 19:23:55 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? In-Reply-To: References: <1428192694.915897965@f66.i.mail.ru> Message-ID: I still don't. Perhaps it's due to the way I have my Chrome options set. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte Foust Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 6:46 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it finally? It's a WordPress blog and I see a +Follow in the band at the top of the page. I'm using Chrome to view it. Charlotte Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Mon, Apr 6, 2015 at 9:41 AM, Dan Waters wrote: > Hi Bob, > > There is no Follow tab anywhere on the page. ??? > > Dan > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Bob Walsh > Sent: Monday, April 06, 2015 10:34 AM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made > it finally? > > Cl;ick the Follow tab in the lower right corner of the article at > http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 and enter you email address. > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Dan Waters > Sent: Sunday, April 05, 2015 9:01 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made > it finally? > > Is it possible to sign up to receive Dick's blog? > > And, in the world of game-changers, this could be one! > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Salakhetdinov Shamil > Sent: Saturday, April 04, 2015 7:12 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: [AccessD] MS Access everywhere and forever - they've made it > finally? > > > Hi All -- > FYI: Dick Moffat's blog post of SQL Remote Apps: > > http://tinyurl.com/q94sek9 > Thank you. -- > ???????????? ?????? > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com IMPORTANT NOTE: The > information contained in this message may be privileged, confidential, > and protected from disclosure. If the reader of this message is not > the intended recipient, or an employee or agent responsible for > delivering this message to the intended recipient, you are hereby > notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying of this > communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this > communication in error, please notify us immediately and delete this message from your computer. Acumentra Health. > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com Tue Apr 7 15:32:31 2015 From: Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com (Kaup, Chester) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2015 20:32:31 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Null in table and code Message-ID: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB07E18BC7@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com> I have a field named oil in a table that is defined as numeric single. In some records this field is null. I have some code in which I have a variable defined as a single. When I try to write a field that is null from the table to the variable I get a message of invalid use of a null. How can a single in a table hold a null but a variable defined as a single in code not contain a null? From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Tue Apr 7 15:49:10 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2015 13:49:10 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Null in table and code In-Reply-To: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB07E18BC7@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com> References: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB07E18BC7@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com> Message-ID: You have to use a variant variable if you want to be able to handle nulls. Otherwise, just use the Nz() function to return a 0 or a -1 if the value is null. The null in the table means it's unpopulated, which you can correct for new records with a default value. You would need an update query to insert the "default" into records that are currently null. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Tue, Apr 7, 2015 at 1:32 PM, Kaup, Chester wrote: > I have a field named oil in a table that is defined as numeric single. In > some records this field is null. I have some code in which I have a > variable defined as a single. When I try to write a field that is null from > the table to the variable I get a message of invalid use of a null. How can > a single in a table hold a null but a variable defined as a single in code > not contain a null? > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com Tue Apr 7 16:11:02 2015 From: Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com (Kaup, Chester) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2015 21:11:02 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Null in table and code In-Reply-To: References: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB07E18BC7@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com> Message-ID: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB07E18BFD@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com> That makes sense. Some of the records in the table were just created with a date only as place holders. Thanks. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Charlotte Foust Sent: Tuesday, April 07, 2015 3:49 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Null in table and code You have to use a variant variable if you want to be able to handle nulls. Otherwise, just use the Nz() function to return a 0 or a -1 if the value is null. The null in the table means it's unpopulated, which you can correct for new records with a default value. You would need an update query to insert the "default" into records that are currently null. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Tue, Apr 7, 2015 at 1:32 PM, Kaup, Chester wrote: > I have a field named oil in a table that is defined as numeric single. > In some records this field is null. I have some code in which I have a > variable defined as a single. When I try to write a field that is null > from the table to the variable I get a message of invalid use of a > null. How can a single in a table hold a null but a variable defined > as a single in code not contain a null? > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg Tue Apr 7 17:33:28 2015 From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan) Date: Wed, 08 Apr 2015 08:33:28 +1000 Subject: [AccessD] Null in table and code In-Reply-To: References: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB07E18BC7@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>, Message-ID: <55245B38.28700.3DFAAC1C@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg> And edit the table design so that the default value for that field is 0 to avoid simnilar problems in future On 7 Apr 2015 at 13:49, Charlotte Foust wrote: > You have to use a variant variable if you want to be able to handle > nulls. Otherwise, just use the Nz() function to return a 0 or a -1 if > the value is null. The null in the table means it's unpopulated, > which you can correct for new records with a default value. You would > need an update query to insert the "default" into records that are > currently null. > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Tue, Apr 7, 2015 at 1:32 PM, Kaup, Chester > wrote: > > > I have a field named oil in a table that is defined as numeric > > single. In some records this field is null. I have some code in > > which I have a variable defined as a single. When I try to write a > > field that is null from the table to the variable I get a message of > > invalid use of a null. How can a single in a table hold a null but a > > variable defined as a single in code not contain a null? -- AccessD > > mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: > > http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From accessd at shaw.ca Wed Apr 8 10:41:09 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2015 09:41:09 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002> Message-ID: <1974810602.42318986.1428507669032.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Hi Janet: Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 Regards Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Lawrence" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It does depend on where your program is pulling data. There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is pulling and displaying a single record or small group of records from a local MDB database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a remote server and fill a table with the results... An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like comparing a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through out the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO type connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted the ADO data stream continued processing. There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 maximum number users, in stable environments but if you are using industrial sized data, ADO is the only way to go. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than AC2003....but so-be-it. > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) object > model for all of Access. DAO > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" is > just plain wrong. There is > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not steer. > > John W. Colby -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From bensonforums at gmail.com Wed Apr 8 16:26:09 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Wed, 8 Apr 2015 17:26:09 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <1974810602.42318986.1428507669032.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> References: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002> <1974810602.42318986.1428507669032.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit into your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can get there faster but needs to take more trips... Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is faster than DAO. I am now thoroughly confused. On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > Hi Janet: > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > Regards > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Lawrence" > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Hi Mark: > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is pulling > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a local MDB > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a remote > server and fill a table with the results... > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like comparing > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through out > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO type > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted the ADO > data stream continued processing. > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 maximum > number users, in stable environments but if you are using industrial sized > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Simms" > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) object > > model for all of Access. DAO > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" is > > just plain wrong. There is > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not steer. > > > > John W. Colby > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From fuller.artful at gmail.com Thu Apr 9 18:03:47 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2015 19:03:47 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: References: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002> <1974810602.42318986.1428507669032.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program that addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be manufactured easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. Test 1, using a local attached MDB Populate the listbox using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network Populate the listbox using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database Populate the listbox using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access version, but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. SQL version, Any volunteers? Arthur P.S. Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the network. I personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the data once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox from there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during the life of the program. On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson wrote: > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit into > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can get > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO is > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > faster than DAO. > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > > > Hi Janet: > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > Regards > > Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is pulling > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a local MDB > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a remote > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like comparing > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through out > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO type > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted the > ADO > > data stream continued processing. > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 maximum > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using industrial > sized > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Mark Simms" > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) object > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" is > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not steer. > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- Arthur From marksimms at verizon.net Thu Apr 9 19:15:48 2015 From: marksimms at verizon.net (Mark Simms) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2015 20:15:48 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: References: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002> <1974810602.42318986.1428507669032.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <01c301d07323$7fb43330$7f1c9990$@net> ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that > addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured > easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a > listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, > but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I > personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the > data > once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox > from > there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during > the > life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > > faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From jimdettman at verizon.net Thu Apr 9 20:22:47 2015 From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2015 21:22:47 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: References: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002> <1974810602.42318986.1428507669032.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <98D398AB37044E60ADA1C629F40B4871@XPS> << Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is faster than DAO. >> No, the first is incorrect. ADO does not run through DAO. They are two separate and distinct things. As for the second, for all but JET based DB's, ADO is usually faster. Part of that is ADO was designed to talk to a multitude of data sources, so you have a large amount of control over the cursor in regards to type, location, etc. But with a JET based data source, DAO is faster than ADO. The reason for that is what you'll find with ADO, your shoe horned into only a few "heavy weight" cursor types as soon as you talk to a JET DB despite what you ask for. DAO is more tightly integrated with the JET dbEngine as a whole. ADO has to jump through some hoops to do things because it's a generic data lib and was not specifically written to be used with JET, where as DAO was written only for JET and a handful of ISAM data stores. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bill Benson Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 05:26 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit into your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can get there faster but needs to take more trips... Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is faster than DAO. I am now thoroughly confused. On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > Hi Janet: > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > Regards > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Lawrence" > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Hi Mark: > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is pulling > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a local MDB > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a remote > server and fill a table with the results... > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like comparing > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through out > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO type > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted the ADO > data stream continued processing. > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 maximum > number users, in stable environments but if you are using industrial sized > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Simms" > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) object > > model for all of Access. DAO > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" is > > just plain wrong. There is > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not steer. > > > > John W. Colby > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg Thu Apr 9 23:03:25 2015 From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 14:03:25 +1000 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <98D398AB37044E60ADA1C629F40B4871@XPS> References: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002>, , <98D398AB37044E60ADA1C629F40B4871@XPS> Message-ID: <55274B8D.10804.49757AAD@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg> Just a minor point. JET (Joint Engine Technology) was used up to 2003 (.mdb) 2007 onweards (.accdb) was ACE (Access Connectivity Engine) but is now called Access Database Engine (unabbreviated). -- Stuart On 9 Apr 2015 at 21:22, Jim Dettman wrote: > << > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO > is faster than DAO. >> > > No, the first is incorrect. ADO does not run through DAO. They are > two > separate and distinct things. > > As for the second, for all but JET based DB's, ADO is usually faster. > Part > of that is ADO was designed to talk to a multitude of data sources, so > you have a large amount of control over the cursor in regards to type, > location, etc. > > But with a JET based data source, DAO is faster than ADO. The reason > for that is what you'll find with ADO, your shoe horned into only a > few "heavy weight" cursor types as soon as you talk to a JET DB > despite what you ask for. > > DAO is more tightly integrated with the JET dbEngine as a whole. ADO > has to jump through some hoops to do things because it's a generic > data lib and was not specifically written to be used with JET, where > as DAO was written only for JET and a handful of ISAM data stores. > > Jim. > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Bill Benson Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 05:26 PM To: Access > Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] > Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar > can get there faster but needs to take more trips... > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO > is faster than DAO. > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > > > Hi Janet: > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > Regards > > Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > > Part > 1 > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > > pulling and displaying a single record or small group of records > > from a local MDB database but have a DAO connection download 15K of > > records from a remote server and fill a table with the results... > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > > comparing a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving > > data. > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > > out the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > > type connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it > > restarted the > ADO > > data stream continued processing. > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > > maximum number users, in stable environments but if you are using > > industrial sized data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Mark Simms" > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > > Part > 1 > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > > > object model for all of Access. DAO is for programmers who need > > > to program to the metal of forms, querydefs, controls and so > > > forth. If you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" > > > is just plain wrong. There is not an electron that flows through > > > Access that DAO does not steer. > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From accessd at shaw.ca Fri Apr 10 01:16:04 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 00:16:04 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <01c301d07323$7fb43330$7f1c9990$@net> Message-ID: <750733326.43742896.1428646564304.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that > addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured > easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a > listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, > but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I > personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the > data > once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox > from > there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during > the > life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > > faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From darryl at whittleconsulting.com.au Fri Apr 10 01:30:44 2015 From: darryl at whittleconsulting.com.au (Darryl Collins) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 06:30:44 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <750733326.43742896.1428646564304.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> References: <01c301d07323$7fb43330$7f1c9990$@net> <750733326.43742896.1428646564304.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Yes... This has been my experience too. Personally I was say always use ADO over DAO. If you are ONLY using the local copy of Access and the data set is small than DAO is ok. I always use ADO regardless as then it is easy to swap the connection to SQL Server or whatever in the future in things start to outgrow MS Access, which (for me at least) is a frequent occurrence. That is just my experience. This stuff is a bit like religion. Everyone has an opinion, they all say there 'version' of the truth is best and want to join their 'team', but in reality none of them are perfect and much of it is just babble. There is no universal truth, just what works for you at the time. Tech also changes over time, so what was great back then is perhaps not so good now. I firmly fall into the ADO and unbound control camp when it comes to Access databases, which is pure heresy for some folks. But you know. Go with what works for you. Pro and cons for both ADO and DAO. I like the power, flexibility and scalability of ADO. Same reasons I prefer an Android phone over an iPhone I guess (another tech theological battle ground I know...). I have many good reasons to favour ADO over DAO, but some other folks have just as many reasons to go the other option as well. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, 10 April 2015 4:16 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured easily by any interested party. The basic test would be > to populate a listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network Populate the listbox > using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database Populate the listbox > using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, but the results should be proportionally similar across all > testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I personally have never tried this, but the possibility > exists: read the data once into a global array in the client MDB, and > populate the listbox from there anytime it's needed. This would avoid > all subsequent reads during the life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO > > is faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times > > > through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it > > > restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If you use ADO, it is all a > > > > layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From accessd at shaw.ca Fri Apr 10 02:10:37 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 01:10:37 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1123533642.43754509.1428649837530.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Actually DAO is the default data management protocol in MS Access but it is not related to ADO. ADO is a separate protocol that MS has included with all its Windows versions since Win98. ADO is not even in Access, it is totally separate API but it is always in the path. Check out the following link. It does not explain everything about ADO and DAO but it will give you some basic understanding on how both protocols can work together. http://dba.creativesystemdesigns.com/newsletters/newsletter112003/0311UnboundReports.asp Note: The above link is a connection to the DBA's test archive/website and it may be moved or changed at anytime. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Benson" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Wednesday, April 8, 2015 2:26:09 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit into your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can get there faster but needs to take more trips... Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is faster than DAO. I am now thoroughly confused. On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > Hi Janet: > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > Regards > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Lawrence" > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Hi Mark: > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is pulling > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a local MDB > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a remote > server and fill a table with the results... > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like comparing > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through out > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO type > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted the ADO > data stream continued processing. > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 maximum > number users, in stable environments but if you are using industrial sized > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Simms" > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) object > > model for all of Access. DAO > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" is > > just plain wrong. There is > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not steer. > > > > John W. Colby > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From accessd at shaw.ca Fri Apr 10 02:36:21 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 01:36:21 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1098676354.43763824.1428651381290.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Hi Darryl: I agree with you of course but there is one point to cover. People who traditionally swear by Bound records do so because they believe it is the only way to guarantee that multiple people are not working on the same record. Within the DAO-MDB environment that may be true. DAO has a method to protect against such an occurrence. ADO does not but that is because of two things; one it is built to use "professional" databases which are designed to share records correctly (ACID) and ADO has the feature which allows it to hold back a process commit, run the process and finally either roll-back or commit the transaction depending on the receipt of an error via a single of nested set of transactions. Try doing that with a few lines of code in DAO. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darryl Collins" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 11:30:44 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Yes... This has been my experience too. Personally I was say always use ADO over DAO. If you are ONLY using the local copy of Access and the data set is small than DAO is ok. I always use ADO regardless as then it is easy to swap the connection to SQL Server or whatever in the future in things start to outgrow MS Access, which (for me at least) is a frequent occurrence. That is just my experience. This stuff is a bit like religion. Everyone has an opinion, they all say there 'version' of the truth is best and want to join their 'team', but in reality none of them are perfect and much of it is just babble. There is no universal truth, just what works for you at the time. Tech also changes over time, so what was great back then is perhaps not so good now. I firmly fall into the ADO and unbound control camp when it comes to Access databases, which is pure heresy for some folks. But you know. Go with what works for you. Pro and cons for both ADO and DAO. I like the power, flexibility and scalability of ADO. Same reasons I prefer an Android phone over an iPhone I guess (another tech theological battle ground I know...). I have many good reasons to favour ADO over DAO, but some other folks have just as many reasons to go the other option as well. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, 10 April 2015 4:16 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured easily by any interested party. The basic test would be > to populate a listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network Populate the listbox > using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database Populate the listbox > using DAO Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, but the results should be proportionally similar across all > testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I personally have never tried this, but the possibility > exists: read the data once into a global array in the client MDB, and > populate the listbox from there anytime it's needed. This would avoid > all subsequent reads during the life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO > > is faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times > > > through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it > > > restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If you use ADO, it is all a > > > > layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From pcs.accessd at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 03:38:11 2015 From: pcs.accessd at gmail.com (Borge Hansen) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 16:38:11 +0800 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? Message-ID: Hi everyone, I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... Good to see all the familiar names still here... I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, nothing really came up Question: Office 2013 or 2010? The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 and Office 2003 I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over since year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP access. Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services provider: MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server MS 2012 R2 with IIS and SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) MS 2012 R2 for remote desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! About US$10,000 for setting up About US$1,000 per month for running this I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app that we have developed and are maintaining for them. I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current MS2003 Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb for temp files in the frontend. Home spun security. I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I have to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that road. For now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? /borge From bensonforums at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 03:48:07 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 04:48:07 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I think you are close enough to office 2016 horizon to skip 2013. I hate 2013 for access. I found 2010 Access quite stable, I don't seem able to develop in 2013 without for corruption issues fairly early on. Many times I cannot close tabs in Access by clicking the little x. It is just buggy in ways I can't even articulate... I plainly hate it. On Apr 10, 2015 4:39 AM, "Borge Hansen" wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, nothing > really came up > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 and > Office 2003 > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over since > year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). > Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP access. > Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services > provider: > MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server > MS 2012 R2 with IIS and SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) > MS 2012 R2 for remote desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! > About US$10,000 for setting up > About US$1,000 per month for running this > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook > (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app that we > have developed and are maintaining for them. > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current MS2003 > Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb for temp > files in the frontend. Home spun security. > I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I have > to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that road. For > now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > /borge > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg Fri Apr 10 04:33:51 2015 From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 19:33:51 +1000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: <552798FF.25116.DC8105@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg> Typical MS. Only go with every second version. The fist version is buggy - they get users to be unpaid beta testers. Then the next release does what the previous one should have. It applies to both Windows and Office. 2010 was what 2007 should have been 2013 buggy 2016 - should have sorted out most of the bugs again. -- Stuart On 10 Apr 2015 at 4:48, Bill Benson wrote: > I think you are close enough to office 2016 horizon to skip 2013. I > hate 2013 for access. I found 2010 Access quite stable, I don't seem > able to develop in 2013 without for corruption issues fairly early on. > Many times I cannot close tabs in Access by clicking the little x. It > is just buggy in ways I can't even articulate... I plainly hate it. On > Apr 10, 2015 4:39 AM, "Borge Hansen" wrote: > > > Hi everyone, > > > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, > > nothing really came up > > > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 > > and Office 2003 > > > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking > > over since year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). Last five years running > > on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP access. Now they are forced > > to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services provider: MS 2012 > > R2 Domain Controller and file server MS 2012 R2 with IIS and SQL > > Server (2012 Express to begin with) MS 2012 R2 for remote desktops > > - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! About US$10,000 for setting > > up About US$1,000 per month for running this > > > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and > > Outlook (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS > > Access app that we have developed and are maintaining for them. > > > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current > > MS2003 Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and > > mdb for temp files in the frontend. Home spun security. I am so > > familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I have > > to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that > > road. For now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the > > application. > > > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > > > /borge > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From jimdettman at verizon.net Fri Apr 10 05:27:26 2015 From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 06:27:26 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <750733326.43742896.1428646564304.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> References: <01c301d07323$7fb43330$7f1c9990$@net> <750733326.43742896.1428646564304.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <2BE978FB0C5447339C2D64A095389CE1@XPS> Jim, <> Your mixing things up there; DAO vs ADO and using different data stores. DAO in of itself does not cause corruption and it is no less stable than ADO. It's the RDBMS that determines the stability, not the data lib (unless of course it has an out right bug). Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 02:16 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that > addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured > easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a > listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, > but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I > personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the > data > once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox > from > there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during > the > life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > > faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From jimdettman at verizon.net Fri Apr 10 05:27:26 2015 From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 06:27:26 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <55274B8D.10804.49757AAD@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg> References: <295765967.132047834.1390635610176.JavaMail.root@cds002>, , <98D398AB37044E60ADA1C629F40B4871@XPS> <55274B8D.10804.49757AAD@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg> Message-ID: <4CB244B90B7F4FA68898A0F95037F4A9@XPS> Yeah but it's still fundamentally JET. Outside of a few new data types, there were no other changes. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Stuart McLachlan Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 12:03 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Just a minor point. JET (Joint Engine Technology) was used up to 2003 (.mdb) 2007 onweards (.accdb) was ACE (Access Connectivity Engine) but is now called Access Database Engine (unabbreviated). -- Stuart On 9 Apr 2015 at 21:22, Jim Dettman wrote: > << > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO > is faster than DAO. >> > > No, the first is incorrect. ADO does not run through DAO. They are > two > separate and distinct things. > > As for the second, for all but JET based DB's, ADO is usually faster. > Part > of that is ADO was designed to talk to a multitude of data sources, so > you have a large amount of control over the cursor in regards to type, > location, etc. > > But with a JET based data source, DAO is faster than ADO. The reason > for that is what you'll find with ADO, your shoe horned into only a > few "heavy weight" cursor types as soon as you talk to a JET DB > despite what you ask for. > > DAO is more tightly integrated with the JET dbEngine as a whole. ADO > has to jump through some hoops to do things because it's a generic > data lib and was not specifically written to be used with JET, where > as DAO was written only for JET and a handful of ISAM data stores. > > Jim. > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Bill Benson Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2015 05:26 PM To: Access > Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] > Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar > can get there faster but needs to take more trips... > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO > is faster than DAO. > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence wrote: > > > Hi Janet: > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > Regards > > Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > > Part > 1 > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > > pulling and displaying a single record or small group of records > > from a local MDB database but have a DAO connection download 15K of > > records from a remote server and fill a table with the results... > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > > comparing a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving > > data. > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > > out the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > > type connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it > > restarted the > ADO > > data stream continued processing. > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > > maximum number users, in stable environments but if you are using > > industrial sized data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > Jim > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Mark Simms" > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > > Part > 1 > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > > > object model for all of Access. DAO is for programmers who need > > > to program to the metal of forms, querydefs, controls and so > > > forth. If you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power users" > > > is just plain wrong. There is not an electron that flows through > > > Access that DAO does not steer. > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From dbdoug at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 09:38:02 2015 From: dbdoug at gmail.com (Doug Steele) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 07:38:02 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I also have been very happy with the stability of Access 2010, especially compared to Access 2007. Doug On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 1:38 AM, Borge Hansen wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, nothing > really came up > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 11:13:14 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 09:13:14 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I'm going to buck the trend here. I like 2013 and recommend it over 2010, but I work in both. Yes, I've seen some corruption issues in 2013, but not lately. An app migrated from 97 to 2003 needs to be updated and 2010 vs 2013 doesn't really matter. I just converted a 2003 to 2010 for a client, and I had to do some work to make sure it would run in Win 7 and beyond. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 1:38 AM, Borge Hansen wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, nothing > really came up > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 and > Office 2003 > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over since > year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). > Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP access. > Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services > provider: > MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server > MS 2012 R2 with IIS and SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) > MS 2012 R2 for remote desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! > About US$10,000 for setting up > About US$1,000 per month for running this > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook > (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app that we > have developed and are maintaining for them. > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current MS2003 > Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb for temp > files in the frontend. Home spun security. > I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I have > to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that road. For > now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > /borge > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From gustav at cactus.dk Fri Apr 10 11:50:25 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 16:50:25 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? Message-ID: Hi all I was beginning to feel alone ... I use A2013 a lot and A2010 and other versions very little. The only issue I've seen with A2013 is that is does not like a lot of design and code editing off a network drive ... suddenly it loses _all_ code. So either work off a local drive or create backups very frequently. Today with Office 2016 coming up I see no reason to go for A2010 except if you have some specific reason. /gustav -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] P? vegne af Charlotte Foust Sendt: 10. april 2015 18:13 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? I'm going to buck the trend here. I like 2013 and recommend it over 2010, but I work in both. Yes, I've seen some corruption issues in 2013, but not lately. An app migrated from 97 to 2003 needs to be updated and 2010 vs 2013 doesn't really matter. I just converted a 2003 to 2010 for a client, and I had to do some work to make sure it would run in Win 7 and beyond. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 1:38 AM, Borge Hansen wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, > nothing really came up > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 > and Office 2003 > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over > since year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). > Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP access. > Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services > provider: > MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server MS 2012 R2 with IIS and > SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) MS 2012 R2 for remote > desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! > About US$10,000 for setting up > About US$1,000 per month for running this > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook > (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app > that we have developed and are maintaining for them. > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current > MS2003 Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb > for temp files in the frontend. Home spun security. > I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I > have to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that > road. For now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > /borge From jimdettman at verizon.net Fri Apr 10 13:11:52 2015 From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 14:11:52 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47A90D502531479ABFE90A89581962E8@XPS> << for A2010 except if you have some specific reason>> There are a couple, as it's the last "full" version of Access for the desktop side. A2013 is when they dropped quite a few things and there is absolutely no choice with the ribbon. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gustav Brock Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 12:50 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? Hi all I was beginning to feel alone ... I use A2013 a lot and A2010 and other versions very little. The only issue I've seen with A2013 is that is does not like a lot of design and code editing off a network drive ... suddenly it loses _all_ code. So either work off a local drive or create backups very frequently. Today with Office 2016 coming up I see no reason to go for A2010 except if you have some specific reason. /gustav -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] P? vegne af Charlotte Foust Sendt: 10. april 2015 18:13 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? I'm going to buck the trend here. I like 2013 and recommend it over 2010, but I work in both. Yes, I've seen some corruption issues in 2013, but not lately. An app migrated from 97 to 2003 needs to be updated and 2010 vs 2013 doesn't really matter. I just converted a 2003 to 2010 for a client, and I had to do some work to make sure it would run in Win 7 and beyond. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 1:38 AM, Borge Hansen wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, > nothing really came up > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 > and Office 2003 > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over > since year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). > Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP access. > Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services > provider: > MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server MS 2012 R2 with IIS and > SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) MS 2012 R2 for remote > desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! > About US$10,000 for setting up > About US$1,000 per month for running this > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook > (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app > that we have developed and are maintaining for them. > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current > MS2003 Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb > for temp files in the frontend. Home spun security. > I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I > have to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that > road. For now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > /borge -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From fuller.artful at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 14:14:56 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 15:14:56 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Charlotte et. al., I haven't even moved off Access 2007, and despite all your comments about its bugginess, I can't think of an instance where it (as opposed to bugs in my own code) failed me. I've moved all of my recent and current development work our of Access and into Alpha Anywhere, but the last half-dozen or so Access apps I wrote were all in 2007, and all are still in use, and haven't received a bug report in years. Without consulting my Time&Billing app, I couldn't even guess to the nearest year when the last fix I did on one of them was. Maybe I've just been lucky. A. ? From accessd at shaw.ca Fri Apr 10 15:27:28 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 14:27:28 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <816375357.44263349.1428697648707.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> As you were using Access2007 when you bailed for Alpha Anywhere, definitely not a free or well used application, it does say something about A2007. ? Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arthur Fuller" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 12:14:56 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? Charlotte et. al., I haven't even moved off Access 2007, and despite all your comments about its bugginess, I can't think of an instance where it (as opposed to bugs in my own code) failed me. I've moved all of my recent and current development work our of Access and into Alpha Anywhere, but the last half-dozen or so Access apps I wrote were all in 2007, and all are still in use, and haven't received a bug report in years. Without consulting my Time&Billing app, I couldn't even guess to the nearest year when the last fix I did on one of them was. Maybe I've just been lucky. A. ? -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From gustav at cactus.dk Fri Apr 10 15:52:43 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 20:52:43 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: <47A90D502531479ABFE90A89581962E8@XPS> References: , <47A90D502531479ABFE90A89581962E8@XPS> Message-ID: <1428699163137.63679@cactus.dk> Hi Jim Yes, I know they exist but, apparently, I haven't bumped into any yet. /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Jim Dettman Sendt: 10. april 2015 20:11 Til: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? << for A2010 except if you have some specific reason>> There are a couple, as it's the last "full" version of Access for the desktop side. A2013 is when they dropped quite a few things and there is absolutely no choice with the ribbon. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gustav Brock Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 12:50 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? Hi all I was beginning to feel alone ... I use A2013 a lot and A2010 and other versions very little. The only issue I've seen with A2013 is that is does not like a lot of design and code editing off a network drive ... suddenly it loses _all_ code. So either work off a local drive or create backups very frequently. Today with Office 2016 coming up I see no reason to go for A2010 except if you have some specific reason. /gustav -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] P? vegne af Charlotte Foust Sendt: 10. april 2015 18:13 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? I'm going to buck the trend here. I like 2013 and recommend it over 2010, but I work in both. Yes, I've seen some corruption issues in 2013, but not lately. An app migrated from 97 to 2003 needs to be updated and 2010 vs 2013 doesn't really matter. I just converted a 2003 to 2010 for a client, and I had to do some work to make sure it would run in Win 7 and beyond. Charlotte Foust From accessd at shaw.ca Fri Apr 10 16:15:07 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 15:15:07 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <2BE978FB0C5447339C2D64A095389CE1@XPS> Message-ID: <82901315.44312673.1428700507006.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Hi Jim: This is all a combination of things, particularly of how DAO is used. Traditionally speaking a DAO connection to its data source is set to a persistent connection...drop the network a few times (power outages, rebooted server, licensing issues (even with site licenses) etc; coupled with no timeouts.) and there is data corruption. If it is not caught in time the whole BE MDB could end up being unreadable (back in 2003, the ministry I was working in banned the creation and use of branch built Access application for that exact reason..I was allowed to continue as I only used ADO and never had any data corruption issues). Maybe newer Access versions have been able to resolve this but I am not aware of it. IMHO, DAO just does not handle extenuating circumstances when disconnecting from its data-store. It appears to rip free from the BE and can have issues reconnecting. OTOH ADO, by its nature, is designed to disconnect gracefully from its data source. I may be wrong but I have never heard of an ADO connection or disconnection resulting data corruption. It is because the ADO protocol and the data sources that the protocol uses tend to be far more robust and function much better in unstable environments...among older equipment, extended networks, over the internet and in the Cloud. According to a Microsoft article, the ADO protocol (ADO.Net) not only is able to connect to RDBMS data sources, but now and more so in the future, be able to connect to a variety of Big Data store, like MongoDB and other similar products. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Dettman" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 3:27:26 AM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Jim, <> Your mixing things up there; DAO vs ADO and using different data stores. DAO in of itself does not cause corruption and it is no less stable than ADO. It's the RDBMS that determines the stability, not the data lib (unless of course it has an out right bug). Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 02:16 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that > addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured > easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a > listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, > but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I > personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the > data > once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox > from > there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during > the > life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > > faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From dbdoug at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 17:00:21 2015 From: dbdoug at gmail.com (Doug Steele) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 15:00:21 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... Message-ID: I have a problem with the code editor. I always assumed it was a flakey install of some kind on my computers, but I recently ran into the identical problem on a client's machine. Every few minutes, the code editor suddenly goes crazy, replacing any space you type with a backspace, sometimes mixing up letters after they've been typed, and apparently doing a debug/compile after every single character has been entered. It's really annoying and the only way I've found to fix it is to quit Access completely. I haven't found anything on the web. Any suggestions? Thanks, Doug From davidmcafee at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 17:05:55 2015 From: davidmcafee at gmail.com (David McAfee) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 15:05:55 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: could it be Spyware/malware? Does it behave like the old access bug where clicking into a text box would select all the text up to the cursor, or the cursor to the end (cant remember at the moment). On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 3:00 PM, Doug Steele wrote: > I have a problem with the code editor. I always assumed it was a flakey > install of some kind on my computers, but I recently ran into the identical > problem on a client's machine. Every few minutes, the code editor suddenly > goes crazy, replacing any space you type with a backspace, sometimes mixing > up letters after they've been typed, and apparently doing a debug/compile > after every single character has been entered. It's really annoying and > the only way I've found to fix it is to quit Access completely. > > I haven't found anything on the web. > > Any suggestions? > > Thanks, > Doug > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From gustav at cactus.dk Fri Apr 10 17:14:20 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 22:14:20 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk> Hi David That was/is not a bug but happens after you have pressed F8 one, two, or three times. Since version 1.0. /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af David McAfee Sendt: 11. april 2015 00:05 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... could it be Spyware/malware? Does it behave like the old access bug where clicking into a text box would select all the text up to the cursor, or the cursor to the end (cant remember at the moment). From fuller.artful at gmail.com Fri Apr 10 19:34:09 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 20:34:09 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: <1428699163137.63679@cactus.dk> References: <47A90D502531479ABFE90A89581962E8@XPS> <1428699163137.63679@cactus.dk> Message-ID: Jim, Not at all, at least in terms of bugs, and that's what I was referring to. I moved to Alpha because it can create serious business apps for phone, tablet, and browsers; and to sweeten the pie even more, it can do disconnected apps that synch when reconnected. Compared to that kind of functionality, the Access versions don't even come close. Arthur From marksimms at verizon.net Fri Apr 10 20:55:25 2015 From: marksimms at verizon.net (Mark Simms) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 21:55:25 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <02bd01d073fa$94258710$bc709530$@net> Bingo...I totally concur. AC 2013 = super buggy. I really had great results with both AC 2010 full and run-time. Only exception was computed fields....that was buggy in 2010....but workaroundable. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Bill Benson > Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 4:48 AM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? > > I think you are close enough to office 2016 horizon to skip 2013. I > hate > 2013 for access. I found 2010 Access quite stable, I don't seem able to > develop in 2013 without for corruption issues fairly early on. Many > times I > cannot close tabs in Access by clicking the little x. It is just buggy > in > ways I can't even articulate... I plainly hate it. > On Apr 10, 2015 4:39 AM, "Borge Hansen" wrote: > > > Hi everyone, > > > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, > nothing > > really came up > > > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 > and > > Office 2003 > > > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over > since > > year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). > > Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP > access. > > Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services > > provider: > > MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server > > MS 2012 R2 with IIS and SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) > > MS 2012 R2 for remote desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! > > About US$10,000 for setting up > > About US$1,000 per month for running this > > > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook > > (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app > that we > > have developed and are maintaining for them. > > > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current > MS2003 > > Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb for > temp > > files in the frontend. Home spun security. > > I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I > have > > to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that road. > For > > now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. > > > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > > > /borge > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From marksimms at verizon.net Fri Apr 10 20:56:29 2015 From: marksimms at verizon.net (Mark Simms) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 21:56:29 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <02be01d073fa$bac70dd0$30552970$@net> Sorry...disagree...2013....a disaster. Corruption, hang-ups galore. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Charlotte Foust > Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 12:13 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? > > I'm going to buck the trend here. I like 2013 and recommend it over > 2010, > but I work in both. Yes, I've seen some corruption issues in 2013, but > not > lately. An app migrated from 97 to 2003 needs to be updated and 2010 > vs > 2013 doesn't really matter. I just converted a 2003 to 2010 for a > client, > and I had to do some work to make sure it would run in Win 7 and > beyond. > > > > Charlotte Foust > (916) 206-4336 > > On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 1:38 AM, Borge Hansen > wrote: > > > Hi everyone, > > > > I have not been frequenting the forum for a while... > > Good to see all the familiar names still here... > > > > I did a quick search here on the forum about Access 2010 vs 2013, > nothing > > really came up > > > > Question: Office 2013 or 2010? > > > > The question is forced upon us with the sunsetting of MS Server 2003 > and > > Office 2003 > > > > I have a client with a MS Access 2003 app that have been ticking over > since > > year 2000 (yes, it was A97 then). > > Last five years running on a MS 2003 Server in the cloud - RDP > access. > > Now they are forced to upgrade their Server with their Cloud Services > > provider: > > MS 2012 R2 Domain Controller and file server > > MS 2012 R2 with IIS and SQL Server (2012 Express to begin with) > > MS 2012 R2 for remote desktops - six in all with Office 2010 32 bit!! > > About US$10,000 for setting up > > About US$1,000 per month for running this > > > > I've recommended Office 2010 32 bit for their Word, Excel and Outlook > > (Exchange server hosted elsewhere) and of course the MS Access app > that we > > have developed and are maintaining for them. > > > > I have checked on our local virtual Windows 7 box that the current > MS2003 > > Access app runs ok on MS Access 2010... SQL Db backend and mdb for > temp > > files in the frontend. Home spun security. > > I am so familiar with MSAccess 2003 - the ribbon is still something I > have > > to figure out how to incorporate into the UI if we go down that road. > For > > now we will stick with the old 2003 menu bespoke for the application. > > > > What do you recommend 2010 or 2013 ?? > > > > /borge > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From accessd at shaw.ca Fri Apr 10 21:17:42 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2015 20:17:42 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1760306652.44498115.1428718662466.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Hi Arthur: I can see not reason to disagree with you on that list of attributes. :-) Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Arthur Fuller" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 5:34:09 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] MS Access 2010 or MS Access 2013 ?? Jim, Not at all, at least in terms of bugs, and that's what I was referring to. I moved to Alpha because it can create serious business apps for phone, tablet, and browsers; and to sweeten the pie even more, it can do disconnected apps that synch when reconnected. Compared to that kind of functionality, the Access versions don't even come close. Arthur -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From jimdettman at verizon.net Sat Apr 11 11:53:56 2015 From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman) Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2015 12:53:56 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: <82901315.44312673.1428700507006.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> References: <2BE978FB0C5447339C2D64A095389CE1@XPS> <82901315.44312673.1428700507006.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: Jim, Again, you mixing up the data access library with the database engine. If your using JET and you have a flakey network, you run just as much chance of corruption with ADO as you do with DAO. Neither DAO or ADO talk directly to a MDB file; they make calls to the database engine (and with ADO it has to go through a OLEDB provider, which is why DAO is faster for talking to MDBs) and it's the engine that manipulates the MDB file. When your using JET, that manipulation takes place client side as there is no server side process. Two points that bear this out: 1. If you were running an app with nothing but ADO that was JET based, and you flipped the power off during a write, the DB would corrupt just as it would if you were using DAO. 2. If you use DAO and access SQL Server via ODBC with it, no matter what you do, you will not see a corruption. DAO in of itself has nothing to do with corruption. It's the RDBMS being used that determines that. So if your using a JET based DB as it should be used (on a local LAN), then DAO is the best lib to use. If your using anything else, then ADO is a better choice. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 05:15 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Jim: This is all a combination of things, particularly of how DAO is used. Traditionally speaking a DAO connection to its data source is set to a persistent connection...drop the network a few times (power outages, rebooted server, licensing issues (even with site licenses) etc; coupled with no timeouts.) and there is data corruption. If it is not caught in time the whole BE MDB could end up being unreadable (back in 2003, the ministry I was working in banned the creation and use of branch built Access application for that exact reason..I was allowed to continue as I only used ADO and never had any data corruption issues). Maybe newer Access versions have been able to resolve this but I am not aware of it. IMHO, DAO just does not handle extenuating circumstances when disconnecting from its data-store. It appears to rip free from the BE and can have issues reconnecting. OTOH ADO, by its nature, is designed to disconnect gracefully from its data source. I may be wrong but I have never heard of an ADO connection or disconnection resulting data corruption. It is because the ADO protocol and the data sources that the protocol uses tend to be far more robust and function much better in unstable environments...among older equipment, extended networks, over the internet and in the Cloud. According to a Microsoft article, the ADO protocol (ADO.Net) not only is able to connect to RDBMS data sources, but now and more so in the future, be able to connect to a variety of Big Data store, like MongoDB and other similar products. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Dettman" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 3:27:26 AM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Jim, <> Your mixing things up there; DAO vs ADO and using different data stores. DAO in of itself does not cause corruption and it is no less stable than ADO. It's the RDBMS that determines the stability, not the data lib (unless of course it has an out right bug). Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 02:16 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that > addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured > easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a > listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, > but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I > personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the > data > once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox > from > there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during > the > life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > > faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From charlotte.foust at gmail.com Sat Apr 11 13:24:24 2015 From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust) Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2015 11:24:24 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... In-Reply-To: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk> References: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk> Message-ID: Do you mean when you're not in break mode, Gustav? I've seen the behavior on occasion but never found a connection to F8. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 3:14 PM, Gustav Brock wrote: > Hi David > > That was/is not a bug but happens after you have pressed F8 one, two, or > three times. > Since version 1.0. > > /gustav > > ________________________________________ > Fra: AccessD p? vegne af David > McAfee > Sendt: 11. april 2015 00:05 > Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Emne: Re: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... > > could it be Spyware/malware? > > Does it behave like the old access bug where clicking into a text box would > select all the text up to the cursor, or the cursor to the end (cant > remember at the moment). > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From gustav at cactus.dk Sat Apr 11 16:10:22 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2015 21:10:22 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... In-Reply-To: References: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk>, Message-ID: <1428786621767.22695@cactus.dk> Hi Charlotte Hmm ... I just tried with A2013 and it seems not to be sticky. Press F8 and you select word/field/record and vice-versa with Shift+F8. I recall it as sticky but haven't used/tried it for years, so perhaps I've just seen a persistent bug. Sorry for the confusion. /gustav ________________________________________ Fra: AccessD p? vegne af Charlotte Foust Sendt: 11. april 2015 20:24 Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Emne: Re: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... Do you mean when you're not in break mode, Gustav? I've seen the behavior on occasion but never found a connection to F8. Charlotte Foust (916) 206-4336 On Fri, Apr 10, 2015 at 3:14 PM, Gustav Brock wrote: > Hi David > > That was/is not a bug but happens after you have pressed F8 one, two, or three times. > Since version 1.0. > > /gustav > > ________________________________________ > Fra: AccessD p? vegne af David > McAfee > Sendt: 11. april 2015 00:05 > Til: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Emne: Re: [AccessD] Speaking of Access 2007... > > could it be Spyware/malware? > > Does it behave like the old access bug where clicking into a text box would select all the text up to the cursor, or the cursor to the end (cant remember at the moment). From accessd at shaw.ca Sun Apr 12 14:16:33 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Sun, 12 Apr 2015 13:16:33 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1828844621.45422882.1428866193868.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Hi Jim: I admit that I am mixing data access and the data engine. How can they be separated? IMHO, If you have set up an ADO type connection properly there is not evidence to ADO causing data corruption. I have never experienced it but with DAO, sigh... I agree with you that just connecting ADO and/or DAO, DAO is always faster but this is where data access and data engine come into play. DAO just doesn't scale and is prone to data corruption, but it is only on larger networks...at least that has always been my experience. DAO may have improved its stability since my separation from the product as I have not used it since around 2000...as it is a 15 years old view. Data corruption is always possible but for one feature that should be extensively used...I believe it is only available with ADO. Before staring a transaction with the data server, I always initialize it with a "BeginTrans" statement, then run the transaction and if there are any errors, the transaction is rolled back, otherwise it is committed. I can not say that an error with the data has never resulted from this method, but in over a decade I have been completely unaware of any data corruption caused using transaction method. Note additionally, I never keep a persistent connection with the data source...connect, do the business and disconnect. One more scenario that I have experienced is with branch sized networks. The government would buy ministry wide site licences and then standardise on a single desktop image, which could be deployed through out the entire network. This worked very efficiently but in some cases, no one every figured out why, MS Access would get confused. Using non persistent connections and/or the ADO provider eliminated such issues...and as it resolved the problem no one followed up on solving it. Maybe you know the cause and have a solution? Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Dettman" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2015 9:53:56 AM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Jim, Again, you mixing up the data access library with the database engine. If your using JET and you have a flakey network, you run just as much chance of corruption with ADO as you do with DAO. Neither DAO or ADO talk directly to a MDB file; they make calls to the database engine (and with ADO it has to go through a OLEDB provider, which is why DAO is faster for talking to MDBs) and it's the engine that manipulates the MDB file. When your using JET, that manipulation takes place client side as there is no server side process. Two points that bear this out: 1. If you were running an app with nothing but ADO that was JET based, and you flipped the power off during a write, the DB would corrupt just as it would if you were using DAO. 2. If you use DAO and access SQL Server via ODBC with it, no matter what you do, you will not see a corruption. DAO in of itself has nothing to do with corruption. It's the RDBMS being used that determines that. So if your using a JET based DB as it should be used (on a local LAN), then DAO is the best lib to use. If your using anything else, then ADO is a better choice. Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 05:15 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Jim: This is all a combination of things, particularly of how DAO is used. Traditionally speaking a DAO connection to its data source is set to a persistent connection...drop the network a few times (power outages, rebooted server, licensing issues (even with site licenses) etc; coupled with no timeouts.) and there is data corruption. If it is not caught in time the whole BE MDB could end up being unreadable (back in 2003, the ministry I was working in banned the creation and use of branch built Access application for that exact reason..I was allowed to continue as I only used ADO and never had any data corruption issues). Maybe newer Access versions have been able to resolve this but I am not aware of it. IMHO, DAO just does not handle extenuating circumstances when disconnecting from its data-store. It appears to rip free from the BE and can have issues reconnecting. OTOH ADO, by its nature, is designed to disconnect gracefully from its data source. I may be wrong but I have never heard of an ADO connection or disconnection resulting data corruption. It is because the ADO protocol and the data sources that the protocol uses tend to be far more robust and function much better in unstable environments...among older equipment, extended networks, over the internet and in the Cloud. According to a Microsoft article, the ADO protocol (ADO.Net) not only is able to connect to RDBMS data sources, but now and more so in the future, be able to connect to a variety of Big Data store, like MongoDB and other similar products. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Dettman" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 3:27:26 AM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Jim, <> Your mixing things up there; DAO vs ADO and using different data stores. DAO in of itself does not cause corruption and it is no less stable than ADO. It's the RDBMS that determines the stability, not the data lib (unless of course it has an out right bug). Jim. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jim Lawrence Sent: Friday, April 10, 2015 02:16 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 Hi Mark: It depends on how much data you are working with. If you are strictly comparing DAO interfacing with an MDB and/or you are comparing ADO's performance via ODBC then, yes DAO runs quicker but... As soon as the amount of data starts approaching a few 100K of records, and/or you are using ADO-OLE data connections and/or you are accessing a professional level DB, like MS SQL, MySQL/MariaDB, Oracle, Postgrese and so on then ADO performance pulls ahead dramatically. In addition, the extra functionality and stability that ADO has far outstrips DAO. In summary, if I was creating a small network, in a stable environment, with a limited set of data, DAO-MDB would be the database of choice but the first moment the data corrupted, the connections started dropping and the number of records grew to exceed 100K, it would be time to start thinking of an upgrade. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Thursday, April 9, 2015 5:15:48 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... Part 1 ADO = Slow D O. DAO will be at least 2x faster. > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Arthur Fuller > Sent: Thursday, April 09, 2015 7:04 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on network... > Part 1 > > I would suggest that it is time for someone to write a test program > that > addresses either a publicly available table or one that can be > manufactured > easily by any interested party. The basic test would be to populate a > listbox with 1000 rows of data from said table. > > Test 1, using a local attached MDB > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 2, using an attached MDB on the network > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Test 3, using an attached SQL Server database > Populate the listbox using DAO > Populate the listbox using ADO. > > Obviously results will vary given hardware, cabling, and Access > version, > but the results should be proportionally similar across all testbeds. > SQL > version, Any volunteers? > > Arthur > > P.S. > Another idea also occurs to me, relevant only to the MDB on the > network. I > personally have never tried this, but the possibility exists: read the > data > once into a global array in the client MDB, and populate the listbox > from > there anytime it's needed. This would avoid all subsequent reads during > the > life of the program. > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 5:26 PM, Bill Benson > wrote: > > > Very interesting. My follow up would be, how much data can you fit > into > > your sportscar versus the 18 wheeler? I would say the sportscar can > get > > there faster but needs to take more trips... > > > > Seriously, where is the final analysis on this? John C is saying DAO > is > > present at all times directing traffic, yet Jim is saying that ADO is > > faster than DAO. > > > > I am now thoroughly confused. > > > > On Wed, Apr 8, 2015 at 11:41 AM, Jim Lawrence > wrote: > > > > > Hi Janet: > > > > > > Here is some questions answered about using ADO...1 of 3 > > > > > > Regards > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Jim Lawrence" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 11:40:10 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Hi Mark: > > > > > > It does depend on where your program is pulling data. > > > > > > There is no substitute for speed when a local DAO connection is > pulling > > > and displaying a single record or small group of records from a > local MDB > > > database but have a DAO connection download 15K of records from a > remote > > > server and fill a table with the results... > > > > > > An ADO connection can do that in one to two seconds. It is like > comparing > > > a sports car to an 8 wheel semi, when it comes to moving data. > > > > > > In addition, shut down the central MDB database a few times through > out > > > the day and you would be lucky not to corrupt your database. ADO > type > > > connections expect delays...rebooted a MS SQL and when it restarted > the > > ADO > > > data stream continued processing. > > > > > > There are trade offs for sure; DAO is great for small 2 to a 50 > maximum > > > number users, in stable environments but if you are using > industrial > > sized > > > data, ADO is the only way to go. > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Simms" > > > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" < > > > accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > > > Sent: Friday, January 24, 2014 6:55:13 PM > > > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Problem of a listbox's response on > network... > > Part 1 > > > > > > Not to mention that ADO is SLOOOOWWW-D-O. > > > Omigosh, I love the speed of DAO. Yes, AC2010 is a bit slower than > > > AC2003....but so-be-it. > > > > > > > Excuse me? DAO is the database engine AND (more importantly) > object > > > > model for all of Access. DAO > > > > is for programmers who need to program to the metal of forms, > > > > querydefs, controls and so forth. If > > > > you use ADO, it is all a layer on top of DAO. > > > > > > > > I am not disagreeing that ADO has its place, but "for power > users" is > > > > just plain wrong. There is > > > > not an electron that flows through Access that DAO does not > steer. > > > > > > > > John W. Colby > > > > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From sturner at mseco.com Fri Apr 17 13:45:10 2015 From: sturner at mseco.com (Steve Turner) Date: Fri, 17 Apr 2015 18:45:10 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Access droping linked tables from Database. Message-ID: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF35B6@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> Help, I have an Access Database for some reports that are standard. In attempting to add a new report I needed to link a couple of tables not in the database. When I create a new link with ODBC to link in a table from SQL Express I have a table dbo_Employee in the database that when I hover on the table is linking to another table than the name. I've deleted it and linked to the correct table and even made a copy in the database. When I close the database and reopen it the new tables are gone and the old dbo_Employee is back. This table only had 4 columns out of the entire Employee file for some reason. This is not happening in any of our other databases with linked tables to the same data. I will say that the report and qry that I imported to it is still in the database. [Mid-South_email_signature_1in_300dpi] Steve A. Turner Controller Office 501-321-2276 Fax 501-321-4750 Cell 501-282-7751 sturner at mseco.com 1658 Malvern Avenue Hot Springs, AR 71901 P.O. Box 1399, AR 71902 www.mseco.com From marksimms at verizon.net Sat Apr 18 10:52:36 2015 From: marksimms at verizon.net (Mark Simms) Date: Sat, 18 Apr 2015 11:52:36 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Access droping linked tables from Database. In-Reply-To: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF35B6@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> References: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF35B6@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> Message-ID: <016e01d079ef$b13f88a0$13be99e0$@net> As should be customary....Always, ALWAYS mention the release of Access for which there is a problem. Access is so....release sensitive. AC2013: bug-city. > > Help, > I have an Access Database for some reports that are standard. In > attempting to add a new report I needed to link a couple of tables not > in the database. When I create a new link with ODBC to link in a table > from SQL Express I have a table dbo_Employee in the database that when > I hover on the table is linking to another table than the name. I've > deleted it and linked to the correct table and even made a copy in the > database. When I close the database and reopen it the new tables are > gone and the old dbo_Employee is back. This table only had 4 columns > out of the entire Employee file for some reason. This is not happening > in any of our other databases with linked tables to the same data. I > will say that the report and qry that I imported to it is still in the > database. > From jwcolby at gmail.com Sun Apr 19 20:22:28 2015 From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John W. Colby) Date: Sun, 19 Apr 2015 21:22:28 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Import excel web links Message-ID: <553454D4.2060903@gmail.com> I am trying to import Excel spreadsheets that are a column of links. The thing I see is the description of the link, underlying which is a link to the web page. When I try to import (or link) to the excel spreadsheet, I end up with the description, and lose the link. Any secret sauce to get both as two columns? -- John W. Colby From fuller.artful at gmail.com Sun Apr 19 20:53:18 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Sun, 19 Apr 2015 21:53:18 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Import excel web links In-Reply-To: <553454D4.2060903@gmail.com> References: <553454D4.2060903@gmail.com> Message-ID: JC, I have never tried this, but did you use Paste Special? A. On Sun, Apr 19, 2015 at 9:22 PM, John W. Colby wrote: > I am trying to import Excel spreadsheets that are a column of links. The > thing I see is the description of the link, underlying which is a link to > the web page. When I try to import (or link) to the excel spreadsheet, I > end up with the description, and lose the link. > > Any secret sauce to get both as two columns? From davidmcafee at gmail.com Wed Apr 22 13:07:26 2015 From: davidmcafee at gmail.com (David McAfee) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2015 11:07:26 -0700 Subject: [AccessD] Database of databases (Field Types) Message-ID: Sorry for the cross posts, I just wanted to get as many possible opinions as possible... I have a database that I use for my SSIS procedure where we import records from various Access DBs into a SQL Server "mini data warehouse" I'm trying to compare fields for such conditions such as "added", "removed", "type change" or "size increase", so I can flag the field and trap for it at import time. Over the years, some of the tables have had fields added to them and some removed. When removed, I currently leave them in the SQL version, and bring them in as null. I don't know whether or not I should add a boolean "DontUse" field as I do for theMDBs for fields in the new tables that I am adding. I am also not sure if I should do it in tblFields or tblfieldsInTable (See below). Another idea that I am playing with is to add a "DateRemoved" column instead of a boolean, then I kind of have a historical record of when it was added and when it was removed. If I use this dateRemoved approach, should I re-add the field if it ever gets added back (should never happen)? I was also thinking of adding another table to deal with field status (added/removed), but I think that is over complicating things. With this design, I will have duplicate field names if it increases in size. Let's say ClientName_First is a text (35) and down the road it changes to a text (50) then later on maybe shortened to a text(25). I will only have the records for text (35) and text (50). I will always group and grab max size when comparing, so I will always look for ClientName_First with a text(>50) or of a different type. I could further normalize table Fields and break out the size and type to a different table, but again, I'm not sure if the added complication is worth it. Any thoughts/comments? I have the following tables: tblMDBs (a table of the source databases that are imported) MDBID (PK) MDBPath MDBName DateModified Version DoNotImportToSQL entryDate tbltables (a table of Tables) tblID tblName entryDate tblMDBTableJunct 9Junction table to match the tables to databases) JunctPKID, MDBID, tblID The new fields & tables that I am adding are: tblFields (Field names and types) FieldID FieldName FieldType FieldSize tblfieldsInTable (a junction table that links the field to the table (and database)) FITPKID (PK) JunctPKID (FK) FieldID (FK) ErrorFlagID (FK) entryDate tblErrorFlags ErrorFlagID ErrorFlagDescription these are the error flags: ErrorFlagID ErrorDescription 1 Field type has changed 2 Field size is larger 3 The field has been removed 4 A new field has been added From sturner at mseco.com Thu Apr 23 16:56:43 2015 From: sturner at mseco.com (Steve Turner) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2015 21:56:43 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Access droping linked tables from Database. In-Reply-To: <016e01d079ef$b13f88a0$13be99e0$@net> References: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF35B6@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> <016e01d079ef$b13f88a0$13be99e0$@net> Message-ID: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF4C8A@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> ? Steve A. Turner Mark, Sorry haven't posted in awhile. We use Access 2010. Steve -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Mark Simms Sent: Saturday, April 18, 2015 10:53 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: Re: [AccessD] Access droping linked tables from Database. As should be customary....Always, ALWAYS mention the release of Access for which there is a problem. Access is so....release sensitive. AC2013: bug-city. > > Help, > I have an Access Database for some reports that are standard. In > attempting to add a new report I needed to link a couple of tables not > in the database. When I create a new link with ODBC to link in a table > from SQL Express I have a table dbo_Employee in the database that when > I hover on the table is linking to another table than the name. I've > deleted it and linked to the correct table and even made a copy in the > database. When I close the database and reopen it the new tables are > gone and the old dbo_Employee is back. This table only had 4 columns > out of the entire Employee file for some reason. This is not happening > in any of our other databases with linked tables to the same data. I > will say that the report and qry that I imported to it is still in the > database. > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Mon Apr 27 08:49:50 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 13:49:50 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Import excel web links In-Reply-To: <553454D4.2060903@gmail.com> References: <553454D4.2060903@gmail.com> Message-ID: That special sauce may be here... https://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/office/en-US/a79d1eec-32cb-44be-95f7-c2645a654a52/import-excel-into-access-and-preserve-hyperlinks Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John W. Colby Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2015 9:22 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: [AccessD] Import excel web links I am trying to import Excel spreadsheets that are a column of links. The thing I see is the description of the link, underlying which is a link to the web page. When I try to import (or link) to the excel spreadsheet, I end up with the description, and lose the link. Any secret sauce to get both as two columns? -- John W. Colby -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From accessd at shaw.ca Mon Apr 27 12:48:46 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 11:48:46 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Microsoft has changed In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <473379461.59758475.1430156926631.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> In a small town, just south of the border, called Belingham, at their technical college, the annual Linuxfest just wrapped up (http://linuxfestnorthwest.org/2015). When the fest started there were only about a hundred in attendance but now several thousand come every year and it just keeps growing. Different from other years though, Microsoft was in there and in full force with the biggest booth. MS has switched direction and according to the staff everything is changing at Redmond campus. Allow me to paraphrase some of the high-points of the conversation: Microsoft is no longer going to be a competitor to Linux, Linux is now considered a first class citizen. Eventually, all their products will run on Linux and Linux will run in all their environments. Linux is considered the platform of invention and therefore Microsoft will support the platform's innovations. Microsoft will stick strictly to industry standards rather than try to create them. Their service and support staff will have to be fully training in using Linux as well as Windows. Microsoft wants to be a service company, that also sells products...not the other way around. Within the company the developers run both Linux and Windows and trained Linux gurus are being deployed to all their offices around the world. To this end, system's people are being gathered from Africa, South America, Europe, Asia and any other area that predominantly uses Linux. Within North America, business may be Linux but governments have not yet embraced it...but that will change. Microsoft is no longer going to write code that has already been written. Open source products are being fully embraced: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/openness/index.aspx#home Microsoft will now support many of the open source programming languages like PHP, Python and so on. Azure is being designed to support any platform...Windows or Linux or any combination of the same. What this means is that young people planning a career in the computer industry better be fully versed in both Linux and Microsoft. I personally think all this is great! I look forward to running my MS Access on Linux without the need for products like "Wine" and be able to develop and compile .Net/JavaScript code on my Linux platform via a fully compatible VS editor. Aside: Microsoft is making a version of Windows10 that can be containerised and deployed through the Cloud via such products as Docker, all on top of Linux (...or Windows Hyper-V). Everything will now be desktop, web and Cloud based...so there is an incredible amount of learning to take... I understand that there are free courses being given on all components of how to interface Linux and Windows products within Azure. I hate to brag (actually I don't) but I have been saying and hoping for this all along and now it seems to be coming true. Jim PS Microsoft will fully supports distros Ubuntu (all debian based distros) and Suse Linux. From marksimms at verizon.net Mon Apr 27 19:31:49 2015 From: marksimms at verizon.net (Mark Simms) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 20:31:49 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Microsoft has changed In-Reply-To: <473379461.59758475.1430156926631.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> References: <473379461.59758475.1430156926631.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> Message-ID: <028301d0814a$ba52b590$2ef820b0$@net> Re: "What this means is that young people planning a career in the computer industry better be fully versed in both Linux and Microsoft" This may be true, but there are no American young people considering a career in IT. When I go to the monthly meetings at my local Microsoft office, it's all 40+. From accessd at shaw.ca Mon Apr 27 21:22:10 2015 From: accessd at shaw.ca (Jim Lawrence) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 2015 20:22:10 -0600 (MDT) Subject: [AccessD] Microsoft has changed In-Reply-To: <028301d0814a$ba52b590$2ef820b0$@net> Message-ID: <2397901.60185161.1430187730927.JavaMail.root@shaw.ca> We had a small Linux conference up at the University and there was at least a hundred there maybe more. I sat with the old guys but most of the audience were young guys and a few gals, in their twenties. It is going to be hard for Microsoft to attract the future generation of IT guys to their ranks...they seem to be doing all the right things, now...but I think it will take a long time to forget the Balmer years. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Simms" To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" Sent: Monday, April 27, 2015 5:31:49 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Microsoft has changed Re: "What this means is that young people planning a career in the computer industry better be fully versed in both Linux and Microsoft" This may be true, but there are no American young people considering a career in IT. When I go to the monthly meetings at my local Microsoft office, it's all 40+. -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From fuller.artful at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 10:30:16 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 11:30:16 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Error message on some queries Message-ID: I keep getting the following error, only when trying to go into Design Mode or Save, when attempting either operation on a named query: " is not a valid name. Make sure that it does not include invalid characters or punctuation and that it is not too long. I haven't done anything, SFAICS, to create this situation. It's occurring in one of the samples (TimeBilling 2007 version), and on several named queries therein. I've already tried deleting them and rebuilding them, but still get the error. At least a few of the queries in question came with the sample app, so I'm seriously puzzled about this. Despite the message, I can load the query, but when I attempt to save it, this message comes up. And sometimes it comes up on the attempt to load the query in Design mode, but then it lets me change the query, but not to save it (the message comes up again). Any suggestions as to what causes this or how to fix it are most welcome. -- Arthur From bensonforums at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 10:48:42 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 11:48:42 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Error message on some queries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Is there any chance that your queries refer to a field named "Cycle"? Probably you already saw this: http://msgroups.net/microsoft.public.access.queries/-is-not-a-valid-name-make-sur/52821 On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 11:30 AM, Arthur Fuller wrote: > I keep getting the following error, only when trying to go into Design Mode > or Save, when attempting either operation on a named query: > > " is not a valid name. Make sure that it does not include invalid > characters or punctuation and that it is not too long. > > I haven't done anything, SFAICS, to create this situation. It's occurring > in one of the samples (TimeBilling 2007 version), and on several named > queries therein. I've already tried deleting them and rebuilding them, but > still get the error. At least a few of the queries in question came with > the sample app, so I'm seriously puzzled about this. Despite the message, I > can load the query, but when I attempt to save it, this message comes up. > And sometimes it comes up on the attempt to load the query in Design mode, > but then it lets me change the query, but not to save it (the message comes > up again). > > Any suggestions as to what causes this or how to fix it are most welcome. > > -- > Arthur > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From sturner at mseco.com Tue Apr 28 11:20:26 2015 From: sturner at mseco.com (Steve Turner) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 16:20:26 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] Access dropping linked tables Message-ID: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF6195@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> Found the problem with tables disappearing. Our programmer set up an autoexec macro that deletes all tables and rebuilds them every time you open the database. Found the module with the code so we will add the new tables to the list. Steve A. Turner From bensonforums at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 14:40:12 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 15:40:12 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Access dropping linked tables In-Reply-To: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF6195@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> References: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF6195@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> Message-ID: Whew! I thought - for a minute there - that we might have found the first ever reported Bug in Acces 2013 8Q On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 12:20 PM, Steve Turner wrote: > Found the problem with tables disappearing. Our programmer set up an > autoexec macro that deletes all tables and rebuilds them every time you > open the database. Found the module with the code so we will add the new > tables to the list. > > > > Steve A. Turner > > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From jwcolby at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 14:55:13 2015 From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John W. Colby) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 15:55:13 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] Access dropping linked tables In-Reply-To: References: <1A6CD46475758F4F8020637077D534ADABEF6195@EXCHANGE9.win.zerolag.com> Message-ID: <553FE5A1.30204@gmail.com> ROTFL. I needed that laugh!! John W. Colby On 4/28/2015 3:40 PM, Bill Benson wrote: > Whew! I thought - for a minute there - that we might have found the first > ever reported Bug in Acces 2013 > 8Q > > On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 12:20 PM, Steve Turner wrote: > >> Found the problem with tables disappearing. Our programmer set up an >> autoexec macro that deletes all tables and rebuilds them every time you >> open the database. Found the module with the code so we will add the new >> tables to the list. >> >> >> >> Steve A. Turner >> >> >> >> -- >> AccessD mailing list >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >> From df.waters at outlook.com Tue Apr 28 16:54:19 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 16:54:19 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Message-ID: Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. And you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in Minnesota!). How have you handled this? Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave Anderson is hired. Now what? If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please respond. Thanks! Dan From jeff.developer at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 17:15:19 2015 From: jeff.developer at gmail.com (Jeff) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 17:15:19 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. Sent from my iPhone > On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. And > you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in > Minnesota!). > > > > How have you handled this? > > > > Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave Anderson > is hired. > > > > Now what? > > > > If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please > respond. > > > > Thanks! > > Dan > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From ssharkins at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 17:35:00 2015 From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 18:35:00 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> References: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> Message-ID: Depending on the number of records, even a middle name might not be enough. You might want to include a birth date or even the ss# if you're collecting those. Susan H. On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:15 PM, Jeff wrote: > I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > > Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. > And > > you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in > > Minnesota!). > > > > > > > > How have you handled this? > > > > > > > > Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave > Anderson > > is hired. > > > > > > > > Now what? > > > > > > > > If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please > > respond. > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > Dan > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From jwcolby at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 17:45:48 2015 From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John W. Colby) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 18:45:48 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> Message-ID: <55400D9C.8060401@gmail.com> Or Address John W. Colby On 4/28/2015 6:35 PM, Susan Harkins wrote: > Depending on the number of records, even a middle name might not be enough. > You might want to include a birth date or even the ss# if you're collecting > those. > > Susan H. > > On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:15 PM, Jeff wrote: > >> I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: >>> >>> Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. >> And >>> you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in >>> Minnesota!). >>> >>> >>> >>> How have you handled this? >>> >>> >>> >>> Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave >> Anderson >>> is hired. >>> >>> >>> >>> Now what? >>> >>> >>> >>> If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please >>> respond. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks! >>> >>> Dan >>> >>> -- >>> AccessD mailing list >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >> -- >> AccessD mailing list >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >> From ssharkins at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 17:54:29 2015 From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 18:54:29 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Message-ID: What about sr and jrs living at the same address? :) Susan H. On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:45 PM, John W. Colby wrote: > Or Address > > John W. Colby > > On 4/28/2015 6:35 PM, Susan Harkins wrote: > >> Depending on the number of records, even a middle name might not be >> enough. >> You might want to include a birth date or even the ss# if you're >> collecting >> those. >> >> Susan H. >> >> On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:15 PM, Jeff wrote: >> >> I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: >>>> >>>> Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. >>>> >>> And >>> >>>> you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in >>>> Minnesota!). >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> How have you handled this? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave >>>> >>> Anderson >>> >>>> is hired. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Now what? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please >>>> respond. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Thanks! >>>> >>>> Dan >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AccessD mailing list >>>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>>> >>> -- >>> AccessD mailing list >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>> >>> > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From df.waters at outlook.com Tue Apr 28 18:56:17 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 18:56:17 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Susan, I need to keep the names from causing problems. I can't use a concatenation of other fields. Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Susan Harkins Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2015 5:35 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Depending on the number of records, even a middle name might not be enough. You might want to include a birth date or even the ss# if you're collecting those. Susan H. On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:15 PM, Jeff wrote: > I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > > Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. > And > > you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in > > Minnesota!). > > > > > > > > How have you handled this? > > > > > > > > Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave > Anderson > > is hired. > > > > > > > > Now what? > > > > > > > > If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works > > please respond. > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > Dan > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From ssharkins at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 19:11:32 2015 From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 20:11:32 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> Message-ID: Why? Susan H. On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > Hi Susan, > > I need to keep the names from causing problems. I can't use a > concatenation > of other fields. > > Dan > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of > Susan Harkins > Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2015 5:35 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name > > Depending on the number of records, even a middle name might not be enough. > You might want to include a birth date or even the ss# if you're collecting > those. > > Susan H. > > On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:15 PM, Jeff wrote: > > > I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > > On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > > > > Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. > > And > > > you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in > > > Minnesota!). > > > > > > > > > > > > How have you handled this? > > > > > > > > > > > > Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave > > Anderson > > > is hired. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now what? > > > > > > > > > > > > If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works > > > please respond. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From garykjos at gmail.com Tue Apr 28 20:03:54 2015 From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 20:03:54 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: We use first initial last name as a user ID. If the user ID is already used, we append a number. DANDERSON2 etc. DANDERSON is end dated but still exists. If he returns he could be reactivated or possibly become DANDERSON3 GK On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. And > you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in > Minnesota!). > > > > How have you handled this? > > > > Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave Anderson > is hired. > > > > Now what? > > > > If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please > respond. > > > > Thanks! > > Dan > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- Gary Kjos garykjos at gmail.com From darryl at whittleconsulting.com.au Tue Apr 28 20:05:51 2015 From: darryl at whittleconsulting.com.au (Darryl Collins) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 01:05:51 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Maybe I misunderstand the issue here, but wouldn't you have a master table of user names all keyed individually and unique. As part of the master table you would include link to a table showing start date and an end date (or active / inactive if you prefer in the main table, although the date option in a 2nd table is more powerful and useful) along with other unique ID data in the master profile table (usually DOB for example). So keyID 1 "Dave Anderson" is not and cannot ever be KeyID 5 "Dave Anderson". Or am I missing something here? Cheers Darryl. -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters Sent: Wednesday, 29 April 2015 7:54 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. And you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in Minnesota!). How have you handled this? Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave Anderson is hired. Now what? If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please respond. Thanks! Dan -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From df.waters at outlook.com Tue Apr 28 20:16:53 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 2015 20:16:53 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: <20B64FF3-919D-4D51-975A-8603F32F21F2@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Susan, I have a table named tblProfiles. This contains all the typical information about every user. There is a PersonName field, a PeopleID field. Throughout the rest of the database only the PeopleID values are stored in tables. I need to do this because occasionally a person who is an active user has a name changed, i.e., a woman changes her last name when she gets married. This allows the new name to be displayed throughout the application while only making a data change in the tblProfiles table. Trying to re-use a PersonName in a combobox would mean that the PersonName would correspond to two different PeopleID values, and I would lose data integrity. Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Susan Harkins Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2015 7:12 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Why? Susan H. On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 7:56 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > Hi Susan, > > I need to keep the names from causing problems. I can't use a > concatenation of other fields. > > Dan > > -----Original Message----- > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf > Of Susan Harkins > Sent: Tuesday, April 28, 2015 5:35 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same > Name > > Depending on the number of records, even a middle name might not be enough. > You might want to include a birth date or even the ss# if you're > collecting those. > > Susan H. > > On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 6:15 PM, Jeff wrote: > > > I've always just tried to include a middle name after the first name. > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > > On Apr 28, 2015, at 4:54 PM, Dan Waters wrote: > > > > > > Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. > > And > > > you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in > > > Minnesota!). > > > > > > > > > > > > How have you handled this? > > > > > > > > > > > > Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave > > Anderson > > > is hired. > > > > > > > > > > > > Now what? > > > > > > > > > > > > If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works > > > please respond. > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks! > > > > > > Dan > > > > > > -- > > > AccessD mailing list > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From gustav at cactus.dk Wed Apr 29 05:12:58 2015 From: gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 10:12:58 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Message-ID: Hi Dan There is only one way: use an EmplyoeeID. Either your own or one known by the employee. Here each and everyone has a unique identity number (CPR - Central Person Register) which is used by all relevant authorities and in companies for registration of salary, holidays, sick periods, etc. A bit like the SSN# used in the US but much more thorough. New kids are assigned a number within the hour, and all registered immigrants also receive a number. Without a CPR number you are essentially lost. /gustav -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] P? vegne af Dan Waters Sendt: 28. april 2015 23:54 Til: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Emne: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. And you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in Minnesota!). How have you handled this? Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave Anderson is hired. Now what? If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please respond. Thanks! Dan From df.waters at outlook.com Wed Apr 29 09:16:04 2015 From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 09:16:04 -0500 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks to everyone who answered my question! It's all helpful. Dan -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gustav Brock Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 5:13 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Hi Dan There is only one way: use an EmplyoeeID. Either your own or one known by the employee. Here each and everyone has a unique identity number (CPR - Central Person Register) which is used by all relevant authorities and in companies for registration of salary, holidays, sick periods, etc. A bit like the SSN# used in the US but much more thorough. New kids are assigned a number within the hour, and all registered immigrants also receive a number. Without a CPR number you are essentially lost. /gustav -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] P? vegne af Dan Waters Sendt: 28. april 2015 23:54 Til: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Emne: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name Suppose you are writing a system which sets up profiles for all users. And you have two users whose names are both Dave Anderson (common in Minnesota!). How have you handled this? Then, one Dave Anderson leaves the company, and later another Dave Anderson is hired. Now what? If you've dealt with this or just observed a system that works please respond. Thanks! Dan -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From fuller.artful at gmail.com Wed Apr 29 10:26:38 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 11:26:38 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I would add a password field, and insist that acceptable passwords include the usual combinations of mixed case, special characters and so on. Arthur On Wed, Apr 29, 2015 at 10:16 AM, Dan Waters wrote: > Thanks to everyone who answered my question! It's all helpful. > > Dan From Lambert.Heenan at aig.com Wed Apr 29 11:59:21 2015 From: Lambert.Heenan at aig.com (Heenan, Lambert) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 16:59:21 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Except that is *very* *bad* *practice* to ever store a password. Instead store a hash value. Lambert -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Arthur Fuller Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 11:27 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name I would add a password field, and insist that acceptable passwords include the usual combinations of mixed case, special characters and so on. Arthur On Wed, Apr 29, 2015 at 10:16 AM, Dan Waters wrote: > Thanks to everyone who answered my question! It's all helpful. > > Dan -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com From fuller.artful at gmail.com Wed Apr 29 20:49:01 2015 From: fuller.artful at gmail.com (Arthur Fuller) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2015 21:49:01 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How to Handle Multiple People with the Same Name In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Obviously, Lambert. I assumed that I was talking to knowledgeable readers, and hence didn't bother to mention that. But perhaps for the newbies or those unable to read between the lines, your correction will prove useful. On Wed, Apr 29, 2015 at 12:59 PM, Heenan, Lambert wrote: > Except that is *very* *bad* *practice* to ever store a password. Instead > store a hash value. > > Lambert From bradm at blackforestltd.com Thu Apr 30 13:48:04 2015 From: bradm at blackforestltd.com (Brad Marks) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 18:48:04 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] How To Display an Image from a Pervasive Database table Via Access 2007 In-Reply-To: <1428786621767.22695@cactus.dk> References: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk>, <1428786621767.22695@cactus.dk> Message-ID: All, We have a purchased accounting package called Sage Business Works. Pictures of products are stored in the Business Works database (Pervasive). >From the product documentation I see a field named "Image". When I connect to the Parts table, with Access, I can run a query which shows the Image field as "OLE object". All of the other fields are shown (text fields, numeric fields) I have never worked with images before. I would like to be able to display these images with an Access form or report. I have done a number of experiments, but I have not been able to see the images with either an Access form or report. I must be missing something. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Brad From bensonforums at gmail.com Thu Apr 30 15:56:16 2015 From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 16:56:16 -0400 Subject: [AccessD] How To Display an Image from a Pervasive Database table Via Access 2007 In-Reply-To: References: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk> <1428786621767.22695@cactus.dk> Message-ID: No help, but just a reflection/musing ... Who names their product "Pervasive?" Makes it sound like an illness. On Thu, Apr 30, 2015 at 2:48 PM, Brad Marks wrote: > All, > > We have a purchased accounting package called Sage Business Works. > > Pictures of products are stored in the Business Works database (Pervasive). > > From the product documentation I see a field named "Image". > > When I connect to the Parts table, with Access, I can run a query which > shows the Image field as "OLE object". All of the other fields are shown > (text fields, numeric fields) > > I have never worked with images before. I would like to be able to > display these images with an Access form or report. > > I have done a number of experiments, but I have not been able to see the > images with either an Access form or report. > > I must be missing something. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Brad > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > From bradm at blackforestltd.com Thu Apr 30 16:11:17 2015 From: bradm at blackforestltd.com (Brad Marks) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2015 21:11:17 +0000 Subject: [AccessD] How To Display an Image from a Pervasive Database table Via Access 2007 In-Reply-To: References: <1428704060006.23397@cactus.dk> <1428786621767.22695@cactus.dk> Message-ID: Bill, I never gave much thought to the name of the DBMS. It came bundled with the Sage Business Works accounting package. We had no choice in the DBMS, we simply bought an accounting package about 10 years ago. I would have preferred it to be SQL-Server, but it wasn't. For the past 5 years, I have been using ODBC to obtain data from the Sage Business Works Pervasive database. It seems to work well for us (small manufacturing firm). Here is a little more info for old timers who may have heard of Btrieve. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pervasive_Software Pervasive started in 1982 as SoftCraft developing the database management system technology Btrieve. Brad PS. I cut my teeth on a mainframe DBMS called "Total" from Cincom Systems in 1975. Where in the world did 40 years go? Anyone who worked with Total will remember "Refer Madness" :-) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ -----Original Message----- From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bill Benson Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2015 3:56 PM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] How To Display an Image from a Pervasive Database table Via Access 2007 No help, but just a reflection/musing ... Who names their product "Pervasive?" Makes it sound like an illness. On Thu, Apr 30, 2015 at 2:48 PM, Brad Marks wrote: > All, > > We have a purchased accounting package called Sage Business Works. > > Pictures of products are stored in the Business Works database (Pervasive). > > From the product documentation I see a field named "Image". > > When I connect to the Parts table, with Access, I can run a query > which shows the Image field as "OLE object". All of the other fields > are shown (text fields, numeric fields) > > I have never worked with images before. I would like to be able to > display these images with an Access form or report. > > I have done a number of experiments, but I have not been able to see > the images with either an Access form or report. > > I must be missing something. > > Any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks, > > Brad > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com