From paul.hartland at googlemail.com  Thu Jul 12 04:28:45 2018
From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 10:28:45 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
Message-ID: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>

To all,

Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in VB6 and
will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6 years, so was
just wondering if there is anything out there I can refresh my memory with
and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of VBA from time to time so
hopefully shouldn't be too  different....but any suggestions greatfully
appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Paul

-- 
Paul Hartland
paul.hartland at googlemail.com

From rockysmolin at bchacc.com  Thu Jul 12 10:01:05 2018
From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 08:01:05 -0700
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001b01d419f1$28572700$79057500$@bchacc.com>

Paul:

You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with it.  If
you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code behind it that
might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to Google.

Rocky


-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
Paul Hartland via AccessD
Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018 2:29 AM
To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio
Cc: Paul Hartland
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6

To all,

Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in VB6 and
will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6 years, so was
just wondering if there is anything out there I can refresh my memory with
and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of VBA from time to time so
hopefully shouldn't be too  different....but any suggestions greatfully
appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

Paul

-- 
Paul Hartland
paul.hartland at googlemail.com
-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From paul.hartland at googlemail.com  Thu Jul 12 10:20:47 2018
From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 16:20:47 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <001b01d419f1$28572700$79057500$@bchacc.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<001b01d419f1$28572700$79057500$@bchacc.com>
Message-ID: <CALGJE95A2Xwjx=YqE-FcodHMg=una9AV1wCr6--XNqxBHj082Q@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Rocky

On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 16:03 Rocky Smolin, <rockysmolin at bchacc.com> wrote:

> Paul:
>
> You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with it.  If
> you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code behind it that
> might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to Google.
>
> Rocky
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
> Paul Hartland via AccessD
> Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018 2:29 AM
> To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio
> Cc: Paul Hartland
> Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
>
> To all,
>
> Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in VB6 and
> will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6 years, so was
> just wondering if there is anything out there I can refresh my memory with
> and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of VBA from time to time so
> hopefully shouldn't be too  different....but any suggestions greatfully
> appreciated.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
> Paul
>
> --
> Paul Hartland
> paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Thu Jul 12 10:39:55 2018
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2018 01:39:55 +1000
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <001b01d419f1$28572700$79057500$@bchacc.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>,
	<001b01d419f1$28572700$79057500$@bchacc.com>
Message-ID: <5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely different beasts.

VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#

If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with VB6.



On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:

> Paul:
> 
> You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with it.
>  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code behind
> it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> Google.
> 
> Rocky
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf
> Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018 2:29 AM To:
> Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul Hartland Subject:
> [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> 
> To all,
> 
> Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in VB6
> and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6 years,
> so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can refresh my
> memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of VBA from time
> to time so hopefully shouldn't be too  different....but any
> suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Paul
> 
> -- 
> Paul Hartland
> paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From paul.hartland at googlemail.com  Thu Jul 12 10:48:02 2018
From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 16:48:02 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<001b01d419f1$28572700$79057500$@bchacc.com>
	<5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>

Stuart,

I don't get much chance to develop in VBA just every now and again but just
don't want to have too much of a learning curve, I am sure I will be ok if
I was to get the position, just wanted to brush up on VB6 beforehand as I
think that there will be a test.....I googled VB6 editor and came up with
this link

https://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/121579-visual-studio-ide/suggestions/10525326-support-the-vb6-programming-ide-on-windows-10

and I have Windows 10 at home, so may try it later.

Thanks by the way.

Paul

On 12 July 2018 at 16:39, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> wrote:

> Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely different
> beasts.
>
> VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#
>
> If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with VB6.
>
>
>
> On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:
>
> > Paul:
> >
> > You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with it.
> >  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code behind
> > it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> > Google.
> >
> > Rocky
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf
> > Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018 2:29 AM To:
> > Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul Hartland Subject:
> > [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> >
> > To all,
> >
> > Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in VB6
> > and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6 years,
> > so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can refresh my
> > memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of VBA from time
> > to time so hopefully shouldn't be too  different....but any
> > suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > --
> > Paul Hartland
> > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>



-- 
Paul Hartland
paul.hartland at googlemail.com

From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Thu Jul 12 11:38:32 2018
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2018 02:38:32 +1000
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>,
	<5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>,
	<CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5B478408.27794.591491D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

I've sent you an email offline.  Let me know if you don't receive it.



On 12 Jul 2018 at 16:48, Paul Hartland via AccessD wrote:

> Stuart,
> 
> I don't get much chance to develop in VBA just every now and again but
> just don't want to have too much of a learning curve, I am sure I will
> be ok if I was to get the position, just wanted to brush up on VB6
> beforehand as I think that there will be a test.....I googled VB6
> editor and came up with this link
> 
> https://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/121579-visual-studio-ide/sug
> gestions/10525326-support-the-vb6-programming-ide-on-windows-10
> 
> and I have Windows 10 at home, so may try it later.
> 
> Thanks by the way.
> 
> Paul
> 
> On 12 July 2018 at 16:39, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> wrote:
> 
> > Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely
> > different beasts.
> >
> > VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#
> >
> > If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with VB6.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:
> >
> > > Paul:
> > >
> > > You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with
> > > it.
> > >  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code
> > >  behind
> > > it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> > > Google.
> > >
> > > Rocky
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On
> > > Behalf Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018
> > > 2:29 AM To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul
> > > Hartland Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> > >
> > > To all,
> > >
> > > Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in
> > > VB6 and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6
> > > years, so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can
> > > refresh my memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of
> > > VBA from time to time so hopefully shouldn't be too 
> > > different....but any suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance.
> > >
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > --
> > > Paul Hartland
> > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > --
> > > AccessD mailing list
> > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > >
> > > --
> > > AccessD mailing list
> > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Paul Hartland
> paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From paul.hartland at googlemail.com  Thu Jul 12 11:43:39 2018
From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 17:43:39 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <5B478408.27794.591491D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
	<CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5B478408.27794.591491D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <CALGJE95jHnKXD78Tn7j660d+4D1B13eFCMnD8JMhEsMGE9NUjg@mail.gmail.com>

Got it Stuart, thank you

On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 17:39 Stuart McLachlan, <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> wrote:

> I've sent you an email offline.  Let me know if you don't receive it.
>
>
>
> On 12 Jul 2018 at 16:48, Paul Hartland via AccessD wrote:
>
> > Stuart,
> >
> > I don't get much chance to develop in VBA just every now and again but
> > just don't want to have too much of a learning curve, I am sure I will
> > be ok if I was to get the position, just wanted to brush up on VB6
> > beforehand as I think that there will be a test.....I googled VB6
> > editor and came up with this link
> >
> > https://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/121579-visual-studio-ide/sug
> > gestions/10525326-support-the-vb6-programming-ide-on-windows-10
> >
> > and I have Windows 10 at home, so may try it later.
> >
> > Thanks by the way.
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > On 12 July 2018 at 16:39, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely
> > > different beasts.
> > >
> > > VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#
> > >
> > > If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with VB6.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:
> > >
> > > > Paul:
> > > >
> > > > You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with
> > > > it.
> > > >  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code
> > > >  behind
> > > > it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> > > > Google.
> > > >
> > > > Rocky
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On
> > > > Behalf Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018
> > > > 2:29 AM To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul
> > > > Hartland Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> > > >
> > > > To all,
> > > >
> > > > Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in
> > > > VB6 and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6
> > > > years, so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can
> > > > refresh my memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of
> > > > VBA from time to time so hopefully shouldn't be too
> > > > different....but any suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks in advance.
> > > >
> > > > Paul
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Paul Hartland
> > > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > > --
> > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > AccessD mailing list
> > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Paul Hartland
> > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From jackandpat.d at gmail.com  Thu Jul 12 14:51:12 2018
From: jackandpat.d at gmail.com (jack drawbridge)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 15:51:12 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <CALGJE95jHnKXD78Tn7j660d+4D1B13eFCMnD8JMhEsMGE9NUjg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
	<CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5B478408.27794.591491D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
	<CALGJE95jHnKXD78Tn7j660d+4D1B13eFCMnD8JMhEsMGE9NUjg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKvidAv4BKmTqjs7qBKtwa4w0zE4c4XsbYrPbB2VrugvJzYM5w@mail.gmail.com>

Paul,

Steve Bishop has a number of VBA videos on youtube. Good material and great
refreshers.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYMOUCVo86jEeMMdaaq03jQ_t9nFV737s

Good luck with the new challenge.

On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:43 PM, Paul Hartland via AccessD <
accessd at databaseadvisors.com> wrote:

> Got it Stuart, thank you
>
> On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 17:39 Stuart McLachlan, <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> wrote:
>
> > I've sent you an email offline.  Let me know if you don't receive it.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 12 Jul 2018 at 16:48, Paul Hartland via AccessD wrote:
> >
> > > Stuart,
> > >
> > > I don't get much chance to develop in VBA just every now and again but
> > > just don't want to have too much of a learning curve, I am sure I will
> > > be ok if I was to get the position, just wanted to brush up on VB6
> > > beforehand as I think that there will be a test.....I googled VB6
> > > editor and came up with this link
> > >
> > > https://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/121579-visual-studio-ide/sug
> > > gestions/10525326-support-the-vb6-programming-ide-on-windows-10
> > >
> > > and I have Windows 10 at home, so may try it later.
> > >
> > > Thanks by the way.
> > >
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > On 12 July 2018 at 16:39, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely
> > > > different beasts.
> > > >
> > > > VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#
> > > >
> > > > If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with VB6.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Paul:
> > > > >
> > > > > You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play with
> > > > > it.
> > > > >  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code
> > > > >  behind
> > > > > it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> > > > > Google.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rocky
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On
> > > > > Behalf Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018
> > > > > 2:29 AM To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul
> > > > > Hartland Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> > > > >
> > > > > To all,
> > > > >
> > > > > Got a possible interview with a company that still has software in
> > > > > VB6 and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6
> > > > > years, so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can
> > > > > refresh my memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of
> > > > > VBA from time to time so hopefully shouldn't be too
> > > > > different....but any suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks in advance.
> > > > >
> > > > > Paul
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Paul Hartland
> > > > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > > > --
> > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Paul Hartland
> > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > --
> > > AccessD mailing list
> > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From paul.hartland at googlemail.com  Thu Jul 12 15:16:10 2018
From: paul.hartland at googlemail.com (Paul Hartland)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 21:16:10 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <CAKvidAv4BKmTqjs7qBKtwa4w0zE4c4XsbYrPbB2VrugvJzYM5w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
	<CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>
	<5B478408.27794.591491D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
	<CALGJE95jHnKXD78Tn7j660d+4D1B13eFCMnD8JMhEsMGE9NUjg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAKvidAv4BKmTqjs7qBKtwa4w0zE4c4XsbYrPbB2VrugvJzYM5w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALGJE96P20dAV27kYpygWEei2JWvTSrABu0i6f-e9cYw39iqHQ@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you, just keeping fingers crossed

On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 20:53 jack drawbridge, <jackandpat.d at gmail.com> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> Steve Bishop has a number of VBA videos on youtube. Good material and great
> refreshers.
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYMOUCVo86jEeMMdaaq03jQ_t9nFV737s
>
> Good luck with the new challenge.
>
> On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:43 PM, Paul Hartland via AccessD <
> accessd at databaseadvisors.com> wrote:
>
> > Got it Stuart, thank you
> >
> > On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 17:39 Stuart McLachlan, <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I've sent you an email offline.  Let me know if you don't receive it.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 12 Jul 2018 at 16:48, Paul Hartland via AccessD wrote:
> > >
> > > > Stuart,
> > > >
> > > > I don't get much chance to develop in VBA just every now and again
> but
> > > > just don't want to have too much of a learning curve, I am sure I
> will
> > > > be ok if I was to get the position, just wanted to brush up on VB6
> > > > beforehand as I think that there will be a test.....I googled VB6
> > > > editor and came up with this link
> > > >
> > > >
> https://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/121579-visual-studio-ide/sug
> > > > gestions/10525326-support-the-vb6-programming-ide-on-windows-10
> > > >
> > > > and I have Windows 10 at home, so may try it later.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks by the way.
> > > >
> > > > Paul
> > > >
> > > > On 12 July 2018 at 16:39, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely
> > > > > different beasts.
> > > > >
> > > > > VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#
> > > > >
> > > > > If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with
> VB6.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Paul:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play
> with
> > > > > > it.
> > > > > >  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code
> > > > > >  behind
> > > > > > it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> > > > > > Google.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Rocky
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On
> > > > > > Behalf Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018
> > > > > > 2:29 AM To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul
> > > > > > Hartland Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> > > > > >
> > > > > > To all,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Got a possible interview with a company that still has software
> in
> > > > > > VB6 and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6
> > > > > > years, so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can
> > > > > > refresh my memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of
> > > > > > VBA from time to time so hopefully shouldn't be too
> > > > > > different....but any suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks in advance.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Paul
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Paul Hartland
> > > > > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Paul Hartland
> > > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > > --
> > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > AccessD mailing list
> > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk  Thu Jul 12 15:40:58 2018
From: jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk (James Button)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 21:40:58 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
In-Reply-To: <CALGJE96P20dAV27kYpygWEei2JWvTSrABu0i6f-e9cYw39iqHQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALGJE94TShorgGbr__XKFntDxwqcDoZt_x6J5wEEZja8NMLFZw@mail.gmail.com>	<5B47764B.10081.55B9FC3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>	<CALGJE955E3YP7EHptxq6jtZYBEpJsSm4JSGywG5_HoWyF9k3sw@mail.gmail.com>	<5B478408.27794.591491D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>	<CALGJE95jHnKXD78Tn7j660d+4D1B13eFCMnD8JMhEsMGE9NUjg@mail.gmail.com>	<CAKvidAv4BKmTqjs7qBKtwa4w0zE4c4XsbYrPbB2VrugvJzYM5w@mail.gmail.com>
	<CALGJE96P20dAV27kYpygWEei2JWvTSrABu0i6f-e9cYw39iqHQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO8VDlNCBfdEkctCy61lm0HCgAAAEAAAAPjcMHYLw01DvQ2+5QDDYcoBAAAAAA==@blueyonder.co.uk>

And - when asked if you have any questions -

What projects are planned for after this project is completed ?

Mmmm .... I believe my skills that could be useful for that  - and am a fast
self-learner 

JimB 

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD <accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com> On Behalf Of Paul Hartland
via AccessD
Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018 9:16 PM
To: Access List <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Cc: Paul Hartland <paul.hartland at googlemail.com>
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6

Thank you, just keeping fingers crossed

On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 20:53 jack drawbridge, <jackandpat.d at gmail.com> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> Steve Bishop has a number of VBA videos on youtube. Good material and great
> refreshers.
> https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLYMOUCVo86jEeMMdaaq03jQ_t9nFV737s
>
> Good luck with the new challenge.
>
> On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:43 PM, Paul Hartland via AccessD <
> accessd at databaseadvisors.com> wrote:
>
> > Got it Stuart, thank you
> >
> > On Thu, 12 Jul 2018, 17:39 Stuart McLachlan, <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I've sent you an email offline.  Let me know if you don't receive it.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 12 Jul 2018 at 16:48, Paul Hartland via AccessD wrote:
> > >
> > > > Stuart,
> > > >
> > > > I don't get much chance to develop in VBA just every now and again
> but
> > > > just don't want to have too much of a learning curve, I am sure I
> will
> > > > be ok if I was to get the position, just wanted to brush up on VB6
> > > > beforehand as I think that there will be a test.....I googled VB6
> > > > editor and came up with this link
> > > >
> > > >
> https://visualstudio.uservoice.com/forums/121579-visual-studio-ide/sug
> > > > gestions/10525326-support-the-vb6-programming-ide-on-windows-10
> > > >
> > > > and I have Windows 10 at home, so may try it later.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks by the way.
> > > >
> > > > Paul
> > > >
> > > > On 12 July 2018 at 16:39, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Don't think VS will help much .  VB .net and VB6 are entriely
> > > > > different beasts.
> > > > >
> > > > > VBA is much close to VB6. VB .Net is more like C#
> > > > >
> > > > > If you're happy with VBA, you shouldn't have many problems with
> VB6.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 12 Jul 2018 at 8:01, Rocky Smolin wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Paul:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You might download the free version of Visual Studio and play
> with
> > > > > > it.
> > > > > >  If you could open an existing VS app with a bunch of VS code
> > > > > >  behind
> > > > > > it that might help.  Stuff you didn't understand would be easy to
> > > > > > Google.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Rocky
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On
> > > > > > Behalf Of Paul Hartland via AccessD Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2018
> > > > > > 2:29 AM To: Access List; Development in Visual Studio Cc: Paul
> > > > > > Hartland Subject: [AccessD] Cross Posted VB6
> > > > > >
> > > > > > To all,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Got a possible interview with a company that still has software
> in
> > > > > > VB6 and will be moving to C#, now I haven't touched VB6 in over 6
> > > > > > years, so was just wondering if there is anything out there I can
> > > > > > refresh my memory with and old visual studio maybe, I do a bit of
> > > > > > VBA from time to time so hopefully shouldn't be too
> > > > > > different....but any suggestions greatfully appreciated.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thanks in advance.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Paul
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Paul Hartland
> > > > > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Paul Hartland
> > > > paul.hartland at googlemail.com
> > > > --
> > > > AccessD mailing list
> > > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > AccessD mailing list
> > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> > >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From ssharkins at gmail.com  Thu Jul 19 07:11:17 2018
From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 08:11:17 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
Message-ID: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>


One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database for the
membership. I advised him not to because the other employees will refuse to
use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) isn't broken, but I
think he's decided it will be a great learning experience, so I'm trying to
help. His first mistake was to allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to create
tables from the Excel sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several
lookup fields that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time that
way -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new because
I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use
it, so... 

The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the data
for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a family
membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, but I made it
work because it's what they were all used to using and frankly, it worked
for their purposes and it was easy.) 

We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the current
year is active. We do want the old records for historical value. It might be
easier to work with only the active records and just keep the old Excel
sheet, in case we need to look something up. 

Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over from
scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away I ran into
two problems. The first is a normalization question. 

Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several memberships
listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that historical
information. There are three types of memberships: Individual, Family, and
Friends. So, a "member" can have many memberships, but a membership can have
one or two members tied to it. At this point, it will never be more than two
because we don't list kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of
course, that could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each
membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the
members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to many
relationship here perhaps. 

So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an active
membership and two expired records in the database. 
Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one active and
several records in the database. 
Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record but
several expired records. 
Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no
expired records. 

This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last names
for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the other hand, I
can see doing it that way despite the repeated address and phone number
information.

The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key values
in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has to find a way
to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's possible that
rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best way to go because I
think... I think the wizard created those. But at this point, they have no
value because each record points to only one membership because that's how
it was in Excel. I think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access but
I haven't gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the more
I consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active
memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be there in
an Excel file if it's needed. 

Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just wants
to do it. 

Susan H. 



From charlotte.foust at gmail.com  Thu Jul 19 09:36:45 2018
From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 07:36:45 -0700
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>

Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership
number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and address.  If
you want unique members, it would be a many to many with membership.  If
you plan to use the database to do a mail merge or mailings, you want the
name split into at least first and last, and have a single record for each
name.

Charlotte Foust
(916) 206-4336

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database for
> the
> membership. I advised him not to because the other employees will refuse to
> use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) isn't broken, but I
> think he's decided it will be a great learning experience, so I'm trying to
> help. His first mistake was to allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to
> create
> tables from the Excel sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several
> lookup fields that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time
> that
> way -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new because
> I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't
> use
> it, so...
>
> The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the data
> for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a family
> membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, but I made
> it
> work because it's what they were all used to using and frankly, it worked
> for their purposes and it was easy.)
>
> We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the current
> year is active. We do want the old records for historical value. It might
> be
> easier to work with only the active records and just keep the old Excel
> sheet, in case we need to look something up.
>
> Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over from
> scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away I ran into
> two problems. The first is a normalization question.
>
> Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several
> memberships
> listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that historical
> information. There are three types of memberships: Individual, Family, and
> Friends. So, a "member" can have many memberships, but a membership can
> have
> one or two members tied to it. At this point, it will never be more than
> two
> because we don't list kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of
> course, that could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each
> membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the
> members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to many
> relationship here perhaps.
>
> So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an active
> membership and two expired records in the database.
> Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one active and
> several records in the database.
> Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record but
> several expired records.
> Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no
> expired records.
>
> This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last names
> for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the other hand,
> I
> can see doing it that way despite the repeated address and phone number
> information.
>
> The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key
> values
> in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has to find a way
> to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's possible that
> rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best way to go because I
> think... I think the wizard created those. But at this point, they have no
> value because each record points to only one membership because that's how
> it was in Excel. I think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access
> but
> I haven't gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the
> more
> I consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active
> memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be there in
> an Excel file if it's needed.
>
> Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just wants
> to do it.
>
> Susan H.
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk  Thu Jul 19 12:05:20 2018
From: jamesbutton at blueyonder.co.uk (James Button)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 18:05:20 +0100
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <!&!AAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAO8VDlNCBfdEkctCy61lm0HCgAAAEAAAAMDjoWLgfLhBrmc1LPONh80BAAAAAA==@blueyonder.co.uk>

Me, 
I'd say start with a roughing of the data input form 
Consider what would be the main key (computer generated - sequence or hashing -
date-time and enter'er id)

Then consider what would need to be validated - That's what the form process is
for - a major annoyance in Excel being that data validation can be removed, or
bypassed with the copy action.

So - to my thinking - 
a)Membership code (what the membership card shows)
b)Membership period paid for - start & end
c)Membership person - - normally who paid, but may also be a nominated recipient
of the facility 
- As in someone buying a present annually.
d)Names and addresses of those Associated with the membership 
 
so 
a will have a primary b, and historic b's
a will have a c
b will have a c

so - simplify - 
main data is d with codes to indicate the association as in links to b c and
other d's

as in main table is people and their addresses 
search and update - find name check and optionally change 1 or all 'deemed
current' copies of that address

Yes - people can move, families can move, families can split, families can merge

Different people can pay for a periods membership - and then transfer that to
others for all, or part of the period

Then - who gets mailed re subscriptions 
Then who gets mailed re membership
Who gets mailed re activities - invites to attend, invites to pay.

Point him at the above, and indicate that before starting the setup, what he
should do, (to avoid almost complete reworks) is work out what of the above, and
similar conditions and actions need to be catered for 

Yes - I have been asked to do similar projects and always managed to avoid them
- 
But if you are going to go to Access, then remember views of specific sets of
the bulk data are a great help -
As in select from all people those with a membership code that is currently paid
up, and then get distinct addresses for mailing limitations 

Pretty much doing within the DBMS via view and query what would be done using
VBA and pivottables in Excel

JimB

(Still trying for an effective Teflon coating - even retiring don't work!) 

  

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD <accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com> On Behalf Of Charlotte
Foust
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2018 3:37 PM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
<accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Normalization question

Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership
number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and address.  If
you want unique members, it would be a many to many with membership.  If
you plan to use the database to do a mail merge or mailings, you want the
name split into at least first and last, and have a single record for each
name.

Charlotte Foust
(916) 206-4336

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database for
> the
> membership. I advised him not to because the other employees will refuse to
> use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) isn't broken, but I
> think he's decided it will be a great learning experience, so I'm trying to
> help. His first mistake was to allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to
> create
> tables from the Excel sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several
> lookup fields that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time
> that
> way -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new because
> I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't
> use
> it, so...
>
> The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the data
> for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a family
> membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, but I made
> it
> work because it's what they were all used to using and frankly, it worked
> for their purposes and it was easy.)
>
> We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the current
> year is active. We do want the old records for historical value. It might
> be
> easier to work with only the active records and just keep the old Excel
> sheet, in case we need to look something up.
>
> Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over from
> scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away I ran into
> two problems. The first is a normalization question.
>
> Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several
> memberships
> listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that historical
> information. There are three types of memberships: Individual, Family, and
> Friends. So, a "member" can have many memberships, but a membership can
> have
> one or two members tied to it. At this point, it will never be more than
> two
> because we don't list kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of
> course, that could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each
> membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the
> members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to many
> relationship here perhaps.
>
> So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an active
> membership and two expired records in the database.
> Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one active and
> several records in the database.
> Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record but
> several expired records.
> Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no
> expired records.
>
> This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last names
> for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the other hand,
> I
> can see doing it that way despite the repeated address and phone number
> information.
>
> The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key
> values
> in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has to find a way
> to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's possible that
> rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best way to go because I
> think... I think the wizard created those. But at this point, they have no
> value because each record points to only one membership because that's how
> it was in Excel. I think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access
> but
> I haven't gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the
> more
> I consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active
> memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be there in
> an Excel file if it's needed.
>
> Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just wants
> to do it.
>
> Susan H.
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From jbartow at winhaven.net  Thu Jul 19 12:48:41 2018
From: jbartow at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 17:48:41 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BN7PR11MB26920D3E33A6FD59D6F84C80D8520@BN7PR11MB2692.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>

IMO - if he wants a learning experience you certainly shouldn't start with a mess and think it will get better. That will most likely convince him that Excel was the way to go.

The table structure is the most important thing. 

Teach him table structure and relationships and in the end he'll appreciate it much more and you'll have a program worth using.

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD <accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com> On Behalf Of Susan Harkins
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2018 7:11 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question


One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great learning experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several lookup fields that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new because I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use it, so... 

The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, but I made it work because it's what they were all used to using and frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.) 

We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the current year is active. We do want the old records for historical value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up. 

Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization question. 

Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that historical information. There are three types of memberships: Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it. At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to many relationship here perhaps. 

So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an active membership and two expired records in the database. 
Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one active and several records in the database. 
Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record but several expired records. 
Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no expired records. 

This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address and phone number information.

The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best way to go because I think... I think the wizard created those. But at this point, they have no value because each record points to only one membership because that's how it was in Excel. I think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the more I consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be there in an Excel file if it's needed. 

Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just wants to do it. 

Susan H. 


--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From BWalsh at healthinsight.org  Thu Jul 19 12:59:03 2018
From: BWalsh at healthinsight.org (Bob Walsh)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 17:59:03 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <BN7PR11MB26920D3E33A6FD59D6F84C80D8520@BN7PR11MB2692.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<BN7PR11MB26920D3E33A6FD59D6F84C80D8520@BN7PR11MB2692.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <BN6PR1301MB2100896CC42824DCCB84ABACD7520@BN6PR1301MB2100.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>

In my opinion, you need to start with what you expect to get out of the system and work backwards to build a table structure that will support it.
How you get the current information into the new structure is a conversion issue. Identify the unique pieces of information you have and determine how they are used in the creation of the outputs of the "system" and base your structure on that.

From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2018 10:49 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Normalization question

[Attn: This is an external email.]

IMO - if he wants a learning experience you certainly shouldn't start with a mess and think it will get better. That will most likely convince him that Excel was the way to go.

The table structure is the most important thing.

Teach him table structure and relationships and in the end he'll appreciate it much more and you'll have a program worth using.

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD <accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com<mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com>> On Behalf Of Susan Harkins
Sent: Thursday, July 19, 2018 7:11 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' <accessd at databaseadvisors.com<mailto:accessd at databaseadvisors.com>>
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question


One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great learning experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several lookup fields that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new because I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use it, so...

The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, but I made it work because it's what they were all used to using and frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.)

We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the current year is active. We do want the old records for historical value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up.

Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization question.

Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that historical information. There are three types of memberships: Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it. At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to many relationship here perhaps.

So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an active membership and two expired records in the database.
Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one active and several records in the database.
Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record but several expired records.
Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no expired records.

This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address and phone number information.

The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best way to go because I think... I think the wizard created those. But at this point, they have no value because each record points to only one membership because that's how it was in Excel. I think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the more I consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be there in an Excel file if it's needed.

Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just wants to do it.

Susan H.


--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com<mailto:AccessD at databaseadvisors.com>
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd<http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd>
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com<http://www.databaseadvisors.com>

--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com<mailto:AccessD at databaseadvisors.com>
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd<http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd>
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com<http://www.databaseadvisors.com>

________________________________
HealthInsight is a private, nonprofit, community-based organization dedicated to improving health and health care, with offices in four western states: Nevada, New Mexico, Oregon and Utah. HealthInsight also has operations in Seattle, Wash., and Glendale, Calif., supporting End-Stage Renal Disease Networks in the Western United States. The information and any materials included in this transmission may contain confidential information from HealthInsight. The information is intended for use by the person named on this transmittal. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this transmission is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please inform the sender and delete all copies.

From ssharkins at gmail.com  Thu Jul 19 14:22:44 2018
From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 15:22:44 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>

Well, that's a bit of brilliancy tagging the address to the actual
membership! 

Susan H. 



Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership
number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and address.  If
you want unique members, it would be a many to many with membership.  If you
plan to use the database to do a mail merge or mailings, you want the name
split into at least first and last, and have a single record for each name.

Charlotte Foust
(916) 206-4336

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database 
> for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees 
> will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) 
> isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great learning 
> experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to allow the 
> Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel sheet. Not a 
> complete mess, but it created several lookup fields that even I can't 
> decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way -- a lot of xyz 
> identifiers and crap. It must be something new because I've not see 
> the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use it, 
> so...
>
> The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the 
> data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a 
> family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, 
> but I made it work because it's what they were all used to using and 
> frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.)
>
> We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the 
> current year is active. We do want the old records for historical 
> value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and 
> just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up.
>
> Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over 
> from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away 
> I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization question.
>
> Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several 
> memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that 
> historical information. There are three types of memberships: 
> Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many 
> memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it. 
> At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list 
> kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that could 
> change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each membership 
> has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the members as 
> being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to 
> many relationship here perhaps.
>
> So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an 
> active membership and two expired records in the database.
> Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one 
> active and several records in the database.
> Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record 
> but several expired records.
> Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no 
> expired records.
>
> This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last 
> names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the 
> other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address 
> and phone number information.
>
> The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key 
> values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has 
> to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's 
> possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best 
> way to go because I think... I think the wizard created those. But at 
> this point, they have no value because each record points to only one 
> membership because that's how it was in Excel. I think it might be a 
> job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't gotten that far. We 
> can run insert queries of course, but the more I consider it, the more 
> I'm inclined to work with only the active memberships in the db and 
> move forward. The old info will still be there in an Excel file if 
> it's needed.
>
> Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just 
> wants to do it.
>
> Susan H.
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From ssharkins at gmail.com  Thu Jul 19 17:13:27 2018
From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2018 18:13:27 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <025b01d41fad$b8609e50$2921daf0$@gmail.com>

Bob made an interesting point -- he said to think about how they use the db. The only thing they use this db for is to track the memberships so we can look them in when someone arrives without their card. That's it. No analyzing, no mailings, nothing. That's why the Excel sheet was adequate -- it was easy and find feature worked great most of the time. Brian could dump the entire thing into one table and it would still work for them. 

But, for the sake of normalizing and learning -- that's Brian's main motivation -- I have a question and bear with me, I just don't do this anymore and I've forgotten more than I actually learned at this stage. ? 

Charlotte, I agree with you. Memberships is the parent table, not the member(s). But, if I break out those names into a second table and use an associate to relate them, what happens when we have two John Smiths? Will it even matter? 

Susan H. 
Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and address.  If you want unique members, it would be a many to many with membership.  If you plan to use the database to do a mail merge or mailings, you want the name split into at least first and last, and have a single record for each name.

Charlotte Foust
(916) 206-4336

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

>
> One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database 
> for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees 
> will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) 
> isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great learning 
> experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to allow the 
> Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel sheet. Not a 
> complete mess, but it created several lookup fields that even I can't 
> decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way -- a lot of xyz 
> identifiers and crap. It must be something new because I've not see 
> the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use it, 
> so...
>
> The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the 
> data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a 
> family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, 
> but I made it work because it's what they were all used to using and 
> frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.)
>
> We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the 
> current year is active. We do want the old records for historical 
> value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and 
> just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up.
>
> Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over 
> from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away 
> I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization question.
>
> Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several 
> memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that 
> historical information. There are three types of memberships: 
> Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many 
> memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it. 
> At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list 
> kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that could 
> change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each membership 
> has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the members as 
> being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to 
> many relationship here perhaps.
>
> So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an 
> active membership and two expired records in the database.
> Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one 
> active and several records in the database.
> Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record 
> but several expired records.
> Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no 
> expired records.
>
> This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last 
> names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the 
> other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address 
> and phone number information.
>
> The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key 
> values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has 
> to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's 
> possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best 
> way to go because I think... I think the wizard created those. But at 
> this point, they have no value because each record points to only one 
> membership because that's how it was in Excel. I think it might be a 
> job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't gotten that far. We 
> can run insert queries of course, but the more I consider it, the more 
> I'm inclined to work with only the active memberships in the db and 
> move forward. The old info will still be there in an Excel file if 
> it's needed.
>
> Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just 
> wants to do it.
>
> Susan H.
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From rockysmolin at bchacc.com  Tue Jul 24 08:11:03 2018
From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin)
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2018 06:11:03 -0700
Subject: [AccessD] Bar Code Printer
Message-ID: <00be01d4234f$c6a2bed0$53e83c70$@bchacc.com>

Dear Lists:

 

I have a client who has used a product called Bartender from Seagull
Scientific.  They provide support for Access So I added the barcode printing
to the Access app I developed for him.

 

He recently upgraded a comp to Q10 and A2013 and Bartender won't run.  And
his efforts at getting tech support from Seagull have come to naught.   

 

So he now would like to find another vendor. Does anyone have experience
with a barcode label printer that can be added to an Access app?

 

MTIA

 

 

Rocky Smolin

Beach Access Software

760-683-5777

 <http://www.bchacc.com> www.bchacc.com

 <http://www.e-z-mrp.com> www.e-z-mrp.com

Skype: rocky.smolin

 

 


From jimdettman at verizon.net  Tue Jul 24 10:36:41 2018
From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman)
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2018 11:36:41 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Bar Code Printer
In-Reply-To: <00be01d4234f$c6a2bed0$53e83c70$@bchacc.com>
References: <00be01d4234f$c6a2bed0$53e83c70$@bchacc.com>
Message-ID: <0c0901d42364$1f5a9980$5e0fcc80$@verizon.net>

Rocky,

 Printer or an Active X control that you can drop in to do bar code
printing?

 I'm surprised their having problems with Bartender; Seagull is a leader in
the market and offers drivers for just about everything.

Jim.

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
Rocky Smolin
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2018 9:11 AM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'; List; 'Off Topic'
Subject: [AccessD] Bar Code Printer

Dear Lists:

 

I have a client who has used a product called Bartender from Seagull
Scientific.  They provide support for Access So I added the barcode printing
to the Access app I developed for him.

 

He recently upgraded a comp to Q10 and A2013 and Bartender won't run.  And
his efforts at getting tech support from Seagull have come to naught.   

 

So he now would like to find another vendor. Does anyone have experience
with a barcode label printer that can be added to an Access app?

 

MTIA

 

 

Rocky Smolin

Beach Access Software

760-683-5777

 <http://www.bchacc.com> www.bchacc.com

 <http://www.e-z-mrp.com> www.e-z-mrp.com

Skype: rocky.smolin

 

 

-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com  Tue Jul 24 13:09:13 2018
From: Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com (Kaup, Chester)
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2018 18:09:13 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Report not opening in PrintPreview mode
Message-ID: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB8B24C626@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>

I have a form with a button that opens a report in PrintPreview mode. Code for the button is a follows

Private Sub Open_Last_Injection_Profile_Report_Click()
    DoCmd.OpenReport ("rpt Last Injection profile Test Date"), acViewPreview
End Sub


This works fine if I open the database bypassing the autoexec macro. The report default view is set to Print Preview. When I open the database using the autoexec macro the report appears to open in Report View mode ( No right click menu). The switchboard form opens another form that has the button to open the report. The only event on that form is as follows

Private Sub Form_Load()
    DoCmd.ShowToolbar "Ribbon", acToolbarNo
End Sub


The auto exec macro is below

[cid:image001.png at 01D4234D.E1BBC420]

Any ideas on why the report will not open in PrintPreview mode? Thanks

From garykjos at gmail.com  Tue Jul 24 14:45:57 2018
From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos)
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2018 14:45:57 -0500
Subject: [AccessD] Report not opening in PrintPreview mode
In-Reply-To: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB8B24C626@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>
References: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB8B24C626@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>
Message-ID: <CAJ2R_pKt=80+hv6Je+==HBgKfz7rFLz=ss3K9dhsHzusKxvpUw@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry no attachments on list emails Chester.  Your screen capture
didn't make it where we can see it.
On Tue, Jul 24, 2018 at 1:10 PM Kaup, Chester
<Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com> wrote:
>
> I have a form with a button that opens a report in PrintPreview mode. Code for the button is a follows
>
> Private Sub Open_Last_Injection_Profile_Report_Click()
>     DoCmd.OpenReport ("rpt Last Injection profile Test Date"), acViewPreview
> End Sub
>
>
> This works fine if I open the database bypassing the autoexec macro. The report default view is set to Print Preview. When I open the database using the autoexec macro the report appears to open in Report View mode ( No right click menu). The switchboard form opens another form that has the button to open the report. The only event on that form is as follows
>
> Private Sub Form_Load()
>     DoCmd.ShowToolbar "Ribbon", acToolbarNo
> End Sub
>
>
> The auto exec macro is below
>
> [cid:image001.png at 01D4234D.E1BBC420]
>
> Any ideas on why the report will not open in PrintPreview mode? Thanks
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com


From Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com  Tue Jul 24 15:09:21 2018
From: Chester_Kaup at kindermorgan.com (Kaup, Chester)
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2018 20:09:21 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] FW: Report not opening in PrintPreview mode
In-Reply-To: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB8B24C626@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>
References: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB8B24C626@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>
Message-ID: <8E16E03987F1FD4FB0A9BEBF7CC160CB8B24C801@HOUEX11.kindermorgan.com>

Let's try this again

I have a form with a button that opens a report in PrintPreview mode. Code for the button is a follows

Private Sub Open_Last_Injection_Profile_Report_Click()
    DoCmd.OpenReport ("rpt Last Injection profile Test Date"), acViewPreview
End Sub


This works fine if I open the database bypassing the autoexec macro. The report default view is set to Print Preview. When I open the database using the autoexec macro the report appears to open in Report View mode ( No right click menu). The switchboard form opens another form that has the button to open the report. The only event on that form is as follows

Private Sub Form_Load()
    DoCmd.ShowToolbar "Ribbon", acToolbarNo
End Sub


The auto exec macro is below

OpenForm

                Form Name        frm Switchboard
                View                      Form
                Filter Name
                Where Condition
                Data Mode
                Window Mode  Normal


Any ideas on why the report will not open in PrintPreview mode? Thanks

From jwcolby at gmail.com  Thu Jul 26 13:20:35 2018
From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John Colby)
Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2018 14:20:35 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Automating Excel
Message-ID: <27b9eba2-4e21-3398-981e-ce36bc44713c@Gmail.com>

I have always automated Excel by doing a "recorder capture", saving that 
as vba in a template spreadsheet and then called that function.

I need to do a whole set of cross tabs.? Has anyone actually performed 
crosstabs in this manner?? ATM I paste the data into a spreadsheet, then 
manually select crosstab from the menu, then manually drag the three 
sets of data, the column names, row names and data, into their 
respective positions in the crosstab widget that pops up from the menu item.

-- 
John W. Colby


From jwcolby at gmail.com  Thu Jul 26 13:41:59 2018
From: jwcolby at gmail.com (John Colby)
Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2018 14:41:59 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e9e56103-93fc-01fc-43ef-e99c16d8662f@Gmail.com>

I did something vastly more complicated (data migration) years ago.? An 
entire company doing insurance claim processing from a single huge 
record for each claim.? Policy, claimant, claim etc all in a big record.

I needed to perform a "click and it's done" data migration so that they 
could continue to do their work until such time as I had the migration 
process complete and a small application to actually process all of the 
pieces once the migration happened.

The migration consisted of identifying the entities.? Claimant, claim, 
policy etc.? Then a query to cut that "piece" out of the main record and 
insert into a record with autonumber PK.? Then a field in the main 
record to grab the PKs and insert back in to the main table.? Then cut 
that section of data out.? Rinse and repeat.? Something has to be the 
"parent".? In my case it was a claim.? Insurer was parent to policy.? 
Policy was parent to claim.? But that means that claim had a PK from a 
policy which had a PK for insurer.? Claim had a PK from claimant etc.

It took a while to get that whole process of creating the entity tables, 
filling them, getting their PKs back into fields in the records they 
came from etc.

Once I had the tables and could just click a button to do that 
migration, then I had to build forms to edit / add / delete the entities 
- claimants, policies claims etc.? Once the entities could be 
maintained, train the users on how to use those new forms and what the 
pieces were.? Then click a migration button and turn the system on.

It was NOT trivial!? But you get the idea of the strategy I used to do 
the migration and new database build.


On 7/19/2018 8:11 AM, Susan Harkins wrote:
> One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database for the
> membership. I advised him not to because the other employees will refuse to
> use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet) isn't broken, but I
> think he's decided it will be a great learning experience, so I'm trying to
> help. His first mistake was to allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to create
> tables from the Excel sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several
> lookup fields that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time that
> way -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new because
> I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use
> it, so...
>
> The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the data
> for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a family
> membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this, but I made it
> work because it's what they were all used to using and frankly, it worked
> for their purposes and it was easy.)
>
> We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the current
> year is active. We do want the old records for historical value. It might be
> easier to work with only the active records and just keep the old Excel
> sheet, in case we need to look something up.
>
> Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over from
> scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away I ran into
> two problems. The first is a normalization question.
>
> Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several memberships
> listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that historical
> information. There are three types of memberships: Individual, Family, and
> Friends. So, a "member" can have many memberships, but a membership can have
> one or two members tied to it. At this point, it will never be more than two
> because we don't list kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of
> course, that could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each
> membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the
> members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to many
> relationship here perhaps.
>
> So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an active
> membership and two expired records in the database.
> Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one active and
> several records in the database.
> Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record but
> several expired records.
> Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no
> expired records.
>
> This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last names
> for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the other hand, I
> can see doing it that way despite the repeated address and phone number
> information.
>
> The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key values
> in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has to find a way
> to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's possible that
> rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best way to go because I
> think... I think the wizard created those. But at this point, they have no
> value because each record points to only one membership because that's how
> it was in Excel. I think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access but
> I haven't gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the more
> I consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active
> memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be there in
> an Excel file if it's needed.
>
> Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just wants
> to do it.
>
> Susan H.
>
>

-- 
John W. Colby


From DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov  Thu Jul 26 13:57:10 2018
From: DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov (McGillivray, Don)
Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2018 18:57:10 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Automating Excel
In-Reply-To: <27b9eba2-4e21-3398-981e-ce36bc44713c@Gmail.com>
References: <27b9eba2-4e21-3398-981e-ce36bc44713c@Gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f15faf8ab5c443188fb91a6f37873221@ctc.ca.gov>

Hi John,

I probably cribbed the gist of this from somewhere else, but here's something I found in one of my apps.  This is code from an Access app and was designed to manipulate an existing Excel file, but there may be some things you can adapt to your purpose.  I never actually implemented this, but I believe I got it working as it is here.  As I recall, "qryTemp" is a named range that I expected to find in the existing Excel file, and of course the field names were specific to that table.

Watch for word wrap . . .

Function PivotExcelData(strPathFile As String, Optional blnMakeVisible As Boolean = False)
    On Error GoTo ErrorHandle

    Dim xl As Excel.Application
    Dim wbk As Excel.Workbook
    Dim wsh As Excel.Worksheet
    Dim pvTbl As Excel.PivotTable
    Dim pvFld As Excel.PivotField
    
    Set xl = New Excel.Application
    xl.Visible = blnMakeVisible
    Set wbk = xl.Workbooks.Open(strPathFile)
    
    Set wsh = wbk.Sheets.Add
    wsh.Name = "PivotTable"
    wsh.Select
    
    Set pvTbl = wsh.PivotTableWizard(xlDatabase, "qryTemp")
    
    'Set up the rows
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("DateRemHead")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlRowField
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("Mode")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlRowField
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("DateRODHead")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlRowField
    
    'Set up the columns
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("Fund")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlColumnField
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("RevenueCode")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlColumnField
    
    'Set up the data
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("DistTotal")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlDataField
    pvFld.Function = xlSum
    pvFld.NumberFormat = "#,##0.00"

    'Set up the page filter
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("RemitNum")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlPageField

FunctionExit:
    On Error Resume Next
    Set pvFld = Nothing
    Set wsh = Nothing
    wbk.Save
    wbk.Close
    Set wbk = Nothing
    xl.Quit
    Set xl = Nothing
    Exit Function

ErrorHandle:
    Select Case Err.Number 
        Case Else
            MsgBox Err.Number & " " & Err.Description & vbCrLf & vbCrLf _
                & "Error in procedure Function 'PivotExcelData' of VBA Document 'Form_frmViewRemit'"
            Resume FunctionExit
    End Select

End Function

Hope this is useful.

Don

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Colby
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2018 11:21 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>; jwcolby at gmail.com
Subject: [AccessD] Automating Excel

I have always automated Excel by doing a "recorder capture", saving that as vba in a template spreadsheet and then called that function.

I need to do a whole set of cross tabs.? Has anyone actually performed crosstabs in this manner?? ATM I paste the data into a spreadsheet, then manually select crosstab from the menu, then manually drag the three sets of data, the column names, row names and data, into their respective positions in the crosstab widget that pops up from the menu item.

-- 
John W. Colby

-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov  Thu Jul 26 15:36:16 2018
From: DMcGillivray at ctc.ca.gov (McGillivray, Don)
Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2018 20:36:16 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Automating Excel
In-Reply-To: <27b9eba2-4e21-3398-981e-ce36bc44713c@Gmail.com>
References: <27b9eba2-4e21-3398-981e-ce36bc44713c@Gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e2fc2ad4078b4c77b6b30d82bf7fdd80@ctc.ca.gov>

Tried sending this earlier, but didn't see it appear.  Trying again.  Apologies if duplicated.

Hi John,

I probably cribbed the gist of this from somewhere else, but here's something I found in one of my apps.  This is code from an Access app and was designed to manipulate an existing Excel file, but there may be some things you can adapt to your purpose.  I never actually implemented this, but I believe I got it working as it is here.  As I recall, "qryTemp" is a named range that I expected to find in the existing Excel file, and of course the field names were specific to that table.

Watch for word wrap . . .

Function PivotExcelData(strPathFile As String, Optional blnMakeVisible As Boolean = False)
    On Error GoTo ErrorHandle

    Dim xl As Excel.Application
    Dim wbk As Excel.Workbook
    Dim wsh As Excel.Worksheet
    Dim pvTbl As Excel.PivotTable
    Dim pvFld As Excel.PivotField
    
    Set xl = New Excel.Application
    xl.Visible = blnMakeVisible
    Set wbk = xl.Workbooks.Open(strPathFile)
    
    Set wsh = wbk.Sheets.Add
    wsh.Name = "PivotTable"
    wsh.Select
    
    Set pvTbl = wsh.PivotTableWizard(xlDatabase, "qryTemp")
    
    'Set up the rows
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("DateRemHead")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlRowField
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("Mode")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlRowField
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("DateRODHead")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlRowField
    
    'Set up the columns
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("Fund")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlColumnField
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("RevenueCode")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlColumnField
    
    'Set up the data
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("DistTotal")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlDataField
    pvFld.Function = xlSum
    pvFld.NumberFormat = "#,##0.00"

    'Set up the page filter
    Set pvFld = pvTbl.PivotFields("RemitNum")
    pvFld.Orientation = xlPageField

FunctionExit:
    On Error Resume Next
    Set pvFld = Nothing
    Set wsh = Nothing
    wbk.Save
    wbk.Close
    Set wbk = Nothing
    xl.Quit
    Set xl = Nothing
    Exit Function

ErrorHandle:
    Select Case Err.Number 
        Case Else
            MsgBox Err.Number & " " & Err.Description & vbCrLf & vbCrLf _
                & "Error in procedure Function 'PivotExcelData' of VBA Document 'Form_frmViewRemit'"
            Resume FunctionExit
    End Select

End Function

Hope this is useful.

Don

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Colby
Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2018 11:21 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>; jwcolby at gmail.com
Subject: [AccessD] Automating Excel

I have always automated Excel by doing a "recorder capture", saving that as vba in a template spreadsheet and then called that function.

I need to do a whole set of cross tabs.? Has anyone actually performed crosstabs in this manner?? ATM I paste the data into a spreadsheet, then manually select crosstab from the menu, then manually drag the three sets of data, the column names, row names and data, into their respective positions in the crosstab widget that pops up from the menu item.

-- 
John W. Colby

-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From rockysmolin at bchacc.com  Fri Jul 27 17:59:20 2018
From: rockysmolin at bchacc.com (Rocky Smolin)
Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2018 15:59:20 -0700
Subject: [AccessD] On Error Resume Next - problem?
Message-ID: <02c201d425fd$7481e350$5d85a9f0$@bchacc.com>

I have a client who writes:

 

"A few other people want to use the database, and I thought we could save
money buying Access for each by using Runtime Access.  However, there seems
to be a problem with the "On Error Resume Next" lines of code, and I counted
about 90 of them.  Do all those need to be changed to handle errors to work
in Runtime Access?  Is there any easy way to adapt the program to run on the
runtime version of Access? "

 

I have never heard of Access Runtime having a problem with any VBA.  Is it
possible?

 

TIA

 

 

Rocky Smolin

Beach Access Software

760-683-5777

 <http://www.bchacc.com> www.bchacc.com

 <http://www.e-z-mrp.com> www.e-z-mrp.com

Skype: rocky.smolin

 

 

 


From wrwehler at gmail.com  Fri Jul 27 18:44:06 2018
From: wrwehler at gmail.com (Ryan W)
Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2018 18:44:06 -0500
Subject: [AccessD] On Error Resume Next - problem?
In-Reply-To: <02c201d425fd$7481e350$5d85a9f0$@bchacc.com>
References: <02c201d425fd$7481e350$5d85a9f0$@bchacc.com>
Message-ID: <72B5D573-1126-4380-BEB6-04215205C582@gmail.com>

I deploy the runtime to my staff and have plenty of resume next code with no issues. 


There was one error code I was trapping that started coming up after upgrading to access 2013 but a MS patch fixed it as there was some ?off by one? bug in their internal error trapping. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 27, 2018, at 5:59 PM, Rocky Smolin <rockysmolin at bchacc.com> wrote:
> 
> I have a client who writes:
> 
> 
> 
> "A few other people want to use the database, and I thought we could save
> money buying Access for each by using Runtime Access.  However, there seems
> to be a problem with the "On Error Resume Next" lines of code, and I counted
> about 90 of them.  Do all those need to be changed to handle errors to work
> in Runtime Access?  Is there any easy way to adapt the program to run on the
> runtime version of Access? "
> 
> 
> 
> I have never heard of Access Runtime having a problem with any VBA.  Is it
> possible?
> 
> 
> 
> TIA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rocky Smolin
> 
> Beach Access Software
> 
> 760-683-5777
> 
> <http://www.bchacc.com> www.bchacc.com
> 
> <http://www.e-z-mrp.com> www.e-z-mrp.com
> 
> Skype: rocky.smolin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Fri Jul 27 19:03:33 2018
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Sat, 28 Jul 2018 10:03:33 +1000
Subject: [AccessD] On Error Resume Next - problem?
In-Reply-To: <02c201d425fd$7481e350$5d85a9f0$@bchacc.com>
References: <02c201d425fd$7481e350$5d85a9f0$@bchacc.com>
Message-ID: <5B5BB2D5.23377.1ED8F2B9@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On Error Resume Next works fine with the Runtime.
The "seems to be"  problem must lie elsewhere.


On 27 Jul 2018 at 15:59, Rocky Smolin wrote:

> I have a client who writes:
> 
> 
> 
> "A few other people want to use the database, and I thought we could
> save money buying Access for each by using Runtime Access.  However,
> there seems to be a problem with the "On Error Resume Next" lines of
> code, and I counted about 90 of them.  Do all those need to be changed
> to handle errors to work in Runtime Access?  Is there any easy way to
> adapt the program to run on the runtime version of Access? "
> 
> 
> 
> I have never heard of Access Runtime having a problem with any VBA. 
> Is it possible?
> 
> 
> 
> TIA
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Rocky Smolin
> 
> Beach Access Software
> 
> 760-683-5777
> 
>  <http://www.bchacc.com> www.bchacc.com
> 
>  <http://www.e-z-mrp.com> www.e-z-mrp.com
> 
> Skype: rocky.smolin
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From bensonforums at gmail.com  Sun Jul 29 11:48:27 2018
From: bensonforums at gmail.com (Bill Benson)
Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2018 12:48:27 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
	<00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>

People change addresses without changing anything else about their
membership. You need to design for that eventuality.

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 3:23 PM Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, that's a bit of brilliancy tagging the address to the actual
> membership!
>
> Susan H.
>
>
>
> Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership
> number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and address.  If
> you want unique members, it would be a many to many with membership.  If
> you
> plan to use the database to do a mail merge or mailings, you want the name
> split into at least first and last, and have a single record for each name.
>
> Charlotte Foust
> (916) 206-4336
>
> On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database
> > for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees
> > will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet)
> > isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great learning
> > experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to allow the
> > Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel sheet. Not a
> > complete mess, but it created several lookup fields that even I can't
> > decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way -- a lot of xyz
> > identifiers and crap. It must be something new because I've not see
> > the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use it,
> > so...
> >
> > The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the
> > data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a
> > family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this,
> > but I made it work because it's what they were all used to using and
> > frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.)
> >
> > We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the
> > current year is active. We do want the old records for historical
> > value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and
> > just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up.
> >
> > Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over
> > from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away
> > I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization question.
> >
> > Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several
> > memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that
> > historical information. There are three types of memberships:
> > Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many
> > memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it.
> > At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list
> > kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that could
> > change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each membership
> > has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the members as
> > being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> > Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to
> > many relationship here perhaps.
> >
> > So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an
> > active membership and two expired records in the database.
> > Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one
> > active and several records in the database.
> > Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record
> > but several expired records.
> > Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no
> > expired records.
> >
> > This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last
> > names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the
> > other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address
> > and phone number information.
> >
> > The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key
> > values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has
> > to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's
> > possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best
> > way to go because I think... I think the wizard created those. But at
> > this point, they have no value because each record points to only one
> > membership because that's how it was in Excel. I think it might be a
> > job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't gotten that far. We
> > can run insert queries of course, but the more I consider it, the more
> > I'm inclined to work with only the active memberships in the db and
> > move forward. The old info will still be there in an Excel file if
> > it's needed.
> >
> > Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just
> > wants to do it.
> >
> > Susan H.
> >
> >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From df.waters at outlook.com  Sun Jul 29 12:22:00 2018
From: df.waters at outlook.com (Dan Waters)
Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2018 17:22:00 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
	<00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>
	<CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CY4PR19MB0103292B88D153BC9F90693EF6280@CY4PR19MB0103.namprd19.prod.outlook.com>

And I found out the difficult way that people also change their names.  Usually just their last name.

Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bill Benson
Sent: July 29, 2018 11:48
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Normalization question

People change addresses without changing anything else about their
membership. You need to design for that eventuality.

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 3:23 PM Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, that's a bit of brilliancy tagging the address to the actual
> membership!
>
> Susan H.
>
>
>
> Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership
> number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and address.  If
> you want unique members, it would be a many to many with membership.  If
> you
> plan to use the database to do a mail merge or mailings, you want the name
> split into at least first and last, and have a single record for each name.
>
> Charlotte Foust
> (916) 206-4336
>
> On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database
> > for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees
> > will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel sheet)
> > isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great learning
> > experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to allow the
> > Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel sheet. Not a
> > complete mess, but it created several lookup fields that even I can't
> > decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way -- a lot of xyz
> > identifiers and crap. It must be something new because I've not see
> > the wizard do something like that, but then again, I didn't use it,
> > so...
> >
> > The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all the
> > data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's a
> > family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create this,
> > but I made it work because it's what they were all used to using and
> > frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.)
> >
> > We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the
> > current year is active. We do want the old records for historical
> > value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and
> > just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up.
> >
> > Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start over
> > from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. Right away
> > I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization question.
> >
> > Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several
> > memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that
> > historical information. There are three types of memberships:
> > Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many
> > memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it.
> > At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list
> > kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that could
> > change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each membership
> > has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of the members as
> > being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go now.
> > Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many to
> > many relationship here perhaps.
> >
> > So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an
> > active membership and two expired records in the database.
> > Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one
> > active and several records in the database.
> > Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active record
> > but several expired records.
> > Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and no
> > expired records.
> >
> > This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last
> > names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the
> > other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address
> > and phone number information.
> >
> > The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign key
> > values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he has
> > to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, it's
> > possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be the best
> > way to go because I think... I think the wizard created those. But at
> > this point, they have no value because each record points to only one
> > membership because that's how it was in Excel. I think it might be a
> > job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't gotten that far. We
> > can run insert queries of course, but the more I consider it, the more
> > I'm inclined to work with only the active memberships in the db and
> > move forward. The old info will still be there in an Excel file if
> > it's needed.
> >
> > Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just
> > wants to do it.
> >
> > Susan H.
> >
> >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From ssharkins at gmail.com  Sun Jul 29 14:19:59 2018
From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins)
Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2018 15:19:59 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>	<00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>
	<CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003b01d42771$24e78f50$6eb6adf0$@gmail.com>

It shouldn't be a problem with the layout we settled on -- membership is the
parent and the only child table with be the many to many with the membership
"people." There are two lookup tables -- turning out to be very simple. 

Susan H. 


People change addresses without changing anything else about their
membership. You need to design for that eventuality.

On Thu, Jul 19, 2018, 3:23 PM Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, that's a bit of brilliancy tagging the address to the actual 
> membership!
>
> Susan H.
>
>
>
> Start with the membership itself as a unique entity with a membership 
> number, beginning date and expiration, type of membership, and 
> address.  If you want unique members, it would be a many to many with 
> membership.  If you plan to use the database to do a mail merge or 
> mailings, you want the name split into at least first and last, and 
> have a single record for each name.
>
> Charlotte Foust
> (916) 206-4336
>
> On Thu, Jul 19, 2018 at 5:11 AM, Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> > One of the new employees at Salato wants to build an Access database 
> > for the membership. I advised him not to because the other employees 
> > will refuse to use it and because the system we're using (Excel 
> > sheet) isn't broken, but I think he's decided it will be a great 
> > learning experience, so I'm trying to help. His first mistake was to 
> > allow the Access (365, 2016) wizard to create tables from the Excel 
> > sheet. Not a complete mess, but it created several lookup fields 
> > that even I can't decipher. I don't want to spend my time that way 
> > -- a lot of xyz identifiers and crap. It must be something new 
> > because I've not see the wizard do something like that, but then 
> > again, I didn't use it, so...
> >
> > The records are currently in an Excel sheet -- one record with all 
> > the data for each membership. Names are in one cell, even when it's 
> > a family membership and there are two names. (No, I didn't create 
> > this, but I made it work because it's what they were all used to 
> > using and frankly, it worked for their purposes and it was easy.)
> >
> > We have five years of memberships we want to access -- but only the 
> > current year is active. We do want the old records for historical 
> > value. It might be easier to work with only the active records and 
> > just keep the old Excel sheet, in case we need to look something up.
> >
> > Yesterday, I suggested that he dump the wizard's tables and start 
> > over from scratch -- it is the best way to learn and he agreed. 
> > Right away I ran into two problems. The first is a normalization
question.
> >
> > Members renew once a year, so the same family might have several 
> > memberships listed, but only one is active. We want to retain that 
> > historical information. There are three types of memberships:
> > Individual, Family, and Friends. So, a "member" can have many 
> > memberships, but a membership can have one or two members tied to it.
> > At this point, it will never be more than two because we don't list 
> > kids and the additional friends can be anybody. (Of course, that 
> > could change, but I don't see it happening anytime soon.) Each 
> > membership has one or two names tied to it. At first, I thought of 
> > the members as being the parent, but I'm not sure that's the way to go
now.
> > Perhaps the membership itself is the parent. I think we have a many 
> > to many relationship here perhaps.
> >
> > So John Doe might have an individual membership and he might have an 
> > active membership and two expired records in the database.
> > Sue and George Donaldson might have a family membership with one 
> > active and several records in the database.
> > Lonnie and Alice might have a family membership with no active 
> > record but several expired records.
> > Bill and Marth might have a friends membership with one active and 
> > no expired records.
> >
> > This exposed itself rather quickly because having two first and last 
> > names for each record seems to break normalization rules, but on the 
> > other hand, I can see doing it that way despite the repeated address 
> > and phone number information.
> >
> > The second problem is of course that there are no primary/foreign 
> > key values in the Excel sheet. So, once Brian creates the tables, he 
> > has to find a way to create those values and keep them straight. So, 
> > it's possible that rewiring the wizard's tables might actually be 
> > the best way to go because I think... I think the wizard created 
> > those. But at this point, they have no value because each record 
> > points to only one membership because that's how it was in Excel. I 
> > think it might be a job for Power Pivot before Access but I haven't 
> > gotten that far. We can run insert queries of course, but the more I 
> > consider it, the more I'm inclined to work with only the active 
> > memberships in the db and move forward. The old info will still be 
> > there in an Excel file if it's needed.
> >
> > Right now, the db isn't necessary so there's no pressure. Brian just 
> > wants to do it.
> >
> > Susan H.
> >
> >
> > --
> > AccessD mailing list
> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From ssharkins at gmail.com  Sun Jul 29 14:26:10 2018
From: ssharkins at gmail.com (Susan Harkins)
Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2018 15:26:10 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <CY4PR19MB0103292B88D153BC9F90693EF6280@CY4PR19MB0103.namprd19.prod.outlook.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>	<00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>	<CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CY4PR19MB0103292B88D153BC9F90693EF6280@CY4PR19MB0103.namprd19.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <007901d42772$021b5e10$06521a30$@gmail.com>

Yeah... we're not using any of that in any way, so all we have to do is pull up the membership and change it -- Charlotte is a genius. ? 

Susan H. 


And I found out the difficult way that people also change their names.  Usually just their last name.

Dan




From charlotte.foust at gmail.com  Mon Jul 30 15:24:03 2018
From: charlotte.foust at gmail.com (Charlotte Foust)
Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2018 13:24:03 -0700
Subject: [AccessD] Normalization question
In-Reply-To: <007901d42772$021b5e10$06521a30$@gmail.com>
References: <02a901d41f59$99a8bd70$ccfa3850$@gmail.com>
	<CAH+Met8CZ-dwz+7YRKgnFL1rmW_HEpCsxcs9YWq3jnKKj7BpJg@mail.gmail.com>
	<00b301d41f95$df3b7170$9db25450$@gmail.com>
	<CAJLzs_1zMCbxPhg++WXT_3Sv0Gdk2-REj7sUPAJHk+qbbDKp9Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CY4PR19MB0103292B88D153BC9F90693EF6280@CY4PR19MB0103.namprd19.prod.outlook.com>
	<007901d42772$021b5e10$06521a30$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAH+Met-CuMWYgjzvZy2G2SSdE-qKy-h1c308y1SmDQjOo4WBoA@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for the kind words, Susan.  I've just been around long enough to
have seen it all at least once.

On Sun, Jul 29, 2018, 12:27 PM Susan Harkins <ssharkins at gmail.com> wrote:

> Yeah... we're not using any of that in any way, so all we have to do is
> pull up the membership and change it -- Charlotte is a genius. ?
>
> Susan H.
>
>
> And I found out the difficult way that people also change their names.
> Usually just their last name.
>
> Dan
>
>
>
> --
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>

From marksimms at verizon.net  Mon Jul 30 20:57:23 2018
From: marksimms at verizon.net (Mark Simms)
Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2018 21:57:23 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access
In-Reply-To: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>
References: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>
Message-ID: <164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>








		
	


Gang - 
I was just wondering if anyone has run into this problem:
1) LAN-based Access 2016 database
2) Remote access for one user via LogMeIn to a connected machine
3) Other remote users are using a VPN to access the application directly from their remote workstations.


Certain UPDATE/INSERT operations are causing the back-end database to become corrupted...
but only when the VPN users are doing the updates.
The Remote access user does not exhibit this problem....nor do the locally connected users.


Does anyone know that if we move the back-end database to SQL Server 2014, hosted on the LAN, that the problem will be resolved ?
Other options are to :
1) host the entire Access application with a remote hosting service.
2) Set-up at least 6 workstations that would be accessed remotely via LogMeIn.


Any and all suggestions greatly appreciated.



 

From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Mon Jul 30 21:25:36 2018
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2018 12:25:36 +1000
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access
In-Reply-To: <164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>
References: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>,
	<164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>
Message-ID: <5B5FC8A0.12787.61ACE3@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

Latency problem with VPN? 

I sometime see the same problem when local  users are on a slow Wirelss Access point 
rather than a wired connection.

SQL Server should assist since it is more robust in terms of falled transactions.

On 30 Jul 2018 at 21:57, Mark Simms wrote:

> Gang - 
> I was just wondering if anyone has run into this problem:
> 1) LAN-based Access 2016 database
> 2) Remote access for one user via LogMeIn to a connected machine
> 3) Other remote users are using a VPN to access the application
> directly from their remote workstations.
> 
> 
> Certain UPDATE/INSERT operations are causing the back-end database to
> become corrupted... but only when the VPN users are doing the updates.
> The Remote access user does not exhibit this problem....nor do the
> locally connected users.
> 
> 
> Does anyone know that if we move the back-end database to SQL Server
> 2014, hosted on the LAN, that the problem will be resolved ? Other
> options are to : 1) host the entire Access application with a remote
> hosting service. 2) Set-up at least 6 workstations that would be
> accessed remotely via LogMeIn.
> 
> 
> Any and all suggestions greatly appreciated.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From jbodin at sbor.com  Mon Jul 30 22:57:30 2018
From: jbodin at sbor.com (John Bodin)
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2018 03:57:30 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access
In-Reply-To: <164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>
References: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>
	<164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>
Message-ID: <BN6PR04MB1220C246FB0E6458C1510D54BD2E0@BN6PR04MB1220.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Mark, Access is not a Client/Server architecture so you will certainly have issues over a VPN.  Unfortunate.

SQL Server an option for sure, have to re-write certain parts of your app.

Logmein idea would work, I would not set up 6 physical machines, unless they were extras lying around, rather use virtual machines on a host with enough ram to run your Access app.

Another option I have used is to set up a Remote Desktop Server, licensed for x amount of users, and use the VPN to connect each user to a virtual instance of your app.  Then, like LogMeIn, the front-end can live on the virtual desktop or local user's machines, and the back-end can live on the server, all on the same LAN.  And RDS, unlike the free version of LogMeIn in Central, can print reports back to the remote user's printer as well as you can copy or access files on the remote user's PC.  No need to re-write you app with either logmein or RDS server options.

Good luck.

John

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Mark Simms
Sent: Monday, July 30, 2018 9:57 PM
To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access








		
	


Gang - 
I was just wondering if anyone has run into this problem:
1) LAN-based Access 2016 database
2) Remote access for one user via LogMeIn to a connected machine
3) Other remote users are using a VPN to access the application directly from their remote workstations.


Certain UPDATE/INSERT operations are causing the back-end database to become corrupted...
but only when the VPN users are doing the updates.
The Remote access user does not exhibit this problem....nor do the locally connected users.


Does anyone know that if we move the back-end database to SQL Server 2014, hosted on the LAN, that the problem will be resolved ?
Other options are to :
1) host the entire Access application with a remote hosting service.
2) Set-up at least 6 workstations that would be accessed remotely via LogMeIn.


Any and all suggestions greatly appreciated.



 
-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From jimdettman at verizon.net  Tue Jul 31 06:42:33 2018
From: jimdettman at verizon.net (Jim Dettman)
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2018 07:42:33 -0400
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access
In-Reply-To: <164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>
References: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>
	<164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>
Message-ID: <015e01d428c3$933ae030$b9b0a090$@verizon.net>

Mark,

  #3 is a no-no.

  Quick way out as the others had said is an RDS setup.   Basically plug and
play, although your app might need adjustments.   With an RDP server,
everyone will have the same C:\ drive, so things like creating temp
files/tables might be an issue.

  Also, it doesn't negate the need for everyone to have a separate copy of
the front end.  The way to handle that is to map a drive letter in their
profile (I use X:\) with:

 C:\TSDrive\%Account name%

 They execute via X:\  so each user is pointed to their own copy.

 While converting to SQL would help, your remote users over the VPN would
not be happy.   In general, most that convert to SQL see a performance
boost, but that's not always the case.   Sometimes you need to make
extensive changes to your app in using pass-through, views, stored
procedures, and triggers to get good performance over a WAN.

  You also should have an entirely different mindset in developing the app.
For example, with a true client/server app, you would never dream of binding
an entire table to a form and letting the user browse records like this.

  There are some tricks though, which are pointed out here:

https://www.jstreettech.com/downloads.aspx

 in the download "Best of both worlds", which would get you by most likely.

Jim.

-----Original Message-----
From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of
Mark Simms
Sent: Monday, July 30, 2018 9:57 PM
To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access








		
	


Gang - 
I was just wondering if anyone has run into this problem:
1) LAN-based Access 2016 database
2) Remote access for one user via LogMeIn to a connected machine
3) Other remote users are using a VPN to access the application directly
from their remote workstations.


Certain UPDATE/INSERT operations are causing the back-end database to become
corrupted...
but only when the VPN users are doing the updates.
The Remote access user does not exhibit this problem....nor do the locally
connected users.


Does anyone know that if we move the back-end database to SQL Server 2014,
hosted on the LAN, that the problem will be resolved ?
Other options are to :
1) host the entire Access application with a remote hosting service.
2) Set-up at least 6 workstations that would be accessed remotely via
LogMeIn.


Any and all suggestions greatly appreciated.



 
-- 
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Tue Jul 31 07:49:29 2018
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:49:29 +1000
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access
In-Reply-To: <015e01d428c3$933ae030$b9b0a090$@verizon.net>
References: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>,
	<164ee0dde12-c89-92bc@webjas-vad190.srv.aolmail.net>,
	<015e01d428c3$933ae030$b9b0a090$@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <5B605AD9.17989.29CD90D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

What a great website.  I  hadn't come across that one before.  I've grabbed a lot of their 
downloads to examine.

I'm also going to steal some of their "What we do" etc to update my Company Profile and 
proposal documentation  :)

On 31 Jul 2018 at 7:42, Jim Dettman wrote:

> 
>   There are some tricks though, which are pointed out here:
> 
> https://www.jstreettech.com/downloads.aspx
> 
>  in the download "Best of both worlds", which would get you by most
>  likely.
> 
> Jim.
> 


From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Tue Jul 31 07:57:22 2018
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2018 22:57:22 +1000
Subject: [AccessD] Fwd: Backend Database corruption using VPN access
In-Reply-To: <5B605AD9.17989.29CD90D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <mailman.961.1532877675.10896.accessd@databaseadvisors.com>,
	<015e01d428c3$933ae030$b9b0a090$@verizon.net>,
	<5B605AD9.17989.29CD90D@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <5B605CB2.27621.2A411C9@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

Just had a look at their https://www.jstreettech.com/web-v-desktop.aspx

Wish you had posted this yesterday.  I just spent two hours this afternoon discussing a 
project where some people wanted to put the  complete Corporate Information System for a 
professional institution on a remote web server because they want members to be able to 
access a small subset of the data online.  :(

They initially asserted that a CMS (probably Joomla) could do everything that the corporate 
MIS needed!



On 31 Jul 2018 at 22:49, Stuart McLachlan wrote:

> What a great website.  I  hadn't come across that one before.  I've
> grabbed a lot of their downloads to examine.
> 
> I'm also going to steal some of their "What we do" etc to update my
> Company Profile and proposal documentation  :)
> 
> On 31 Jul 2018 at 7:42, Jim Dettman wrote:
> 
> > 
> >   There are some tricks though, which are pointed out here:
> > 
> > https://www.jstreettech.com/downloads.aspx
> > 
> >  in the download "Best of both worlds", which would get you by most
> >  likely.
> > 
> > Jim.
> > 
> 
> -- 
> AccessD mailing list
> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From newsgrps at dalyn.co.nz  Tue Jul 31 21:24:11 2018
From: newsgrps at dalyn.co.nz (David Emerson)
Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2018 14:24:11 +1200
Subject: [AccessD] Clean Shut Down of Access When Left Open in RDP
Message-ID: <001e01d4293e$bbe671e0$33b355a0$@dalyn.co.nz>

Hi Listers,

 

A client has a problem with Access data corruption when a user on RDP leaves
the Access application open and the users are forcibly logged off the RDS
servers.

 

Is there a way for Access to be closed first before the user is logged off?

 

Regards

David Emerson
Dalyn Software Ltd
Wellington, New Zealand

 

 


From BWalsh at healthinsight.org  Tue Jul 31 21:27:23 2018
From: BWalsh at healthinsight.org (Bob Walsh)
Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2018 02:27:23 +0000
Subject: [AccessD] Clean Shut Down of Access When Left Open in RDP
In-Reply-To: <001e01d4293e$bbe671e0$33b355a0$@dalyn.co.nz>
References: <001e01d4293e$bbe671e0$33b355a0$@dalyn.co.nz>
Message-ID: <MWHPR1301MB2109F87036838B7729207248D72D0@MWHPR1301MB2109.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>

There is code out there to shut down the access app after a period of inactivity.
I'll look for it in the morning and get it to you.

Bob

From: AccessD [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of David Emerson
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 7:24 PM
To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: [AccessD] Clean Shut Down of Access When Left Open in RDP

[Attn: This is an external email.]

Hi Listers,



A client has a problem with Access data corruption when a user on RDP leaves
the Access application open and the users are forcibly logged off the RDS
servers.



Is there a way for Access to be closed first before the user is logged off?



Regards

David Emerson
Dalyn Software Ltd
Wellington, New Zealand





--
AccessD mailing list
AccessD at databaseadvisors.com<mailto:AccessD at databaseadvisors.com>
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd<http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd>
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com<http://www.databaseadvisors.com>

________________________________
HealthInsight is a private, nonprofit, community-based organization dedicated to improving health and health care, with offices in four western states: Nevada, New Mexico, Oregon and Utah. HealthInsight also has operations in Seattle, Wash., and Glendale, Calif., supporting End-Stage Renal Disease Networks in the Western United States. The information and any materials included in this transmission may contain confidential information from HealthInsight. The information is intended for use by the person named on this transmittal. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or use of the contents of this transmission is prohibited. If you have received this message in error, please inform the sender and delete all copies.