From shamil at users.mns.ru  Sun May  1 20:12:36 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 05:12:36 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor: A new
	petitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
References: <s273d036.020@cactus.dk>
Message-ID: <002201c54eb4$09300930$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

> A lot of talk has taken place here about the progress in
> outsourcing programming work to Ukraine, Russia and India,
I hear the rumors of these talks here. I know about the off-shore companies
here.
A lot of them abuses programmers. There are good ones too.
But they all make good software because they have usually good Russian
programmers.
And programmers are sometimes(often) a kind of fanatics you know. Especially
younger ones.
Ready to work for small money just to have modern computers, unlimited
Internet access, access to the latest legal software - all what is rather
expensive to afford for their salaries - they work this way for several;
years and then they leave Russia forever...
Still salaries in these off-shore programming companies here are not good
enough to work in them and keep well my family of five people. I don't
expect the situation with salaries in these companies will change soon to
the better...

I'd prefer to set up my relationships with Western companies by myself and
to let the programmers I'd work here together (if any) to earn the money
they deserve...

> The only advice you can get is to either stay off dealing with such
> companies or be prepared for the worst.
These companies are dictating here "the rules of the game".
It's not easy to stay away from them.
What "worst" should I be prepared for?

Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 8:36 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor: A new
petitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> Hi Shamil
>
> Thanks for the comprehensive update!
>
> You are absolutely right that much more work could be done across the
> borders.
> But that said, it is my impression that an increase is happening,
> though slowly because of tradition and the time it takes for adopting
> new habits. A lot of talk has taken place here about the progress in
> outsourcing programming work to Ukraine, Russia and India, and
> globalisation is the hot political topic because much labour intense
> work is moved to our neighbour countries due to the very high rates
> here.
>
> And sure I remember Alexander. What he is experiencing is sadly the
> behaviour of many large companies acting like they own the World.
> However, my guess is that he will be able to handle it.
> The only advice you can get is to either stay off dealing with such
> companies or be prepared for the worst.
>
> /gustav
>
> >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 04/30 1:02 am >>>
> Hi Gustav,
>
> Yes, I first thought the original petition on IDL was a serious appeal.
> Then
> I found they are kidding this way. Yes, that was a well made joke but
> these
> very talented and of course highly skilled IT professionals look like
> more
> and more "boiling in their own juice" (Russian ethimological
> expression).
> Technology race to feed the "hungry" technology itself. A kind of a
> self-satisfaction devil. Sad story...
>
> I wish I have never programmed on MS Windows and if it ever happens I
> get a
> good and longterm contract for Linux/Unix... whatever will interest me
> professionally and financially and for me to have time to get skilled
> in the
> mainstream development on this platforms then I'd not think for a long
> time
> to make this transition decision. I did program on IBM 370 for 5+ years
> then
> was 5+ years PDP11/RSX-11M, then 5+ years MS DOS and for 10 years now
> MS
> Windows - that latter looks like drained too much of my "juice". I need
> to
> change that probably. On the other hand the choices are not that large
> - I
> don't like Java because its main purpose IMO was and still is to
> compete
> with and to "kill" MS Windows platform...
>
> > Of course, if the development involves a lot of discussion
> > with clients for custom applications, the method will not
> > be effective - these cases demand physical presence.
> It could still be effective when working with Russians and East
> Europeans: I
> did work with Germans and other Western European companies, but Germany
> is a
> very representative example I think:
>
> - it's well known that the IT-stuff of the German companies(I'm
> talking
> about IT companies because I know about them only)  - the stuff of them
> is
> "migrating" all around the country, often living in expensive hotels,
> the
> managerial staff takes just a day long expensive shuttle business trips
> to
> every corner of the Germany and other West European and not only West
> European countries etc. The same happens all over the West Europe -
> this is
> how the business works there. You know that better than me. Of course
> this
> is Germans and the West Europeans own business to keep and count all
> that
> expenses and after all these expenses are good(?) because they pump
> money
> all over their countries and don't let their economies "to sleep"...
>
> OK, you were talking about physical presence there - if I take the
> representative IMO sample of German IT business then I could say that
> expenses to get a developer from Russia there on-site for a short
> business
> trip to talk to the customer are usually less than expenses for the
> German
> IT-staff.(two way economic class plane ticket is usually cheaper than
> internal Germany plane trip - this is a proven fact). Well the time is
> two-three hours more to go there by plane taking into account we need
> to
> usually be in airport two hours before departure but for business trips
> this
> gap should be possible to minimize I think...
>
> And I'm not talking here and I'm not proposing to substitute German
> IT-stuff
> by having less expensive overheads Russian staff - I'm talking as I
> wrote in
> my previous message about opening the new opportunities because with
> on
> average lower overhead expenses and with lower rates the developers
> from
> Russia can work based on (because of lower personal income tax rate
> here and
> slightly lower life costs for comparable life level) - because of  all
> that
> the projects, which will never start there because of their high
> costs,
> these projects become financially approved and profitable when shared
> among
> Western and Russian (West European) staff.
>
> But I still see a few (literally none, maybe I'm missing something?) of
> such
> joint staff venture companies here where IT-staff works as free and
> equally
> respected employees from all over the World based on fair rates based
> on
> real European level life costs here (it's less here as I wrote but not
> a
> matter of magnitude like one may think) - I don't see that. I could be
> blind. But I do know (I have heard that by my own ears) that it's a
> shame
> there in your countries to pay for high quality work the money, which
> are
> good enough just for simple foods and a cheap flat renting, some
> average
> quality clothes and a used car spoiling this environment  - and (some
> of/most of)  the Western businesses here they don't care about that,
> closing
> their eyes on very high exploitation level here and participating in
> this
> "unfair game". Yes, I know these Western businesses here are just a
> small
> percent of the other serious and fair small- and middle-size
> businesses,
> which do not hurry to invest in this economy because of corruption,
> unclear
> business rules etc.etc. (this country problems of course) - but while
> your
> fair business owners are sleeping there your unfair "colleagues"
> together
> with "new Russians" are taking control on this country(wood processing
> industry is controlled by US, Swedish and some other western countries
> capitals etc.), exploiting its resources and its people to the max...
>
> The most of the people here are getting mad of that, they don't
> believe
> nobody anymore, they don't see any hopes for the near better future not
> only
> for them but for their children also and the Western businesses here
> don't
> make it any better the way they are doing business here when they may
> think
> they are a kind of doing charity when giving work to the Russians....
>
> I probably don't understand something in this life and World  but the
> big
> money rules this world, the young people (my children included despite
> my
> efforts, my mistake of course) are spoiled by talking and thinking a
> way too
> much than it should have token about money - money is everything here
> now, a
> child can't go to good school without money, you can't get good
> healthcare
> without money(but even paying good money you can get into a  big
> trouble
> like e.g I got with teeth implant), you can't get good sports (like
> tennis)
> and well equipped fitness without money etc.etc - when one will count
> all
> that expenses then the life costs become very high. Of course I can go
> for
> sports jogging on the beach and eat porridge and cabbage and walk and
> use
> only public transportation - then if I pay all that humble expenses
> for
> myself and for my family then the salary, which Alcatel(French-Belgium
> company branch here) managers are proposing here for a very serious
> position
> of their IT stuff - then this will be enough. And they don't get
> ashamed of
> that...
>
> The state cares little about all that despite all the good words they
> sometimes say, "new Russians" care little about that, Western
> businesses
> here care a little bit more but still far less they care about their
> stuff
> in their own countries for comparative work efforts...
>
> What I wanted to say by all that hectic stuff above? - I wanted to say
> maybe
> it's time to start fair direct business between our countries'
> peoples,
> people to people, family to family, business to business, start small
> and
> gradually growing big enough, leaving out of the board "old and new
> Russians", spoiled bureaucrats, officials and politicians and
> "capitalistic
> exploitation", playing fair game and paying fair salaries for good work
> This
> is possible I'm sure despite the fact one may find me groundless
> dreamer...
>
> There are good money in IT-business here you know. You may ask why then
> I'm
> looking for my work there? I will try to explain: It happened this way
> that
> I worked here for fifteen years after highschool and I didn't even
> think to
> go there where you live when most of my colleagues were leaving and who
> are
> still there, forever probably. I wanted to live and work in my
> homeland.
> This was uneasy, very uneasy I must say with galloping inflation and
> empty
> food shops shelves. Then occasionally I have got a work abroad. This
> was
> occasionally, I mean that - I didn't even think this may happen real
> soon
> and I didn't try to find my fortune there despite the fact I was
> already for
> some time in Internet newsgroups etc. - this was my former colleague
> who
> landed me this project who was starting an off-shore development
> company and
> they urgently needed of an experienced MS Access programmer there in
> Germany. I went there and I got the project with the salary ten times
> higher
> than I was making here that time (the prices difference between West
> Europe
> and Russia was quite high that time - this difference is almost zero
> now,
> except gasoline and flat rents for average block houses flats). So I
> got
> this project and I got into an international team and here where I
> found
> what free (German) world in IT-software house means. That was very
> similar
> to what we had here in Soviet times (believe me! I mean the way people
> work
> as we worked here before Perestroika/Glasnost (I was a computer
> science
> researcher/developer in Technical University) - we worked well, I'm
> working
> the same way/quality now - many my western colleagues find this is a
> very
> good work) except that they were paying good money for the good work
> done,
> good enough to get everywhere in this World one may wish (that time I
> first
> time in my life went to the tourist trip with family to Egypt), good
> enough
> to have free time between projects looking for and trying to land
> another
> project etc. And this was the time when I decided that this should be
> the
> way how it should work here in Russia too. And I still think it's
> possible
> to make it this way. I see here these "hungry for the good and well
> paid
> work" eyes of young people and not that young people and I can say
> this
> people here can do a lot when they treated fair way but most of them
> don't
> believe this is possible at all without leaving this country forever
> because
> of all what happened with this country during the last centuries and
> especially during last 20 years of communism fall and the wild
> capitalism
> "growth"...
>
> So there are good money in IT-businesses here. In big IT-businesses
> and
> projects. But I'm not in this camp. And I didn't try to get into it
> because
> the game they play is rarely fair here. They are often pumping money
> between
> bank accounts for very little work done signing fake projects. When
> good
> work done then the money are paid not to the people who did the main
> work
> but to all kinds of business owners, managers and consultants doing a
> few,
> if any useful work etc. And (sometimes a big share) goes to "the left"
> -
> these are bribes, gifts, presents to land another large project with
> so
> little useful output and so big money paid. This is how it often
> happens
> here...
>
> ...but with well developed and effective joint small-/midlle-size
> business
> there and here there are good chances to enter this well paid
> IT-business
> market here. And to start to play and work using the fair game rules
> only.
> You may get the good profits, immensive market, the best developers
> here and
> you'll change a little this spoiled world to the better. Isn't that a
> good
> goal?...
>
> ...and today's small IT-software programming businesses, a few of them
> here,
> they are just balancing on zero level because of high software piracy
> level
> and because there is no good enough demand on custom software here
> because
> average salaries are small and so in many jobs, which are usually
> automated
> there in your countries it's more financially profitable to use "man
> power"
> than a computer program  - so there is no the small custom software
> programming business here, well paid business I mean (I did check that
> when
> was trying to find a job here - I did check that in the main
> recruitment
> agency of this city and they know the existing job market in details).
> So
> the business area where most of you work there and the business where
> I
> could have worked in the case it existed here - it's just absent, it
> doesn't
> exist here. This is why I'm working on the Add-ins for the Netherlands
> company, this is why I did write a program for the Belgian Federal
> Road
> Police, this is why I'm trying to find other projects via Internet...
>
> I don't want to leave this country. I wanted to live here, work and
> travel
> worldwide, live for a while there, talk to the customer/business
> partners
> there, invite you here, talk together to the customers here etc.
>
> I think this is possible. All costs included on my dreams above come
> true
> and based on less than usual for the same quality work there rate if
> staying
> mainly here. And without getting your jobs off-shore making higher your
> own
> unemployment rate. But by opening new business opportunities for your
> and my
> business, your and my country people. Working directly. Business to
> business. Making real life everyday work....
>
> Best regards,
> Shamil
>
> P.S. BTW, Gustav, Alexander, do you remember him?, the big payroll/HRM
> software
> author and a small software company owner, he is "fighting" with one
> American recruitment company here (this is a huge worldwide
> international
> with American headquarters recruitement comany), which uses his
> software.
> They do not want to pay the fair price for this high quality software
> but
> the chances they quit are low I think - they got hooked with this his
> software, they need and so they are just trying to trade pennies from
> the
> huge profits they are getting here (e.g. if Alcatel or Interl or Sun
> hire
> via this company a skilled IT-professional they would have gotten for
> this
> "head" and just this head only a little bit less than Alexander wanted
> to
> charge them for one year support (and they sells hundreds or more of
> such
> "heads" per year) - is that a fair business of this Amercian
> company?(one
> should have seen the rooms they have their staff working in...) I
> don't
> think
> it's fair but as I see the unfair rules can be changed and are changing
> even
> here when strong and wise players like Alexander are getting in this
> market
> with real applications, which make the difference and which create the
> new
> opportunities...
>
> --
> Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
> To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
> Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 6:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor: A new petition to
> supportoutdated(?)technologies...
>
>
> > Hi Shamil
> >
> > I don't find this OT, on the contrary very relevant.
> >
> > It's right that software doesn't get worn out - thus, to state that
> > some software has turned bad just because something new is available,
> is
> > wrong. What matters is if it runs stable and at acceptable speed and
> if
> > it interfaces easily if that is needed (which, by the way, in my
> > experience is the typical reason for obsoleting an application).
> >
> > As to "off-shore development" - we just call it outsourcing here -
> it
> > is perfectly acceptable for jobs where human interaction is not that
> > important. My son in law gets zope programming done in India and I'm
> > convinced we will experience much more of such cross boarder
> development
> > - as your helper add-ins project demonstrates. Of course, if the
> > development involves a lot of discussion with clients for custom
> > applications, the method will not be effective - these cases demand
> > physical presence.
> >
> > /gustav
> >
> >
> > >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 04/29 2:01 pm >>>
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I'm a kind of changing my profession (:)) and I'm asking for your
> > opinion of
> > this my first try to write a humoristic and slightly (hopefully
> > slightly
> > only) sarcastic text - please go here if you have time:
> >
> > http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s/idlpetit.htm
> >
> > and have a look and send me, please, your feedback privately
> >
> > Any feedback is very welcome!
> >
> > Honestly, I'm looking for setting long-term partnerships with
> > somebody.
> >
> > The recent my programming works are here:
> >
> > http://www.code-vb.com/download.htm
> > (Help Generator set of Add-ins).
> >
> > No, I'm not trying to promote this stuff for you to purchase it -
> I'm
> > just
> > referring
> > it to show what was done here recently, off-shore, without any phone
> > talks,
> > any business trips - just using e-mail ping-pong and in urgent cases
> > MS
> > Messenger chatting to send short specs and to get back developed
> > software.
> >
> > Yes, I know, off-shore development isn't in favor there.
> > Should I leave my homeland and go there to maybe have better life
> and
> > to
> > compete for the jobs with you there at your home?
> > Yes, the chances to land a better job look much higher in this
> > case(statistics) but I think I can do some very good stuff here,
> which
> > I
> > will not be able to do there because it will cost more because of
> the
> > higher
> > life costs and the higher taxes rates there.
> > Therefore, IMO,  my off-shore development proposal is a fair
> business
> > proposal because I'm not going "sitting here" to compete with you
> > there
> > using "dirt-cheap" dumping rates but I'm going to compete by
> proposing
> > slightly lower rates, which will open opportunities, which in other
> > cases
> > will not be opened at all because they will be financially
> > meaningless...
> > So, I propose to get into longterm cooperation to assist you in your
> > business and for you to assist me in my off-shore development
> > freelance
> > business...
> >
> > Thank you,
> > Shamil
> >
> > P.S. Crossposted to Dba-OT. Will it reach it or not, I'm unsure
> about
> > that,
> > if it will reach, please, don't reply on this message there in
> DBA-OT,
> > please, send me your feedback privately because I'm not reading
> DBA-OT
> > these
> > days....
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Gustav at cactus.dk  Mon May  2 03:48:27 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 10:48:27 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor: A
	newpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
Message-ID: <s2760599.041@cactus.dk>

Hi Shamil

Some of these companies promise you the World but when it comes to
paying your invoice they try to reduce it, delay the payment - even
cancel the payment - by whatever method and excuse they can find or by
claiming your delivery to not be as agreed. 
The trick is that you are weak and need your money, thus sooner or
later you either give up or are ready to whatever compromise just to get
some money. I've seen it all. Of course, most companies employ decent
people and behave correctly, but the bad ones you just have to learn how
they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.

/gustav

>>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 3:12 am >>>

What "worst" should I be prepared for?



From shamil at users.mns.ru  Mon May  2 06:23:34 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 15:23:34 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:
	Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
References: <s2760599.041@cactus.dk>
Message-ID: <004001c54f09$6233a960$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

Hello Gustav --

> Some of these companies promise you the World
Yes, I have "been there seen that..."

<<<
but the bad ones you just have to learn how
> they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
>>>
Do you have some special "detectors" for this their bad smelling? :)
I mean the cliche words, behavioral patterns they use to postpone payment or
even cancel any payments?

They are usually in a hurry and don't have time for any, even very short
specs - right?
When the first (prototype) version is delivered they change their mind
considerably and are trying to force you to redo a lot and again without any
specs, formal docs,  advance payments etc. They delay testing of the ready
software saying their customer didn't pay them yet... They don't have
acceptance test specs, do not want you to spend time to prepare such specs
in advance and with every test cycle they find new and new "bugs" to fix,
which are in fact change requests etc.etc.

Thank you,
Best regards,
Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:
Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> Hi Shamil
>
> Some of these companies promise you the World but when it comes to
> paying your invoice they try to reduce it, delay the payment - even
> cancel the payment - by whatever method and excuse they can find or by
> claiming your delivery to not be as agreed.
> The trick is that you are weak and need your money, thus sooner or
> later you either give up or are ready to whatever compromise just to get
> some money. I've seen it all. Of course, most companies employ decent
> people and behave correctly, but the bad ones you just have to learn how
> they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
>
> /gustav
>
> >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 3:12 am >>>
>
> What "worst" should I be prepared for?
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Gustav at cactus.dk  Mon May  2 07:14:55 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 14:14:55 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday
	Humor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
Message-ID: <s2763606.042@cactus.dk>

Hi Shamil

It sounds like you have met a lot of these bad guys. And unfortunately
you mostly have to learn by experience.

One classic though - which smells really bad - is the small "pilot
project"; if carried out successfully the big project with the fat
budget is waiting for you. However, all sorts of things must be changed
or polished because "the pilot project must be perfect and approved
before we launch the big job". You work like a mad only to find out that
"the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".

/gustav


>>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 1:23 pm >>>
Hello Gustav --

> Some of these companies promise you the World
Yes, I have "been there seen that..."

<<<
but the bad ones you just have to learn how
> they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
>>>
Do you have some special "detectors" for this their bad smelling? :)
I mean the cliche words, behavioral patterns they use to postpone
payment or
even cancel any payments?

They are usually in a hurry and don't have time for any, even very
short
specs - right?
When the first (prototype) version is delivered they change their mind
considerably and are trying to force you to redo a lot and again
without any
specs, formal docs,  advance payments etc. They delay testing of the
ready
software saying their customer didn't pay them yet... They don't have
acceptance test specs, do not want you to spend time to prepare such
specs
in advance and with every test cycle they find new and new "bugs" to
fix,
which are in fact change requests etc.etc.

Thank you,
Best regards,
Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:
Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> Hi Shamil
>
> Some of these companies promise you the World but when it comes to
> paying your invoice they try to reduce it, delay the payment - even
> cancel the payment - by whatever method and excuse they can find or
by
> claiming your delivery to not be as agreed.
> The trick is that you are weak and need your money, thus sooner or
> later you either give up or are ready to whatever compromise just to
get
> some money. I've seen it all. Of course, most companies employ
decent
> people and behave correctly, but the bad ones you just have to learn
how
> they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
>
> /gustav
>
> >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 3:12 am >>>
>
> What "worst" should I be prepared for?



From shamil at users.mns.ru  Mon May  2 10:37:46 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 19:37:46 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT:
	FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
References: <s2763606.042@cactus.dk>
Message-ID: <002401c54f2c$e523a140$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

Hi Gustav,

> One classic though - which smells really bad -
> is the small "pilot project
So never ever participate in the "small pilot projects"?
What about Proof Of Concept(POC) kind of projects? - when it's not even
clear is that possible to implement what client wanted to be developed?

> "the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
They are always stupid? :)
I mean have you seen/met with some smart high level and not that high level
managers? :)
That was my experience here in Soviet Union and then Russia that there are
very few good managers.
What a surprise was when I have found that there on the West there are also
a few good managers! (This is not I who thought most of them not good
enough - these were native people of these Western countries I worked with
who characterized them this way...)
I have seen two good managers so far and not the high level - what I have
heard/seen of rather high level managers - they were always "stupid
superiors" :)

The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all that
"stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of peoples and
billions of dollars...

...as far as I see here in Russia a capitalistic country is mainly a
chaotically developing  "beast"(what a surprise!?)  - the least state tries
to "touch" it, the best for its self-development...

... the tragedy of the Soviet Union(if we will not take into account
genocide against its own people in 20ies-50ies of the last century) and of
nowadays Russia is that state is trying to have too much bureaucratic
control on capitalistic businesses and in the same time lets them to exploit
to the max their workers and employees. If the state here gave more freedom
to the businesses and in the same time didn't let them to exploit that heavy
their workers everything would have developed here much faster...

...yes, I know it's easy to say "stupid superiors" - and it's not that
easy(?) to be these supermanagers...

Best regards,
Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT:
FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> Hi Shamil
>
> It sounds like you have met a lot of these bad guys. And unfortunately
> you mostly have to learn by experience.
>
> One classic though - which smells really bad - is the small "pilot
> project"; if carried out successfully the big project with the fat
> budget is waiting for you. However, all sorts of things must be changed
> or polished because "the pilot project must be perfect and approved
> before we launch the big job". You work like a mad only to find out that
> "the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
>
> /gustav
>
>
> >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 1:23 pm >>>
> Hello Gustav --
>
> > Some of these companies promise you the World
> Yes, I have "been there seen that..."
>
> <<<
> but the bad ones you just have to learn how
> > they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
> >>>
> Do you have some special "detectors" for this their bad smelling? :)
> I mean the cliche words, behavioral patterns they use to postpone
> payment or
> even cancel any payments?
>
> They are usually in a hurry and don't have time for any, even very
> short
> specs - right?
> When the first (prototype) version is delivered they change their mind
> considerably and are trying to force you to redo a lot and again
> without any
> specs, formal docs,  advance payments etc. They delay testing of the
> ready
> software saying their customer didn't pay them yet... They don't have
> acceptance test specs, do not want you to spend time to prepare such
> specs
> in advance and with every test cycle they find new and new "bugs" to
> fix,
> which are in fact change requests etc.etc.
>
> Thank you,
> Best regards,
> Shamil
> --
> Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
> To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
> Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 12:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:
> Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
>
>
> > Hi Shamil
> >
> > Some of these companies promise you the World but when it comes to
> > paying your invoice they try to reduce it, delay the payment - even
> > cancel the payment - by whatever method and excuse they can find or
> by
> > claiming your delivery to not be as agreed.
> > The trick is that you are weak and need your money, thus sooner or
> > later you either give up or are ready to whatever compromise just to
> get
> > some money. I've seen it all. Of course, most companies employ
> decent
> > people and behave correctly, but the bad ones you just have to learn
> how
> > they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
> >
> > /gustav
> >
> > >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 3:12 am >>>
> >
> > What "worst" should I be prepared for?
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Gustav at cactus.dk  Mon May  2 11:00:36 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 18:00:36 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech]
	OT:FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
Message-ID: <s2766ae4.066@cactus.dk>

Hi Shamil

Nothing wrong with the small/pilot/POC projects, just make sure to
budget them on their own to be worth your time spent.

About the superiors, surprisingly many are stupid, most mediocre, and a
few stand out.
One alarm for stupid superior is paying to much attention to the
detail; the bright superior will always leave the details to the
specialists.

/gustav 

>>> shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 5:37 pm >>>
Hi Gustav,

> One classic though - which smells really bad -
> is the small "pilot project
So never ever participate in the "small pilot projects"?
What about Proof Of Concept(POC) kind of projects? - when it's not
even
clear is that possible to implement what client wanted to be
developed?

> "the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
They are always stupid? :)
I mean have you seen/met with some smart high level and not that high
level
managers? :)
That was my experience here in Soviet Union and then Russia that there
are
very few good managers.
What a surprise was when I have found that there on the West there are
also
a few good managers! (This is not I who thought most of them not good
enough - these were native people of these Western countries I worked
with
who characterized them this way...)
I have seen two good managers so far and not the high level - what I
have
heard/seen of rather high level managers - they were always "stupid
superiors" :)

The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all
that
"stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of peoples
and
billions of dollars...

...as far as I see here in Russia a capitalistic country is mainly a
chaotically developing  "beast"(what a surprise!?)  - the least state
tries
to "touch" it, the best for its self-development...

... the tragedy of the Soviet Union(if we will not take into account
genocide against its own people in 20ies-50ies of the last century) and
of
nowadays Russia is that state is trying to have too much bureaucratic
control on capitalistic businesses and in the same time lets them to
exploit
to the max their workers and employees. If the state here gave more
freedom
to the businesses and in the same time didn't let them to exploit that
heavy
their workers everything would have developed here much faster...

...yes, I know it's easy to say "stupid superiors" - and it's not that
easy(?) to be these supermanagers...

Best regards,
Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 4:14 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT:
FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> Hi Shamil
>
> It sounds like you have met a lot of these bad guys. And
unfortunately
> you mostly have to learn by experience.
>
> One classic though - which smells really bad - is the small "pilot
> project"; if carried out successfully the big project with the fat
> budget is waiting for you. However, all sorts of things must be
changed
> or polished because "the pilot project must be perfect and approved
> before we launch the big job". You work like a mad only to find out
that
> "the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".



From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Mon May  2 17:08:56 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Tue, 03 May 2005 08:08:56 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT:
	FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
In-Reply-To: <002401c54f2c$e523a140$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <42773198.7827.170467B0@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 2 May 2005 at 19:37, Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:

> 
> The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all that
> "stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of peoples and
> billions of dollars...
 
The Peter Principle - everyone rises to their level of incompetence.
The good ones are those who haven't reached that level yet.


The US Presidency being a prime example :-)




-- 
Stuart




From shamil at users.mns.ru  Tue May  3 03:12:19 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Tue, 3 May 2005 12:12:19 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech]
	OT:FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
References: <42773198.7827.170467B0@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <004501c54fb7$d4e5da10$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

> The Peter Principle - everyone rises to their level of incompetence.
> The good ones are those who haven't reached that level yet.
Yes, you're right Stuart - I didn't know about this work:

http://www.envisionsoftware.com/articles/Peter_Principle.html

This seems to be a Universal principle.

> The US Presidency being a prime example :-)
Well, American people is lucky there is no way to change their Constitution
to prolong presidency on the third, four,... period of time. (I didn't mean
the current US president, nor did I mean any past American presidents, nor I
mean any future presidents... :))

What very probably will happen here in several years is that our
Constitution will be patched ( :( ) and the role of the president of this
country will be diminished and the role of the Prime Minister will be made
the main one in this state - one haven't be a magician to predict who will
become the Prime Minister here that time...

Best regards,
Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart McLachlan" <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues"
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 2:08 AM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech]
OT:FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> On 2 May 2005 at 19:37, Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:
>
> >
> > The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all that
> > "stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of peoples
and
> > billions of dollars...
>
> The Peter Principle - everyone rises to their level of incompetence.
> The good ones are those who haven't reached that level yet.
>
>
> The US Presidency being a prime example :-)
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> Stuart
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Gustav at cactus.dk  Tue May  3 05:52:20 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Tue, 03 May 2005 12:52:20 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech]
	OT:FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
Message-ID: <s2777417.076@cactus.dk>

Hi Stuart

It may not be a prime example. 
What would the next level be??

/gustav


>>> stuart at lexacorp.com.pg 05/03 12:08 am >>>
On 2 May 2005 at 19:37, Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:

> The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all
that
> "stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of
peoples and
> billions of dollars...
 
The Peter Principle - everyone rises to their level of incompetence.
The good ones are those who haven't reached that level yet.

The US Presidency being a prime example :-)
-- 
Stuart



From shamil at users.mns.ru  Tue May  3 09:15:13 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Tue, 3 May 2005 18:15:13 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] OPINION: C++ developers who learned C# will realise they
	didn't need to...
Message-ID: <001501c54fea$86b83d50$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

http://www.danappleman.com/index.php?p=35

Comment by Grumpy Old Programmer - 4/29/2005 @ 3:11 am
<<<
It's slightly under 5 years since I started using .NET and so I've been
re-evaluating. For many desktop VB developers, I think the real reason they
want to continue doing VB6 is because it does a better job than the .NET
platform for the type of applications they create. Of course there are many
amazing new features in VS 2005 - but what would VB6 look like now if it had
received continued investment? If you think hard, it can be tricky to think
of things that .NET has that could not have been added incrementally to VB6
(please don't tell me that inheritance is a must-have for application
developers, and take note that we now have registry-free COM). Perhaps
.NET's major innovation is its security framework, which most people ignore
anyway. VB6 is only dead because it has been killed, and consequently, if
you're still using VB6, you will just have to move, sooner or later. Just
remember that you are incurring the cost of re-skilling simply because
Microsoft got scared by Java.
If it's any consolation, when VS 2005 ships, all those C++ developers who
learned C# will realise they didn't need to. C++ in VS2005 scores over C# on
all important measures.
>>>

Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May  4 06:36:58 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 4 May 2005 12:36:58 +0100 
Subject: [dba-Tech] Printers!
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D28E3@ALCUXB>

Argh! I reckon that 90% of my problems with printers would be solved if they
all defaulted to paper sizes that are actually in use in the UK... Why don't
they all use A4 as standard? Surely the UK market is big enough that we can
all stand up to HP and say "This is an A4 printer, why must you insist on
putting "Letter" on it?" What is letter sized anyway?
 
I've worked for various companies here, and all of them use A4 as standard,
and print the occasional piece on A3. That's it. No other sizes... no
Foolscap, Letter, Legal, Executive or Ledger... A4 and A3...
 
Sorry, I needed to get that off my chest :-)
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
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Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From Gustav at cactus.dk  Wed May  4 07:37:03 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Wed, 04 May 2005 14:37:03 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Printers!
Message-ID: <s278de31.002@cactus.dk>

Hi Jon

You learn to live with it though as a non-English country we are used
to that localised printer drivers do understand that A4 is used i
Europe. But if a user has a Windows in UK/US version installed, all the
trouble is back.

Worse yet, when Access 97 is installed on Windows XP, for some reason
when you receive a fresh copy of an application and open it the first
time, Access resets all paper formats to not that of the report, not the
default paper format of the printer (which always is A4) but - you
guessed it - Letter. Then you have to open every report, change the
paper format to A4 and save the report. Great fun!

/gustav

>>> Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/04 1:36 pm >>>
Argh! I reckon that 90% of my problems with printers would be solved if
they
all defaulted to paper sizes that are actually in use in the UK... Why
don't
they all use A4 as standard? Surely the UK market is big enough that we
can
all stand up to HP and say "This is an A4 printer, why must you insist
on
putting "Letter" on it?" What is letter sized anyway?
 
I've worked for various companies here, and all of them use A4 as
standard,
and print the occasional piece on A3. That's it. No other sizes... no
Foolscap, Letter, Legal, Executive or Ledger... A4 and A3...
 
Sorry, I needed to get that off my chest :-)



From peter.brawley at earthlink.net  Wed May  4 09:02:15 2005
From: peter.brawley at earthlink.net (Peter Brawley)
Date: Wed, 04 May 2005 09:02:15 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Printers!
In-Reply-To: <s278de31.002@cactus.dk>
References: <s278de31.002@cactus.dk>
Message-ID: <4278D5E7.4060103@earthlink.net>

/>Worse yet, when Access 97 is installed on Windows XP, for some reason
 >when you receive a fresh copy of an application and open it the first
 >time, Access resets all paper formats to not that of the report, not the
 >default paper format of the printer (which always is A4) but - you
 >guessed it - Letter. Then you have to open every report, change the
 >paper format to A4 and save the report. Great fun!/

Not to defend M$oft idiocies but isn't that a registry setting?

PB


Gustav Brock wrote:

>Hi Jon
>
>You learn to live with it though as a non-English country we are used
>to that localised printer drivers do understand that A4 is used i
>Europe. But if a user has a Windows in UK/US version installed, all the
>trouble is back.
>
>Worse yet, when Access 97 is installed on Windows XP, for some reason
>when you receive a fresh copy of an application and open it the first
>time, Access resets all paper formats to not that of the report, not the
>default paper format of the printer (which always is A4) but - you
>guessed it - Letter. Then you have to open every report, change the
>paper format to A4 and save the report. Great fun!
>
>/gustav
>
>  
>
>>>>Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/04 1:36 pm >>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>Argh! I reckon that 90% of my problems with printers would be solved if
>they
>all defaulted to paper sizes that are actually in use in the UK... Why
>don't
>they all use A4 as standard? Surely the UK market is big enough that we
>can
>all stand up to HP and say "This is an A4 printer, why must you insist
>on
>putting "Letter" on it?" What is letter sized anyway?
> 
>I've worked for various companies here, and all of them use A4 as
>standard,
>and print the occasional piece on A3. That's it. No other sizes... no
>Foolscap, Letter, Legal, Executive or Ledger... A4 and A3...
> 
>Sorry, I needed to get that off my chest :-)
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>
-------------- next part --------------
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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.2 - Release Date: 5/2/2005

From Gustav at cactus.dk  Wed May  4 09:49:45 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Wed, 04 May 2005 16:49:45 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Printers!
Message-ID: <s278fd42.004@cactus.dk>

Hi Peter

That's what I thought but which? It's not the default and sometimes not
even the first listed in the registry. We've even tried to delete it
where found but the driver rebuilds the paper format list, so you are
trapped.

/gustav

>>> peter.brawley at earthlink.net 05/04 4:02 pm >>>
/>Worse yet, when Access 97 is installed on Windows XP, for some
reason
 >when you receive a fresh copy of an application and open it the
first
 >time, Access resets all paper formats to not that of the report, not
the
 >default paper format of the printer (which always is A4) but - you
 >guessed it - Letter. Then you have to open every report, change the
 >paper format to A4 and save the report. Great fun!/

Not to defend M$oft idiocies but isn't that a registry setting?

PB


Gustav Brock wrote:

>Hi Jon
>
>You learn to live with it though as a non-English country we are used
>to that localised printer drivers do understand that A4 is used i
>Europe. But if a user has a Windows in UK/US version installed, all
the
>trouble is back.
>
>Worse yet, when Access 97 is installed on Windows XP, for some reason
>when you receive a fresh copy of an application and open it the first
>time, Access resets all paper formats to not that of the report, not
the
>default paper format of the printer (which always is A4) but - you
>guessed it - Letter. Then you have to open every report, change the
>paper format to A4 and save the report. Great fun!
>
>/gustav
>
>  
>
>>>>Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/04 1:36 pm >>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>Argh! I reckon that 90% of my problems with printers would be solved
if
>they all defaulted to paper sizes that are actually in use in the
UK... Why
>don't they all use A4 as standard? Surely the UK market is big enough
that we
>can all stand up to HP and say "This is an A4 printer, why must you
insist
>on putting "Letter" on it?" What is letter sized anyway?
> 
>I've worked for various companies here, and all of them use A4 as
>standard, and print the occasional piece on A3. That's it. No other
sizes... no
>Foolscap, Letter, Legal, Executive or Ledger... A4 and A3...
> 
>Sorry, I needed to get that off my chest :-)



From artful at rogers.com  Wed May  4 11:30:09 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Wed, 04 May 2005 12:30:09 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech]
	OT:	FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
In-Reply-To: <002401c54f2c$e523a140$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
References: <s2763606.042@cactus.dk>
	<002401c54f2c$e523a140$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <4278F891.3060804@rogers.com>

You invite me to make a fool of myself, Shamil, but I have never yet 
shied away from such an opportunity.

In my opinion you have placed your focus on the third tragedy, not the 
first and second.

The first is that the power-vaccuum enabled the gangsters to have free 
reign, while at the same time the police in St. Petersburg didn't even 
have fax machines that worked correctly, let alone gasoline for their cars.

The second tragedy is that somehow Mr. Putin is getting away with his 
suppression of free speech. Why are there not hundreds of thousands of 
people in the streets, as recently in Ukraine? That part I cannot 
explain. Perhaps you can shed some insight.

To be fair, almost half the people in the USA still think that Saddam 
was connected to the World Trade Center tragedy, so no country is immune 
to the effects of media concentration and control. It's my guess that 
the Canadian media are even more concentrated than the American media, 
but even within one nation that is not the problem. The problem is the 
Rupert Murdochs, the Time-Life-Warners, the vertical integration of film 
studios, TV stations, newspapers and toy-manufacturers. The result is 
the same editorial in 30 countries (albeit in the local language), 
movies that gross $200M in the first two weeks then die because finally 
the word gets around that they stink, and toys tied to the 
aforementioned movies that are given away in fast-food restaurants whose 
apparent purpose is to fatten the population like pigs fattened for the 
market.

The problem, the real problem, is that the MBAs have learned all their 
strategies from the mob. And this is a global problem. More effective 
here, less effective there, but it's the same problem in every country 
you examine.

Arthur

Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:

>Hi Gustav,
>
>  
>
>>One classic though - which smells really bad -
>>is the small "pilot project
>>    
>>
>So never ever participate in the "small pilot projects"?
>What about Proof Of Concept(POC) kind of projects? - when it's not even
>clear is that possible to implement what client wanted to be developed?
>
>  
>
>>"the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
>>    
>>
>They are always stupid? :)
>I mean have you seen/met with some smart high level and not that high level
>managers? :)
>That was my experience here in Soviet Union and then Russia that there are
>very few good managers.
>What a surprise was when I have found that there on the West there are also
>a few good managers! (This is not I who thought most of them not good
>enough - these were native people of these Western countries I worked with
>who characterized them this way...)
>I have seen two good managers so far and not the high level - what I have
>heard/seen of rather high level managers - they were always "stupid
>superiors" :)
>
>The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all that
>"stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of peoples and
>billions of dollars...
>
>...as far as I see here in Russia a capitalistic country is mainly a
>chaotically developing  "beast"(what a surprise!?)  - the least state tries
>to "touch" it, the best for its self-development...
>
>... the tragedy of the Soviet Union(if we will not take into account
>genocide against its own people in 20ies-50ies of the last century) and of
>nowadays Russia is that state is trying to have too much bureaucratic
>control on capitalistic businesses and in the same time lets them to exploit
>to the max their workers and employees. If the state here gave more freedom
>to the businesses and in the same time didn't let them to exploit that heavy
>their workers everything would have developed here much faster...
>
>...yes, I know it's easy to say "stupid superiors" - and it's not that
>easy(?) to be these supermanagers...
>
>Best regards,
>Shamil
>--
>Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
>To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
>Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 4:14 PM
>Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT:
>FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
>
>
>  
>
>>Hi Shamil
>>
>>It sounds like you have met a lot of these bad guys. And unfortunately
>>you mostly have to learn by experience.
>>
>>One classic though - which smells really bad - is the small "pilot
>>project"; if carried out successfully the big project with the fat
>>budget is waiting for you. However, all sorts of things must be changed
>>or polished because "the pilot project must be perfect and approved
>>before we launch the big job". You work like a mad only to find out that
>>"the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
>>
>>/gustav
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>>>>>shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 1:23 pm >>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>Hello Gustav --
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Some of these companies promise you the World
>>>      
>>>
>>Yes, I have "been there seen that..."
>>
>><<<
>>but the bad ones you just have to learn how
>>    
>>
>>>they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
>>>      
>>>
>>Do you have some special "detectors" for this their bad smelling? :)
>>I mean the cliche words, behavioral patterns they use to postpone
>>payment or
>>even cancel any payments?
>>
>>They are usually in a hurry and don't have time for any, even very
>>short
>>specs - right?
>>When the first (prototype) version is delivered they change their mind
>>considerably and are trying to force you to redo a lot and again
>>without any
>>specs, formal docs,  advance payments etc. They delay testing of the
>>ready
>>software saying their customer didn't pay them yet... They don't have
>>acceptance test specs, do not want you to spend time to prepare such
>>specs
>>in advance and with every test cycle they find new and new "bugs" to
>>fix,
>>which are in fact change requests etc.etc.
>>
>>Thank you,
>>Best regards,
>>Shamil
>>--
>>Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
>>To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
>>Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 12:48 PM
>>Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:
>>Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Hi Shamil
>>>
>>>Some of these companies promise you the World but when it comes to
>>>paying your invoice they try to reduce it, delay the payment - even
>>>cancel the payment - by whatever method and excuse they can find or
>>>      
>>>
>>by
>>    
>>
>>>claiming your delivery to not be as agreed.
>>>The trick is that you are weak and need your money, thus sooner or
>>>later you either give up or are ready to whatever compromise just to
>>>      
>>>
>>get
>>    
>>
>>>some money. I've seen it all. Of course, most companies employ
>>>      
>>>
>>decent
>>    
>>
>>>people and behave correctly, but the bad ones you just have to learn
>>>      
>>>
>>how
>>    
>>
>>>they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
>>>
>>>/gustav
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>>>shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 3:12 am >>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>What "worst" should I be prepared for?
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>dba-Tech mailing list
>>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>    
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>  
>


From shamil at users.mns.ru  Wed May  4 14:24:22 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Wed, 4 May 2005 23:24:22 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:...
References: <s2763606.042@cactus.dk><002401c54f2c$e523a140$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<4278F891.3060804@rogers.com>
Message-ID: <000501c550de$e392aed0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

> The first is that the power-vaccuum enabled the gangsters to have free
> reign,
Arthur,

You say "is that" - do you mean that "gangsters reign" is still here?
If yes, then I'd note that it's almost finished. Even when it was here -
first part of 90ies mainly - it wasn't a problem for ordinary people - they
were fighting mainly each other with very rare casualties of people around.
yes, this was a problem for small- and middle- business who had that time to
pay these gangsters...
Yes, I think it's finished - at least I don't see that small-/middle-size
businesses have to look for a "roof" now to not have any troubles from
gangsters. What is still here are bureaucratic officials who used to force
to give them bribes. But they don't use gunpower - they use bureaucracy as
their tool to disturb businesses to grow...

> The second tragedy is that somehow Mr. Putin is getting away with his
> suppression of free speech. Why are there not hundreds of thousands of
> people in the streets, as recently in Ukraine? That part I cannot
> explain. Perhaps you can shed some insight.
There is no a leader here who people believe.
And there is no a visible figure on horizon for this position as a Putin's
opponent.
There is no an active civil society here to make any actions without leaders
(this may end in a big trouble with a lot of blood - remember Civil War of
1917 - 1921 here - that was a tragedy with "rivers of blood" from both Red
and White Army's sides- both were very cruel, and very big casualties and
terror on civilians - nobody wanted to have something like that here again -
and assuming that people is very tired from the life here and the opinions
are rather different on events here of different groups of population - then
any "assault" may result in a very bloody butchery here. This country is
loosing million of its population every year anyway...

People mainly do not believe to democratic forces leaders here  (they have
10-15% of the votes during elections) because they, these leaders, proved an
d prove they are more concerned about their own businesses, positions or
publicity than about this country and its population. FYI: when in 1991
there was an attempt here to restore Soviet regime a lot of people went to
streets and there was real possibility tanks enter the city etc. but people
go on the streets here in and Moskow They were leaded here that time with
that time governor of this city - Sobtachak (BTW, Putin was his consultant
that times). Sobtchak is dead now (natural death because of heart attack).
He was very popular here. A lot of people believed him.
You know who is one of the most rich young ladies in this country now - his
daughter. Many people ask themselves how it happened that a poor history
professor's daughter has millions dollars on her accounts when most of the
population are under poverty level? And such examples are many...

...do you think people are silly here to go fighting leaded by people who
think first of all about themselves?

...so Putin's positions are very strong and the chances somebody appears
here in the near future are low.

Ordinary people do not believe nor to democratic leaders, nor to the
goodwill of foreign countries, which businesses exploit people here  almost
same way "new Russians" do.

So, it looks like better to have here "blood-free" slow developing
semi-totalitarian wild capitalism based with absent civil society
semi-feudal country than anything else - the chances are it will naturally
evaluationate in something more open and free - this trend can't be
suppressed I think I see that looking at young people here. This country is
developing economically, very slow but developing - this is a fact...

Once again in this situation Putin's positions are very strong.

I did vote for democratic party leader on last presidential elections here
as I did all the other times before the last elections after the fall of the
Soviet Union. My voice and the voice of another ~15% of population can't
change the situation here...

No way for qucik changes here to free active civil society, no way. Young
coming generations - 20 years old now - they could change the situation
probably - in 10-20 years...

I can be wrong. I'd be happy to be wrong. But I don't want bloody fight
here. I do think free society will be estableshed here sooner or later.
Better later and by evolution than sooner but by bloody new revolution...

Best regards,
Shamil
--
Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arthur Fuller" <artful at rogers.com>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues"
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 8:30 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech]OT:
FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...


> You invite me to make a fool of myself, Shamil, but I have never yet
> shied away from such an opportunity.
>
> In my opinion you have placed your focus on the third tragedy, not the
> first and second.
>
> The first is that the power-vaccuum enabled the gangsters to have free
> reign, while at the same time the police in St. Petersburg didn't even
> have fax machines that worked correctly, let alone gasoline for their
cars.
>
> The second tragedy is that somehow Mr. Putin is getting away with his
> suppression of free speech. Why are there not hundreds of thousands of
> people in the streets, as recently in Ukraine? That part I cannot
> explain. Perhaps you can shed some insight.
>
> To be fair, almost half the people in the USA still think that Saddam
> was connected to the World Trade Center tragedy, so no country is immune
> to the effects of media concentration and control. It's my guess that
> the Canadian media are even more concentrated than the American media,
> but even within one nation that is not the problem. The problem is the
> Rupert Murdochs, the Time-Life-Warners, the vertical integration of film
> studios, TV stations, newspapers and toy-manufacturers. The result is
> the same editorial in 30 countries (albeit in the local language),
> movies that gross $200M in the first two weeks then die because finally
> the word gets around that they stink, and toys tied to the
> aforementioned movies that are given away in fast-food restaurants whose
> apparent purpose is to fatten the population like pigs fattened for the
> market.
>
> The problem, the real problem, is that the MBAs have learned all their
> strategies from the mob. And this is a global problem. More effective
> here, less effective there, but it's the same problem in every country
> you examine.
>
> Arthur
>
> Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:
>
> >Hi Gustav,
> >
> >
> >
> >>One classic though - which smells really bad -
> >>is the small "pilot project
> >>
> >>
> >So never ever participate in the "small pilot projects"?
> >What about Proof Of Concept(POC) kind of projects? - when it's not even
> >clear is that possible to implement what client wanted to be developed?
> >
> >
> >
> >>"the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
> >>
> >>
> >They are always stupid? :)
> >I mean have you seen/met with some smart high level and not that high
level
> >managers? :)
> >That was my experience here in Soviet Union and then Russia that there
are
> >very few good managers.
> >What a surprise was when I have found that there on the West there are
also
> >a few good managers! (This is not I who thought most of them not good
> >enough - these were native people of these Western countries I worked
with
> >who characterized them this way...)
> >I have seen two good managers so far and not the high level - what I have
> >heard/seen of rather high level managers - they were always "stupid
> >superiors" :)
> >
> >The (rhetoric) question is how this World is still running with all that
> >"stupid superiors" making the decisions influencing millions of peoples
and
> >billions of dollars...
> >
> >...as far as I see here in Russia a capitalistic country is mainly a
> >chaotically developing  "beast"(what a surprise!?)  - the least state
tries
> >to "touch" it, the best for its self-development...
> >
> >... the tragedy of the Soviet Union(if we will not take into account
> >genocide against its own people in 20ies-50ies of the last century) and
of
> >nowadays Russia is that state is trying to have too much bureaucratic
> >control on capitalistic businesses and in the same time lets them to
exploit
> >to the max their workers and employees. If the state here gave more
freedom
> >to the businesses and in the same time didn't let them to exploit that
heavy
> >their workers everything would have developed here much faster...
> >
> >...yes, I know it's easy to say "stupid superiors" - and it's not that
> >easy(?) to be these supermanagers...
> >
> >Best regards,
> >Shamil
> >--
> >Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
> >----- Original Message ----- 
> >From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
> >To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
> >Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 4:14 PM
> >Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT:
> >FridayHumor:Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>Hi Shamil
> >>
> >>It sounds like you have met a lot of these bad guys. And unfortunately
> >>you mostly have to learn by experience.
> >>
> >>One classic though - which smells really bad - is the small "pilot
> >>project"; if carried out successfully the big project with the fat
> >>budget is waiting for you. However, all sorts of things must be changed
> >>or polished because "the pilot project must be perfect and approved
> >>before we launch the big job". You work like a mad only to find out that
> >>"the big job is canceled by the stupid superiors".
> >>
> >>/gustav
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 1:23 pm >>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>Hello Gustav --
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>Some of these companies promise you the World
> >>>
> >>>
> >>Yes, I have "been there seen that..."
> >>
> >><<<
> >>but the bad ones you just have to learn how
> >>
> >>
> >>>they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>Do you have some special "detectors" for this their bad smelling? :)
> >>I mean the cliche words, behavioral patterns they use to postpone
> >>payment or
> >>even cancel any payments?
> >>
> >>They are usually in a hurry and don't have time for any, even very
> >>short
> >>specs - right?
> >>When the first (prototype) version is delivered they change their mind
> >>considerably and are trying to force you to redo a lot and again
> >>without any
> >>specs, formal docs,  advance payments etc. They delay testing of the
> >>ready
> >>software saying their customer didn't pay them yet... They don't have
> >>acceptance test specs, do not want you to spend time to prepare such
> >>specs
> >>in advance and with every test cycle they find new and new "bugs" to
> >>fix,
> >>which are in fact change requests etc.etc.
> >>
> >>Thank you,
> >>Best regards,
> >>Shamil
> >>--
> >>Web: http://smsconsulting.spb.ru/shamil_s
> >>
> >>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
> >>To: <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
> >>Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 12:48 PM
> >>Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] OT: Friday Humor:
> >>Anewpetitiontosupportoutdated(?)technologies...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>Hi Shamil
> >>>
> >>>Some of these companies promise you the World but when it comes to
> >>>paying your invoice they try to reduce it, delay the payment - even
> >>>cancel the payment - by whatever method and excuse they can find or
> >>>
> >>>
> >>by
> >>
> >>
> >>>claiming your delivery to not be as agreed.
> >>>The trick is that you are weak and need your money, thus sooner or
> >>>later you either give up or are ready to whatever compromise just to
> >>>
> >>>
> >>get
> >>
> >>
> >>>some money. I've seen it all. Of course, most companies employ
> >>>
> >>>
> >>decent
> >>
> >>
> >>>people and behave correctly, but the bad ones you just have to learn
> >>>
> >>>
> >>how
> >>
> >>
> >>>they smell so you can step back before real work is delivered.
> >>>
> >>>/gustav
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>shamil at users.mns.ru 05/02 3:12 am >>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>What "worst" should I be prepared for?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>dba-Tech mailing list
> >>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> >>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> >>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >>
> >>
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >dba-Tech mailing list
> >dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> >http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> >Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 08:54:30 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 08:54:30 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505050654191febc4@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Group,

I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone
through all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus
check, Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download
and install Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6,
update Ad-Aware SE and run it, and even repair the Windows XP
installation. My only concerns with this system are: 1) that Norton
Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly and I don't have the lady's
installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro subscription expired almost
two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update site doesn't work.

Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the
latest version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of
"activity" in that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to
100%...but the "checking for latest version" screen doesn't go away.
My suspicion is that IE itself is compromised.

I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take
care of the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a
good dozen of the Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I
went to the individual Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and
clicked on the links to get the security update...and each time I was
directed to the Windows Update page where it doesn't go past the
"Checking for the latest version of the Windows Update software..."
stage.

For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original
ISP that the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the
upper right-hand corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.

Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I
have also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the
Security Center, it shows that the automatic updates option has not
been configured. If I click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
this:

"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic
Updates settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to
System in Control Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select
Automatic (recommended), and then click OK."

Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes
FOREVER for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its
information. Last night I waited it out. Several minutes went by and
then I saw the Update information. It was set to Automatic Updates,
but I wanted to change the time that it would check for updates. So I
changed it to 11:00pm and clicked Apply. I had to wait another
interminable time before I could click OK. We're talking 20 minutes or
so in total for those two simple acts: click the Automatic Updates tab
and Apply the new setting.

Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then,
what? Do I have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend
doing that to this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not
NTFS....but, like, I've spent way too much time on this already.

Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
-- 
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security


From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 10:02:29 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 10:02:29 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f30505050654191febc4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>

Steve,
Sounds like you've run the gamut! In really bad cases (I've got two sitting
here now) I run multiple Spyware detectors (after the initial Trend-Micro,
MS-AS) and then manually remove the detections (if the free version won't do
it). Panda, CA, X-Cleaner, Norton, F-Secure, Ad-Aware, Spybot S&D, Webroot,
CheckPoint(Zone Alarm), Aluria. Can all be run one at a time (or many at the
same) so I just do that while I'm working on other things.

Have you booted into safe mode and tried resetting the windows update
settings as the administrator account? Also try the repair feature of IE.
Turn off the software firewall and set the IE settings back to the defaults.
(I'm assuming you're behind a router/HW firewall.) Try running the updates
after that. Also try a registry optimizer on it if you have one. Systemworks
or Vcom, etc. or try http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcpitstop/default.asp if you
don't.

You could also download the updates from another PC using the Windows Update
Catalog. I used to make CDs of all the updates once a month or so and then
use the CD with dial-up customers. It was kind of putsy but better than
waiting for dialup downloads (Thankfully most of my customers have DSL now!)

Another possible issue - NAV 2005 has some major quirks about it. Up until
2004 it was my top recommendation for home users (or NIS) but I have run
into many issues with it and unfortunately Symantec's answer always seems to
come down to "uninstall all Symantec software and re-install". I would
suggest uninstalling it. I suggest, if its OK with your friend, that you try
AVG or another free for personal use AV. For home users I now recommend
AVG/Sygate personal firewall and MS-AS (which I don't care for but hey, its
free and it works pretty good).

Anyway, there's my 2 scents...

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 8:55 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

Dear Group,

I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone through
all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
site doesn't work.

Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the latest
version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
for latest version" screen doesn't go away.
My suspicion is that IE itself is compromised.

I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of the
Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the Windows
Update software..."
stage.

For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP that
the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.

Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
this:

"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
then click OK."

Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night I
waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and clicked
Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click the
Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.

Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do I
have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like, I've
spent way too much time on this already.

Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
--
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 10:48:22 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 10:48:22 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Time Sync
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2720@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505051548.j45FmRkb360426@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Follow up on this issue:
Everything you want to know about the Windows Time Service and how to tweak
it:
http://www.askmarvin.ca/files/White_Paper_The_Windows_2000_Time_Service.pdf

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2005 10:08 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Time Sync

Do a google search for atomic clocks or time servers... I used to have one
on my pc that updated itself 24 times a day, or whenever you set it, and you
could set it to connect to one of over 30 other atomic clock servers for
accuracy.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 12 April 2005 16:05
To: _DBA-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Time Sync


Hi all,

I have a client with whom I'm setting up a mobil testing lab network. The
network is peer to peer with no server. Each computer has various pieces of
testing equipment attached to it that need to be accurately time
synchronized with each other. This lab will not be connected to the
internet.

I don't see a method to change the synchronization server in WinXP to use
another PC (only a domain server). I used to do time sync with NT server and
batch files but that was once a day a login. Given the discrepancies in
type/models of PCs, and the inherit unreliability of PC clocks, this would
probably need a constantly running process.

Any ideas?

John


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The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
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the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Thu May  5 11:01:00 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 17:01:00 +0100 
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2902@ALCUXB>

I haven't seen anything exactly like that per se, but I have had some
trouble with IE (who hasn't?) before. If you go to
www.microsoft.com/downloads you can download the administrator installer for
Internet Explorer 6 SP1, which you can run from a memory stick or a cd or
something. Reinstall it from scratch, it should let you do that. 

You can install the latest version of the free version of zonealarm without
any problems - if her subscription has run out then she has out of date
protection, and my reasoning would be that a slightly downgraded up to date
firewall is better than a 2 year old one with bells and whistles on.

I'd also run a Panda online scan, and download McAfee Stinger and let that
run, just to be on the safe side too.


Oh, and speaking of Belarc, I installed that last week, and the next time I
ran my spyware checkers, it was full of back office things... I don't
remember visiting any spurious websites or installing anything else, and I'm
surprised that a security product would install something that's likely to
be flagged as spyware without telling you...

Sorry, meant to post this hours ago, but someone went and broke a pc...
users! :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Erbach [mailto:erbachs at gmail.com]
Sent: 05 May 2005 14:55
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?


Dear Group,

I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone
through all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus
check, Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download
and install Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6,
update Ad-Aware SE and run it, and even repair the Windows XP
installation. My only concerns with this system are: 1) that Norton
Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly and I don't have the lady's
installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro subscription expired almost
two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update site doesn't work.

Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the
latest version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of
"activity" in that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to
100%...but the "checking for latest version" screen doesn't go away.
My suspicion is that IE itself is compromised.

I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take
care of the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a
good dozen of the Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I
went to the individual Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and
clicked on the links to get the security update...and each time I was
directed to the Windows Update page where it doesn't go past the
"Checking for the latest version of the Windows Update software..."
stage.

For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original
ISP that the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the
upper right-hand corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.

Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I
have also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the
Security Center, it shows that the automatic updates option has not
been configured. If I click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
this:

"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic
Updates settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to
System in Control Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select
Automatic (recommended), and then click OK."

Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes
FOREVER for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its
information. Last night I waited it out. Several minutes went by and
then I saw the Update information. It was set to Automatic Updates,
but I wanted to change the time that it would check for updates. So I
changed it to 11:00pm and clicked Apply. I had to wait another
interminable time before I could click OK. We're talking 20 minutes or
so in total for those two simple acts: click the Automatic Updates tab
and Apply the new setting.

Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then,
what? Do I have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend
doing that to this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not
NTFS....but, like, I've spent way too much time on this already.

Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
-- 
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From peter.brawley at earthlink.net  Thu May  5 12:51:39 2005
From: peter.brawley at earthlink.net (Peter Brawley)
Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 12:51:39 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <427A5D2B.4030308@earthlink.net>

Steve, John

I saw something similar with an infected PC running w2k and NAV. The 
only remedy I could find: removed NAV completely (not trivial), ran two 
spyware removers till they each found nothing, ran Grisoft Antivirus 
repeatedly till it found nothing, ran a registry repair utility, and 
installed Firefox as the default browser.

PB

-----

John Bartow wrote:

>Steve,
>Sounds like you've run the gamut! In really bad cases (I've got two sitting
>here now) I run multiple Spyware detectors (after the initial Trend-Micro,
>MS-AS) and then manually remove the detections (if the free version won't do
>it). Panda, CA, X-Cleaner, Norton, F-Secure, Ad-Aware, Spybot S&D, Webroot,
>CheckPoint(Zone Alarm), Aluria. Can all be run one at a time (or many at the
>same) so I just do that while I'm working on other things.
>
>Have you booted into safe mode and tried resetting the windows update
>settings as the administrator account? Also try the repair feature of IE.
>Turn off the software firewall and set the IE settings back to the defaults.
>(I'm assuming you're behind a router/HW firewall.) Try running the updates
>after that. Also try a registry optimizer on it if you have one. Systemworks
>or Vcom, etc. or try http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcpitstop/default.asp if you
>don't.
>
>You could also download the updates from another PC using the Windows Update
>Catalog. I used to make CDs of all the updates once a month or so and then
>use the CD with dial-up customers. It was kind of putsy but better than
>waiting for dialup downloads (Thankfully most of my customers have DSL now!)
>
>Another possible issue - NAV 2005 has some major quirks about it. Up until
>2004 it was my top recommendation for home users (or NIS) but I have run
>into many issues with it and unfortunately Symantec's answer always seems to
>come down to "uninstall all Symantec software and re-install". I would
>suggest uninstalling it. I suggest, if its OK with your friend, that you try
>AVG or another free for personal use AV. For home users I now recommend
>AVG/Sygate personal firewall and MS-AS (which I don't care for but hey, its
>free and it works pretty good).
>
>Anyway, there's my 2 scents...
>
>John B.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 8:55 AM
>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>Dear Group,
>
>I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone through
>all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
>Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
>Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
>and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
>with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
>and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
>subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
>site doesn't work.
>
>Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the latest
>version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
>that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
>for latest version" screen doesn't go away.
>My suspicion is that IE itself is compromised.
>
>I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
>the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of the
>Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
>Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
>security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
>where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the Windows
>Update software..."
>stage.
>
>For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP that
>the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
>corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.
>
>Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
>also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
>it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
>click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
>this:
>
>"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
>settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
>Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
>then click OK."
>
>Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
>System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
>for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night I
>waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
>information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
>time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and clicked
>Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
>We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click the
>Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.
>
>Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do I
>have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
>this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like, I've
>spent way too much time on this already.
>
>Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
>--
>Regards,
>
>Steve Erbach
>Scientific Marketing
>Neenah, WI
>www.swerbach.com
>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.5 - Release Date: 5/4/2005



From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 13:05:40 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 13:05:40 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <427A5D2B.4030308@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <200505051805.j45I5iY5201354@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

I had an issue with IE not updating about 1.5 years ago - although the
reason the updates would not download was made perfectly clear in that case.
It was an improper XP ID key. It was the key that came with the CD but it
would not register correctly with MS. It had been XPhe and was upgraded to
XPPro (pre-me). In that case I had to reinstall XPpro to get it to work
correctly. It probably could have been rectified another way but I didn't
have the time to figure it all out so it was quicker to do the obvious.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Peter Brawley
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 12:52 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

Steve, John

I saw something similar with an infected PC running w2k and NAV. The only
remedy I could find: removed NAV completely (not trivial), ran two spyware
removers till they each found nothing, ran Grisoft Antivirus repeatedly till
it found nothing, ran a registry repair utility, and installed Firefox as
the default browser.

PB

-----

John Bartow wrote:

>Steve,
>Sounds like you've run the gamut! In really bad cases (I've got two 
>sitting here now) I run multiple Spyware detectors (after the initial 
>Trend-Micro,
>MS-AS) and then manually remove the detections (if the free version 
>won't do it). Panda, CA, X-Cleaner, Norton, F-Secure, Ad-Aware, Spybot 
>S&D, Webroot, CheckPoint(Zone Alarm), Aluria. Can all be run one at a 
>time (or many at the
>same) so I just do that while I'm working on other things.
>
>Have you booted into safe mode and tried resetting the windows update 
>settings as the administrator account? Also try the repair feature of IE.
>Turn off the software firewall and set the IE settings back to the
defaults.
>(I'm assuming you're behind a router/HW firewall.) Try running the 
>updates after that. Also try a registry optimizer on it if you have 
>one. Systemworks or Vcom, etc. or try 
>http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcpitstop/default.asp if you don't.
>
>You could also download the updates from another PC using the Windows 
>Update Catalog. I used to make CDs of all the updates once a month or 
>so and then use the CD with dial-up customers. It was kind of putsy but 
>better than waiting for dialup downloads (Thankfully most of my 
>customers have DSL now!)
>
>Another possible issue - NAV 2005 has some major quirks about it. Up 
>until
>2004 it was my top recommendation for home users (or NIS) but I have 
>run into many issues with it and unfortunately Symantec's answer always 
>seems to come down to "uninstall all Symantec software and re-install". 
>I would suggest uninstalling it. I suggest, if its OK with your friend, 
>that you try AVG or another free for personal use AV. For home users I 
>now recommend AVG/Sygate personal firewall and MS-AS (which I don't 
>care for but hey, its free and it works pretty good).
>
>Anyway, there's my 2 scents...
>
>John B.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve 
>Erbach
>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 8:55 AM
>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>Dear Group,
>
>I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone 
>through all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus 
>check, Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download 
>and install Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, 
>update Ad-Aware SE and run it, and even repair the Windows XP 
>installation. My only concerns with this system are: 1) that Norton 
>Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly and I don't have the lady's 
>installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro subscription expired almost 
>two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update site doesn't work.
>
>Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the 
>latest version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of 
>"activity" in that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 
>100%...but the "checking for latest version" screen doesn't go away.
>My suspicion is that IE itself is compromised.
>
>I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care 
>of the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good 
>dozen of the Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to 
>the individual Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the 
>links to get the security update...and each time I was directed to the 
>Windows Update page where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the 
>latest version of the Windows Update software..."
>stage.
>
>For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP 
>that the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper 
>right-hand corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.
>
>Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I 
>have also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the 
>Security Center, it shows that the automatic updates option has not 
>been configured. If I click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
>this:
>
>"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic 
>Updates settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System 
>in Control Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic 
>(recommended), and then click OK."
>
>Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to 
>System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes 
>FOREVER for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. 
>Last night I waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the 
>Update information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to 
>change the time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 
>11:00pm and clicked Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I
could click OK.
>We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: 
>click the Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.
>
>Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? 
>Do I have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing 
>that to this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not 
>NTFS....but, like, I've spent way too much time on this already.
>
>Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
>--
>Regards,
>
>Steve Erbach
>Scientific Marketing
>Neenah, WI
>www.swerbach.com
>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security 
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>


--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.5 - Release Date: 5/4/2005

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From tinanfields at torchlake.com  Thu May  5 13:12:08 2005
From: tinanfields at torchlake.com (Tina Norris Fields)
Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 14:12:08 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] PDF data extractor recommendation
References: <20050318195417.NMUF12676.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <427A61F8.2010201@torchlake.com>

Jim,
Finally going through my email lists (Mom died the end of January, and 
we've had a rough few months) - stumbled on this thread and wondered if 
you had found a solution.
Would the pdfedit995  tool work?  It has a tab for grabbing the text 
from the most recently created pdf file and generating a summary of the 
text.  Don't know whether things like columnar positioning remain 
intact.  Hard to beat the software995 pricing - free for most things.
Worth checking out,
Tina

jmoss111 at bellsouth.net wrote:

>Thanks James, but that sounds like too much manual labor for what I have to do. I will most likely go ahead and purchase something because I end up extracting columnar data from pdfs a couple of times a year.
>
>The last time I had to extract from pdf, I had a 30 day demo of a very nice tool that let you define your columnar data by drawing around the columns and saving that as a model, kind of like Monarch. The problem was the price.... $249.00.  If extracting columns from pdf files was something I did on a daily basis, it wouldn't be a problem. Oh well, no bucks No Buck Rogers.
>
>  
>




From pharold at proftesting.com  Thu May  5 13:39:40 2005
From: pharold at proftesting.com (Perry Harold)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 14:39:40 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f30505050654191febc4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001301c551a1$cc659100$192da8c0@D58BT131Perry>

Steve

I had a problem somewhat similar when one of the spyware protectors deleted
some spyware that was on the machine and in the process the winsock was
hosed.  Couldn't get to Windows Update and most of the time could not get
IE6 to work at all.  Tried Firefox and it wouldn't work either.

I don't recall the site but I searched with Google and found a program to
reset the winsock - something like winsockfix.exe or similar.  Sorry - can't
locate whether I saved it or not.

Perry Harold

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 9:55 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?


Dear Group,

I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone through
all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
site doesn't work.

Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the latest
version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
for latest version" screen doesn't go away. My suspicion is that IE itself
is compromised.

I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of the
Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the Windows
Update software..." stage.

For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP that
the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.

Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
this:

"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
then click OK."

Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night I
waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and clicked
Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click the
Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.

Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do I
have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like, I've
spent way too much time on this already.

Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
-- 
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com




From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 13:51:10 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 13:51:10 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <001301c551a1$cc659100$192da8c0@D58BT131Perry>
Message-ID: <200505051851.j45IpEY5122544@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

That rings a bell. I think someone recently posted something to that effect
on this list.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Perry Harold
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:40 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

Steve

I had a problem somewhat similar when one of the spyware protectors deleted
some spyware that was on the machine and in the process the winsock was
hosed.  Couldn't get to Windows Update and most of the time could not get
IE6 to work at all.  Tried Firefox and it wouldn't work either.

I don't recall the site but I searched with Google and found a program to
reset the winsock - something like winsockfix.exe or similar.  Sorry - can't
locate whether I saved it or not.

Perry Harold

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 9:55 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?


Dear Group,

I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone through
all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
site doesn't work.

Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the latest
version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
for latest version" screen doesn't go away. My suspicion is that IE itself
is compromised.

I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of the
Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the Windows
Update software..." stage.

For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP that
the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.

Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
this:

"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
then click OK."

Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night I
waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and clicked
Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click the
Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.

Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do I
have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like, I've
spent way too much time on this already.

Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
--
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Thu May  5 15:12:44 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 13:12:44 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
References: <200505051851.j45IpEY5122544@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <427A7E3C.80502@shaw.ca>

I found a reference to winsockfix in this forum site I often visit for 
XP problems
http://www.windowsbbs.com
http://www.windowsbbs.com/showthread.php?t=44261&highlight=winsockfix
I usually read through posts here for caveats on windows utilities 
before I try or download
and sure enuff I found one with a pointer here

http://www.tek-tips.com/faqs.cfm?fid=4625

Special Note For Win XP Service Pack 2 Users:

Service Pack 2 adds a new command to repair the Winsock corruption 
problem that can be caused by adware, spyware, or some other causes.  
You should use this instead of the utility WinsockFix:
netsh winsock reset catalog

Using this command should normally not do any harm, so if you have 
unsolvable connection problems or spurious disconnections, try it. It 
does remove all nonstandard LSP (Layered Service Provider) entries from 
the Winsock catalog, which are usually adware or spyware entries, but if 
you happened to have a legitimate one installed, it would also be 
removed and would have to be reinstalled.

If you're really curious, you can use the command:

netsh winsock show catalog

before and after resetting the catalog to find out whether any entries 
were in fact removed and which ones these were. Another way to get at 
the same information is to run

winmsd

and select Components, Network, Protocol. The Layered Service Providers 
in the list should be of the MSAFD or RSVP ... Service Provider type. 
All others are likely malevolent and should disappear after the reset 
command shown above.



WinSockFix
http://www.softpedia.com/public/cat/12/4/12-4-47.shtml

WinSockFix offers a last resort if your Internet connectivity has been 
corrupted due to invalid or removed registry entries.
It can often cure the problem of lost connections after the removal of 
Adware components or improper uninstall of firewall applications or 
other tools that modify the XP network and Winsock settings.
If you encounter connection problems after removing network related 
software, Adware or after registry clean-up; and all other ways fail, 
then give WinSock XP Fix a try.
It can create a registry backup of your current settings, so it is 
fairly safe to use.



John Bartow wrote:

>That rings a bell. I think someone recently posted something to that effect
>on this list.
>
>
>John B.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Perry Harold
>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:40 PM
>To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>Steve
>
>I had a problem somewhat similar when one of the spyware protectors deleted
>some spyware that was on the machine and in the process the winsock was
>hosed.  Couldn't get to Windows Update and most of the time could not get
>IE6 to work at all.  Tried Firefox and it wouldn't work either.
>
>I don't recall the site but I searched with Google and found a program to
>reset the winsock - something like winsockfix.exe or similar.  Sorry - can't
>locate whether I saved it or not.
>
>Perry Harold
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 9:55 AM
>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>
>Dear Group,
>
>I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone through
>all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
>Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
>Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
>and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
>with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
>and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
>subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
>site doesn't work.
>
>Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the latest
>version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
>that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
>for latest version" screen doesn't go away. My suspicion is that IE itself
>is compromised.
>
>I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
>the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of the
>Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
>Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
>security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
>where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the Windows
>Update software..." stage.
>
>For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP that
>the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
>corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.
>
>Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
>also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
>it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
>click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
>this:
>
>"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
>settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
>Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
>then click OK."
>
>Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
>System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
>for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night I
>waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
>information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
>time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and clicked
>Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
>We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click the
>Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.
>
>Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do I
>have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
>this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like, I've
>spent way too much time on this already.
>
>Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
>--
>Regards,
>
>Steve Erbach
>Scientific Marketing
>Neenah, WI
>www.swerbach.com
>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From jon at tydda.plus.com  Thu May  5 15:17:40 2005
From: jon at tydda.plus.com (Jon Tydda)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 21:17:40 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <427A7E3C.80502@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDAEDJCGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>

That's pretty cool Marty, do you know if it works for 2000 as well?


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of MartyConnelly
Sent: 05 May 2005 21:13
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?


I found a reference to winsockfix in this forum site I often visit for
XP problems
http://www.windowsbbs.com
http://www.windowsbbs.com/showthread.php?t=44261&highlight=winsockfix
I usually read through posts here for caveats on windows utilities
before I try or download
and sure enuff I found one with a pointer here

http://www.tek-tips.com/faqs.cfm?fid=4625

Special Note For Win XP Service Pack 2 Users:

Service Pack 2 adds a new command to repair the Winsock corruption
problem that can be caused by adware, spyware, or some other causes.
You should use this instead of the utility WinsockFix:
netsh winsock reset catalog

Using this command should normally not do any harm, so if you have
unsolvable connection problems or spurious disconnections, try it. It
does remove all nonstandard LSP (Layered Service Provider) entries from
the Winsock catalog, which are usually adware or spyware entries, but if
you happened to have a legitimate one installed, it would also be
removed and would have to be reinstalled.

If you're really curious, you can use the command:

netsh winsock show catalog

before and after resetting the catalog to find out whether any entries
were in fact removed and which ones these were. Another way to get at
the same information is to run

winmsd

and select Components, Network, Protocol. The Layered Service Providers
in the list should be of the MSAFD or RSVP ... Service Provider type.
All others are likely malevolent and should disappear after the reset
command shown above.



WinSockFix
http://www.softpedia.com/public/cat/12/4/12-4-47.shtml

WinSockFix offers a last resort if your Internet connectivity has been
corrupted due to invalid or removed registry entries.
It can often cure the problem of lost connections after the removal of
Adware components or improper uninstall of firewall applications or
other tools that modify the XP network and Winsock settings.
If you encounter connection problems after removing network related
software, Adware or after registry clean-up; and all other ways fail,
then give WinSock XP Fix a try.
It can create a registry backup of your current settings, so it is
fairly safe to use.



John Bartow wrote:

>That rings a bell. I think someone recently posted something to that effect
>on this list.
>
>
>John B.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Perry Harold
>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:40 PM
>To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>Steve
>
>I had a problem somewhat similar when one of the spyware protectors deleted
>some spyware that was on the machine and in the process the winsock was
>hosed.  Couldn't get to Windows Update and most of the time could not get
>IE6 to work at all.  Tried Firefox and it wouldn't work either.
>
>I don't recall the site but I searched with Google and found a program to
>reset the winsock - something like winsockfix.exe or similar.  Sorry -
can't
>locate whether I saved it or not.
>
>Perry Harold
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 9:55 AM
>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>
>Dear Group,
>
>I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone
through
>all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
>Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
>Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
>and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
>with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
>and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
>subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
>site doesn't work.
>
>Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the
latest
>version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
>that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
>for latest version" screen doesn't go away. My suspicion is that IE itself
>is compromised.
>
>I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
>the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of
the
>Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
>Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
>security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
>where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the
Windows
>Update software..." stage.
>
>For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP
that
>the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
>corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.
>
>Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
>also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
>it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
>click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
>this:
>
>"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
>settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
>Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
>then click OK."
>
>Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
>System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
>for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night
I
>waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
>information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
>time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and
clicked
>Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
>We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click
the
>Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.
>
>Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do
I
>have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
>this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like,
I've
>spent way too much time on this already.
>
>Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
>--
>Regards,
>
>Steve Erbach
>Scientific Marketing
>Neenah, WI
>www.swerbach.com
>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
>

--
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada



_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

--
This email has been verified as Virus free
Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net



From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Thu May  5 17:25:26 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 15:25:26 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
References: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDAEDJCGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>
Message-ID: <427A9D56.9090503@shaw.ca>

I think Winsockfix works down to 98 SE and up to WinXP SP1 , the caveat 
is referring only to WinXP SP2
where Microsoft has added it's own utility fix to replace winsockfix.
I haven't looked up if there is a really conflict between winsockfix and 
winxp sp2
I would probably use MS method for winxp sp2.

Jon Tydda wrote:

>That's pretty cool Marty, do you know if it works for 2000 as well?
>
>
>Jon
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of MartyConnelly
>Sent: 05 May 2005 21:13
>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>
>
>I found a reference to winsockfix in this forum site I often visit for
>XP problems
>http://www.windowsbbs.com
>http://www.windowsbbs.com/showthread.php?t=44261&highlight=winsockfix
>I usually read through posts here for caveats on windows utilities
>before I try or download
>and sure enuff I found one with a pointer here
>
>http://www.tek-tips.com/faqs.cfm?fid=4625
>
>Special Note For Win XP Service Pack 2 Users:
>
>Service Pack 2 adds a new command to repair the Winsock corruption
>problem that can be caused by adware, spyware, or some other causes.
>You should use this instead of the utility WinsockFix:
>netsh winsock reset catalog
>
>Using this command should normally not do any harm, so if you have
>unsolvable connection problems or spurious disconnections, try it. It
>does remove all nonstandard LSP (Layered Service Provider) entries from
>the Winsock catalog, which are usually adware or spyware entries, but if
>you happened to have a legitimate one installed, it would also be
>removed and would have to be reinstalled.
>
>If you're really curious, you can use the command:
>
>netsh winsock show catalog
>
>before and after resetting the catalog to find out whether any entries
>were in fact removed and which ones these were. Another way to get at
>the same information is to run
>
>winmsd
>
>and select Components, Network, Protocol. The Layered Service Providers
>in the list should be of the MSAFD or RSVP ... Service Provider type.
>All others are likely malevolent and should disappear after the reset
>command shown above.
>
>
>
>WinSockFix
>http://www.softpedia.com/public/cat/12/4/12-4-47.shtml
>
>WinSockFix offers a last resort if your Internet connectivity has been
>corrupted due to invalid or removed registry entries.
>It can often cure the problem of lost connections after the removal of
>Adware components or improper uninstall of firewall applications or
>other tools that modify the XP network and Winsock settings.
>If you encounter connection problems after removing network related
>software, Adware or after registry clean-up; and all other ways fail,
>then give WinSock XP Fix a try.
>It can create a registry backup of your current settings, so it is
>fairly safe to use.
>
>
>
>John Bartow wrote:
>
>  
>
>>That rings a bell. I think someone recently posted something to that effect
>>on this list.
>>
>>
>>John B.
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Perry Harold
>>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:40 PM
>>To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
>>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>>
>>Steve
>>
>>I had a problem somewhat similar when one of the spyware protectors deleted
>>some spyware that was on the machine and in the process the winsock was
>>hosed.  Couldn't get to Windows Update and most of the time could not get
>>IE6 to work at all.  Tried Firefox and it wouldn't work either.
>>
>>I don't recall the site but I searched with Google and found a program to
>>reset the winsock - something like winsockfix.exe or similar.  Sorry -
>>    
>>
>can't
>  
>
>>locate whether I saved it or not.
>>
>>Perry Harold
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
>>Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 9:55 AM
>>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>>Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
>>
>>
>>Dear Group,
>>
>>I'm working on a PC that belongs to my wife's best friend. I've gone
>>    
>>
>through
>  
>
>>all the standard routines: Trend Micro Housecall on-line virus check,
>>Windows System File Checker, update to Windows XP SP2, download and install
>>Windows Anti-Spyware Beta, Gibson Research SpinRite 6, update Ad-Aware SE
>>and run it, and even repair the Windows XP installation. My only concerns
>>with this system are: 1) that Norton Anti-Virus 2005 doesn't start properly
>>and I don't have the lady's installation CD; 2) that the ZoneAlarm Pro
>>subscription expired almost two years ago; and 3) that the Windows Update
>>site doesn't work.
>>
>>Regarding #3, When I get to the page that says that it checks for the
>>    
>>
>latest
>  
>
>>version of the Windows Update software, there is a flurry of "activity" in
>>that the progress bar in IE 6 goes all the way to 100%...but the "checking
>>for latest version" screen doesn't go away. My suspicion is that IE itself
>>is compromised.
>>
>>I used an XP SP2 upgrade CD that I have, hoping that it would take care of
>>the problem. But after I ran Belarc Advisor and saw that a good dozen of
>>    
>>
>the
>  
>
>>Windows security updates had NOT been installed, I went to the individual
>>Microsoft KB articles on the upgrades and clicked on the links to get the
>>security update...and each time I was directed to the Windows Update page
>>where it doesn't go past the "Checking for the latest version of the
>>    
>>
>Windows
>  
>
>>Update software..." stage.
>>
>>For what it's worth, this copy of IE is "branded" with the original ISP
>>    
>>
>that
>  
>
>>the lady signed up with, ComCast. I see that logo in the upper right-hand
>>corner of the IE window instead of the Windows logo.
>>
>>Something is stopping this PC from being updated in the normal way. I have
>>also set the automatic updates option, but when I open the Security Center,
>>it shows that the automatic updates option has not been configured. If I
>>click on 'Turn on automatic updates,' I see
>>this:
>>
>>"We're sorry. The Security Center could not change your Automatic Updates
>>settings. To try changing these settings yourself, go to System in Control
>>Panel. On the Automatic Updates tab, select Automatic (recommended), and
>>then click OK."
>>
>>Needless, to say, that's how I tried to change the setting. If I go to
>>System and look at the Automatic Updates tab, first of all it takes FOREVER
>>for the Automatic Updates tab to actually show its information. Last night
>>    
>>
>I
>  
>
>>waited it out. Several minutes went by and then I saw the Update
>>information. It was set to Automatic Updates, but I wanted to change the
>>time that it would check for updates. So I changed it to 11:00pm and
>>    
>>
>clicked
>  
>
>>Apply. I had to wait another interminable time before I could click OK.
>>We're talking 20 minutes or so in total for those two simple acts: click
>>    
>>
>the
>  
>
>>Automatic Updates tab and Apply the new setting.
>>
>>Clearly something is compromised. If it's Internet Explorer then, what? Do
>>    
>>
>I
>  
>
>>have to re-install Windows from scratch? I would recommend doing that to
>>this lady since the drive is formatted as FAT32, not NTFS....but, like,
>>    
>>
>I've
>  
>
>>spent way too much time on this already.
>>
>>Anybody ever see anything like I've described?
>>--
>>Regards,
>>
>>Steve Erbach
>>Scientific Marketing
>>Neenah, WI
>>www.swerbach.com
>>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
>>_______________________________________________
>>dba-Tech mailing list
>>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>dba-Tech mailing list
>>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>dba-Tech mailing list
>>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>
>--
>Marty Connelly
>Victoria, B.C.
>Canada
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>--
>This email has been verified as Virus free
>Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 19:31:04 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 19:31:04 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f30505050654191febc4@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050517316e5216d9@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Since I posted that message I've dinked with this system some more. My
money is now on the possibility that my wife's friend has an
unauthorized copy of XP. The Windows CD she gave me was a copy and the
25-digit key was written on it. She said she got it from an IT friend
of hers.

I use Norton Ghost on my C: drive to back up the entire thing to my D:
drive on a regular basis. I was curious to know if I could just swap
the cables, reset the jumpers, and boot up with the Ghosted drive. But
Windows detected that it was a different hard disk and wouldn't let me
start up at all. This situation is different, but I wonder if it isn't
because of the copied Windows XP.

I will certainly try your suggestion of downloading the necessary
updates on another PC and burning them to CD.

You know, there was one other odd behavior I noticed. Yesterday I
thought, well, maybe IE is infected somehow. I couldn't find a way to
un-install it from the list of installed software. So I thought I'd
try renaming the EXE file. I did so; but a few seconds later the
program re-appeared in the program folder before my very eyes. It's
dated sometime in August of last year. I deleted the new copy of
IE...but a few seconds later, there it reappeared again. Is that
normal?

Thanks, John.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Steve,
> Sounds like you've run the gamut! In really bad cases (I've got two sitting
> here now) I run multiple Spyware detectors (after the initial Trend-Micro,
> MS-AS) and then manually remove the detections (if the free version won't do
> it). Panda, CA, X-Cleaner, Norton, F-Secure, Ad-Aware, Spybot S&D, Webroot,
> CheckPoint(Zone Alarm), Aluria. Can all be run one at a time (or many at the
> same) so I just do that while I'm working on other things.
> 
> Have you booted into safe mode and tried resetting the windows update
> settings as the administrator account? Also try the repair feature of IE.
> Turn off the software firewall and set the IE settings back to the defaults.
> (I'm assuming you're behind a router/HW firewall.) Try running the updates
> after that. Also try a registry optimizer on it if you have one. Systemworks
> or Vcom, etc. or try http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcpitstop/default.asp if you
> don't.
> 
> You could also download the updates from another PC using the Windows Update
> Catalog. I used to make CDs of all the updates once a month or so and then
> use the CD with dial-up customers. It was kind of putsy but better than
> waiting for dialup downloads (Thankfully most of my customers have DSL now!)
> 
> Another possible issue - NAV 2005 has some major quirks about it. Up until
> 2004 it was my top recommendation for home users (or NIS) but I have run
> into many issues with it and unfortunately Symantec's answer always seems to
> come down to "uninstall all Symantec software and re-install". I would
> suggest uninstalling it. I suggest, if its OK with your friend, that you try
> AVG or another free for personal use AV. For home users I now recommend
> AVG/Sygate personal firewall and MS-AS (which I don't care for but hey, its
> free and it works pretty good).
> 
> Anyway, there's my 2 scents...
> 
> John B.
> 
>


From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 19:34:18 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 19:34:18 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2902@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2902@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <39cb22f3050505173427b9a949@mail.gmail.com>

Jon,

I think I'll try that IE 6 SP1 download you suggested.

Re ZoneAlarm, all right. I'll uninstall the old Pro version and see
about installing the newer free version. I agree with you about the
more recent version.

So your ASW program saw Belarc things and flagged them as spyware, eh?
Interesting. I don't think I've run a spyware check since I installed
Belarc. I'd better check.

Thanks, Jon.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> I haven't seen anything exactly like that per se, but I have had some
> trouble with IE (who hasn't?) before. If you go to
> www.microsoft.com/downloads you can download the administrator installer for
> Internet Explorer 6 SP1, which you can run from a memory stick or a cd or
> something. Reinstall it from scratch, it should let you do that.
> 
> You can install the latest version of the free version of zonealarm without
> any problems - if her subscription has run out then she has out of date
> protection, and my reasoning would be that a slightly downgraded up to date
> firewall is better than a 2 year old one with bells and whistles on.
> 
> I'd also run a Panda online scan, and download McAfee Stinger and let that
> run, just to be on the safe side too.
> 
> Oh, and speaking of Belarc, I installed that last week, and the next time I
> ran my spyware checkers, it was full of back office things... I don't
> remember visiting any spurious websites or installing anything else, and I'm
> surprised that a security product would install something that's likely to
> be flagged as spyware without telling you...
> 
> Sorry, meant to post this hours ago, but someone went and broke a pc...
> users! :-)
> 
> Jon
>


From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 19:35:55 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 19:35:55 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <427A5D2B.4030308@earthlink.net>
References: <200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
	<427A5D2B.4030308@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050517356e3d9149@mail.gmail.com>

Peter,

I installed Firefox on this system but I haven't run the gamut you
suggested. Thanks for the tips. I hadn't heard of Grisoft.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, Peter Brawley <peter.brawley at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Steve, John
> 
> I saw something similar with an infected PC running w2k and NAV. The
> only remedy I could find: removed NAV completely (not trivial), ran two
> spyware removers till they each found nothing, ran Grisoft Antivirus
> repeatedly till it found nothing, ran a registry repair utility, and
> installed Firefox as the default browser.
> 
> PB


From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 19:39:25 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 19:39:25 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505051805.j45I5iY5201354@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <427A5D2B.4030308@earthlink.net>
	<200505051805.j45I5iY5201354@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505051739448f0c79@mail.gmail.com>

John,

As I said in my original message, I did a Repair of the Windows XP
installation from the CD (which, of course, looks to be an
unauthorized copy). Can you answer this one for me: Can Windows XP be
re-installed completely WITHOUT affecting the installed software or
re-formatting the drive? If so, I can try that, too; but I'd think
that a repair would be just about the same thing.

I've got a hankerin' to reformat the drive as NTFS anyway...but can I
get away without doing that and re-install Windows?

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> I had an issue with IE not updating about 1.5 years ago - although the
> reason the updates would not download was made perfectly clear in that case.
> It was an improper XP ID key. It was the key that came with the CD but it
> would not register correctly with MS. It had been XPhe and was upgraded to
> XPPro (pre-me). In that case I had to reinstall XPpro to get it to work
> correctly. It probably could have been rectified another way but I didn't
> have the time to figure it all out so it was quicker to do the obvious.
> 
> 
> John B.
>


From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 19:41:48 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 19:41:48 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505051851.j45IpEY5122544@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <001301c551a1$cc659100$192da8c0@D58BT131Perry>
	<200505051851.j45IpEY5122544@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505051741165d6876@mail.gmail.com>

Perry and John,

I posted something about the netsh command a month-and-a-half ago to
repair Winsock. I don't have any trouble getting on-line, though.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> That rings a bell. I think someone recently posted something to that effect
> on this list.
> 
> John B.


From erbachs at gmail.com  Thu May  5 19:49:28 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 19:49:28 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <427A7E3C.80502@shaw.ca>
References: <200505051851.j45IpEY5122544@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
	<427A7E3C.80502@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <39cb22f3050505174945d3cc54@mail.gmail.com>

Marty,

That winmsd thing, isn't that a shortcut to one of the utilities that
you'd normally have to dig way down deep into the Windows XP menus to
get at?

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, MartyConnelly <martyconnelly at shaw.ca> wrote:
> I found a reference to winsockfix in this forum site I often visit for
> XP problems
> http://www.windowsbbs.com
> http://www.windowsbbs.com/showthread.php?t=44261&highlight=winsockfix
> I usually read through posts here for caveats on windows utilities
> before I try or download
> and sure enuff I found one with a pointer here
> 
> http://www.tek-tips.com/faqs.cfm?fid=4625
> 
> Special Note For Win XP Service Pack 2 Users:
> 
> Service Pack 2 adds a new command to repair the Winsock corruption
> problem that can be caused by adware, spyware, or some other causes.
> You should use this instead of the utility WinsockFix:
> netsh winsock reset catalog
> 
> Using this command should normally not do any harm, so if you have
> unsolvable connection problems or spurious disconnections, try it. It
> does remove all nonstandard LSP (Layered Service Provider) entries from
> the Winsock catalog, which are usually adware or spyware entries, but if
> you happened to have a legitimate one installed, it would also be
> removed and would have to be reinstalled.
> 
> If you're really curious, you can use the command:
> 
> netsh winsock show catalog
> 
> before and after resetting the catalog to find out whether any entries
> were in fact removed and which ones these were. Another way to get at
> the same information is to run
> 
> winmsd
> 
> and select Components, Network, Protocol. The Layered Service Providers
> in the list should be of the MSAFD or RSVP ... Service Provider type.
> All others are likely malevolent and should disappear after the reset
> command shown above.
> 
> WinSockFix
> http://www.softpedia.com/public/cat/12/4/12-4-47.shtml
> 
> WinSockFix offers a last resort if your Internet connectivity has been
> corrupted due to invalid or removed registry entries.
> It can often cure the problem of lost connections after the removal of
> Adware components or improper uninstall of firewall applications or
> other tools that modify the XP network and Winsock settings.
> If you encounter connection problems after removing network related
> software, Adware or after registry clean-up; and all other ways fail,
> then give WinSock XP Fix a try.
> It can create a registry backup of your current settings, so it is
> fairly safe to use.
>


From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Thu May  5 20:05:06 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 18:05:06 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
References: <39cb22f30505050654191febc4@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505051502.j45F2Xqi087144@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
	<39cb22f305050517316e5216d9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <427AC2C2.7000509@shaw.ca>

WinXP SP2 won't install on a bum copy of WinXP after June or July
So you will get left out on any future XP updates aside from security ones.
There is a Microsoft WinXP SP certification site to test , if you have 
an OEM recovery disk
you won't have a key. So it checks your machine type and manufacturer to 
verify XP.
Then it sticks a verification key in your registrty.
I am not sure of all the options as it varies by country, there are 
rebates for pirated software etc.

http://news.com.com/Microsoft+Legit+Windows+or+no+updates/2100-1016_3-5550205.html?tag=nl
http://news.com.com/Microsoft+Can+we+check+your+software+license/2100-1016_3-5371664.html?tag=nl

Steve Erbach wrote:

>John,
>
>Since I posted that message I've dinked with this system some more. My
>money is now on the possibility that my wife's friend has an
>unauthorized copy of XP. The Windows CD she gave me was a copy and the
>25-digit key was written on it. She said she got it from an IT friend
>of hers.
>
>I use Norton Ghost on my C: drive to back up the entire thing to my D:
>drive on a regular basis. I was curious to know if I could just swap
>the cables, reset the jumpers, and boot up with the Ghosted drive. But
>Windows detected that it was a different hard disk and wouldn't let me
>start up at all. This situation is different, but I wonder if it isn't
>because of the copied Windows XP.
>
>I will certainly try your suggestion of downloading the necessary
>updates on another PC and burning them to CD.
>
>You know, there was one other odd behavior I noticed. Yesterday I
>thought, well, maybe IE is infected somehow. I couldn't find a way to
>un-install it from the list of installed software. So I thought I'd
>try renaming the EXE file. I did so; but a few seconds later the
>program re-appeared in the program folder before my very eyes. It's
>dated sometime in August of last year. I deleted the new copy of
>IE...but a few seconds later, there it reappeared again. Is that
>normal?
>
>Thanks, John.
>
>Steve Erbach
>
>On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
>  
>
>>Steve,
>>Sounds like you've run the gamut! In really bad cases (I've got two sitting
>>here now) I run multiple Spyware detectors (after the initial Trend-Micro,
>>MS-AS) and then manually remove the detections (if the free version won't do
>>it). Panda, CA, X-Cleaner, Norton, F-Secure, Ad-Aware, Spybot S&D, Webroot,
>>CheckPoint(Zone Alarm), Aluria. Can all be run one at a time (or many at the
>>same) so I just do that while I'm working on other things.
>>
>>Have you booted into safe mode and tried resetting the windows update
>>settings as the administrator account? Also try the repair feature of IE.
>>Turn off the software firewall and set the IE settings back to the defaults.
>>(I'm assuming you're behind a router/HW firewall.) Try running the updates
>>after that. Also try a registry optimizer on it if you have one. Systemworks
>>or Vcom, etc. or try http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcpitstop/default.asp if you
>>don't.
>>
>>You could also download the updates from another PC using the Windows Update
>>Catalog. I used to make CDs of all the updates once a month or so and then
>>use the CD with dial-up customers. It was kind of putsy but better than
>>waiting for dialup downloads (Thankfully most of my customers have DSL now!)
>>
>>Another possible issue - NAV 2005 has some major quirks about it. Up until
>>2004 it was my top recommendation for home users (or NIS) but I have run
>>into many issues with it and unfortunately Symantec's answer always seems to
>>come down to "uninstall all Symantec software and re-install". I would
>>suggest uninstalling it. I suggest, if its OK with your friend, that you try
>>AVG or another free for personal use AV. For home users I now recommend
>>AVG/Sygate personal firewall and MS-AS (which I don't care for but hey, its
>>free and it works pretty good).
>>
>>Anyway, there's my 2 scents...
>>
>>John B.
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 20:45:51 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 20:45:51 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050517316e5216d9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505060145.j461jtqi098966@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>

Isn't that part of MS's court argument that IE is integral with Windows?
;o)

Yes, it is normal. You have to do some serious hacking to get rid of IE. I
believe if you do you are somewhat limited in much of your capabilities due
to a whole slew of program relying on it being there. I kind of gave up
following that whole line of thought during the big debate because I deal
with too many small clients to ever think that I could actually replace IE
in any great amount. I think I have one client using Firefox and that's
mostly because of his college intern.

You know, there was one other odd behavior I noticed. Yesterday I thought,
well, maybe IE is infected somehow. I couldn't find a way to un-install it
from the list of installed software. So I thought I'd try renaming the EXE
file. I did so; but a few seconds later the program re-appeared in the
program folder before my very eyes. It's dated sometime in August of last
year. I deleted the new copy of IE...but a few seconds later, there it
reappeared again. Is that normal?

Thanks, John.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Steve,
> Sounds like you've run the gamut! In really bad cases (I've got two 
> sitting here now) I run multiple Spyware detectors (after the initial 
> Trend-Micro,
> MS-AS) and then manually remove the detections (if the free version 
> won't do it). Panda, CA, X-Cleaner, Norton, F-Secure, Ad-Aware, Spybot 
> S&D, Webroot, CheckPoint(Zone Alarm), Aluria. Can all be run one at a 
> time (or many at the
> same) so I just do that while I'm working on other things.
> 
> Have you booted into safe mode and tried resetting the windows update 
> settings as the administrator account? Also try the repair feature of IE.
> Turn off the software firewall and set the IE settings back to the
defaults.
> (I'm assuming you're behind a router/HW firewall.) Try running the 
> updates after that. Also try a registry optimizer on it if you have 
> one. Systemworks or Vcom, etc. or try 
> http://www.pcpitstop.com/pcpitstop/default.asp if you don't.
> 
> You could also download the updates from another PC using the Windows 
> Update Catalog. I used to make CDs of all the updates once a month or 
> so and then use the CD with dial-up customers. It was kind of putsy 
> but better than waiting for dialup downloads (Thankfully most of my 
> customers have DSL now!)
> 
> Another possible issue - NAV 2005 has some major quirks about it. Up 
> until
> 2004 it was my top recommendation for home users (or NIS) but I have 
> run into many issues with it and unfortunately Symantec's answer 
> always seems to come down to "uninstall all Symantec software and 
> re-install". I would suggest uninstalling it. I suggest, if its OK 
> with your friend, that you try AVG or another free for personal use 
> AV. For home users I now recommend AVG/Sygate personal firewall and 
> MS-AS (which I don't care for but hey, its free and it works pretty good).
> 
> Anyway, there's my 2 scents...
> 
> John B.
> 
>
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 20:54:57 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 20:54:57 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050517356e3d9149@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505060155.j461t1qT149552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

AVG "Grisoft anti-virus" A German company. Good stuff.

John B.

I hadn't heard of Grisoft.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, Peter Brawley <peter.brawley at earthlink.net> wrote:
> Steve, John
> 
> I saw something similar with an infected PC running w2k and NAV. The 
> only remedy I could find: removed NAV completely (not trivial), ran 
> two spyware removers till they each found nothing, ran Grisoft 
> Antivirus repeatedly till it found nothing, ran a registry repair 
> utility, and installed Firefox as the default browser.
> 
> PB
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 20:54:57 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 20:54:57 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f3050505173427b9a949@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505060155.j461t1qU149552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

Just because it shows up as spyware doesn't mean it is! Many remote contorl
programs will show up as spyware - radmin for example. Also in some
companies they use I-spy type programs when having a difficult employee
problem. I had a local client ask me about installing one for them last
year. Didn't have to go there, just made a few adjustment to the email
set-up for them and they had all they needed. So, don't always take
anti-spyware for an absolute.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 7:34 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

Jon,

I think I'll try that IE 6 SP1 download you suggested.

Re ZoneAlarm, all right. I'll uninstall the old Pro version and see about
installing the newer free version. I agree with you about the more recent
version.

So your ASW program saw Belarc things and flagged them as spyware, eh?
Interesting. I don't think I've run a spyware check since I installed
Belarc. I'd better check.

Thanks, Jon.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> I haven't seen anything exactly like that per se, but I have had some 
> trouble with IE (who hasn't?) before. If you go to 
> www.microsoft.com/downloads you can download the administrator 
> installer for Internet Explorer 6 SP1, which you can run from a memory 
> stick or a cd or something. Reinstall it from scratch, it should let you
do that.
> 
> You can install the latest version of the free version of zonealarm 
> without any problems - if her subscription has run out then she has 
> out of date protection, and my reasoning would be that a slightly 
> downgraded up to date firewall is better than a 2 year old one with bells
and whistles on.
> 
> I'd also run a Panda online scan, and download McAfee Stinger and let 
> that run, just to be on the safe side too.
> 
> Oh, and speaking of Belarc, I installed that last week, and the next 
> time I ran my spyware checkers, it was full of back office things... I 
> don't remember visiting any spurious websites or installing anything 
> else, and I'm surprised that a security product would install 
> something that's likely to be flagged as spyware without telling you...
> 
> Sorry, meant to post this hours ago, but someone went and broke a pc...
> users! :-)
> 
> Jon
>
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From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 21:04:01 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 21:04:01 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f30505051739448f0c79@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505060204.j46245Y6285730@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

You can reinstall XP over XP and if you run the correct options it should
pick up the installed software. But I guess that's not really "completely"
more like an upgrade of zero versions.

You should be able to use Part. Magic or a simial utility to convert FAT32
to NTFS without affecting the OS.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 7:39 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

John,

As I said in my original message, I did a Repair of the Windows XP
installation from the CD (which, of course, looks to be an unauthorized
copy). Can you answer this one for me: Can Windows XP be re-installed
completely WITHOUT affecting the installed software or re-formatting the
drive? If so, I can try that, too; but I'd think that a repair would be just
about the same thing.

I've got a hankerin' to reformat the drive as NTFS anyway...but can I get
away without doing that and re-install Windows?

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> I had an issue with IE not updating about 1.5 years ago - although the 
> reason the updates would not download was made perfectly clear in that
case.
> It was an improper XP ID key. It was the key that came with the CD but 
> it would not register correctly with MS. It had been XPhe and was 
> upgraded to XPPro (pre-me). In that case I had to reinstall XPpro to 
> get it to work correctly. It probably could have been rectified 
> another way but I didn't have the time to figure it all out so it was
quicker to do the obvious.
> 
> 
> John B.
>
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 21:04:01 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 21:04:01 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f3050505174945d3cc54@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505060204.j46245Y7285730@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

Winmsd = System Information
Easy method start | run | winmsd | enter
Mouse method start | program | accessories | system tools | system
information

Now you'll undoubtedly think the same thing I was "Why isn't this a right
click menu item on My Computer?"

With Norton System Works they place theirs there! Da Microsoft.

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 7:49 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

Marty,

That winmsd thing, isn't that a shortcut to one of the utilities that you'd
normally have to dig way down deep into the Windows XP menus to get at?

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, MartyConnelly <martyconnelly at shaw.ca> wrote:
> I found a reference to winsockfix in this forum site I often visit for 
> XP problems http://www.windowsbbs.com 
> http://www.windowsbbs.com/showthread.php?t=44261&highlight=winsockfix
> I usually read through posts here for caveats on windows utilities 
> before I try or download and sure enuff I found one with a pointer 
> here
> 
> http://www.tek-tips.com/faqs.cfm?fid=4625
> 
> Special Note For Win XP Service Pack 2 Users:
> 
> Service Pack 2 adds a new command to repair the Winsock corruption 
> problem that can be caused by adware, spyware, or some other causes.
> You should use this instead of the utility WinsockFix:
> netsh winsock reset catalog
> 
> Using this command should normally not do any harm, so if you have 
> unsolvable connection problems or spurious disconnections, try it. It 
> does remove all nonstandard LSP (Layered Service Provider) entries 
> from the Winsock catalog, which are usually adware or spyware entries, 
> but if you happened to have a legitimate one installed, it would also 
> be removed and would have to be reinstalled.
> 
> If you're really curious, you can use the command:
> 
> netsh winsock show catalog
> 
> before and after resetting the catalog to find out whether any entries 
> were in fact removed and which ones these were. Another way to get at 
> the same information is to run
> 
> winmsd
> 
> and select Components, Network, Protocol. The Layered Service 
> Providers in the list should be of the MSAFD or RSVP ... Service Provider
type.
> All others are likely malevolent and should disappear after the reset 
> command shown above.
> 
> WinSockFix
> http://www.softpedia.com/public/cat/12/4/12-4-47.shtml
> 
> WinSockFix offers a last resort if your Internet connectivity has been 
> corrupted due to invalid or removed registry entries.
> It can often cure the problem of lost connections after the removal of 
> Adware components or improper uninstall of firewall applications or 
> other tools that modify the XP network and Winsock settings.
> If you encounter connection problems after removing network related 
> software, Adware or after registry clean-up; and all other ways fail, 
> then give WinSock XP Fix a try.
> It can create a registry backup of your current settings, so it is 
> fairly safe to use.
>
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dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Thu May  5 21:04:01 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 5 May 2005 21:04:01 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f30505051741165d6876@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505060204.j46245Y5285730@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

Ah, that was it. Good tip BTW.

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 7:42 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?

Perry and John,

I posted something about the netsh command a month-and-a-half ago to repair
Winsock. I don't have any trouble getting on-line, though.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> That rings a bell. I think someone recently posted something to that 
> effect on this list.
> 
> John B.
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From jim.moss at jlmoss.net  Fri May  6 10:20:48 2005
From: jim.moss at jlmoss.net (JMoss)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 10:20:48 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] PDF data extractor recommendation
In-Reply-To: <427A61F8.2010201@torchlake.com>
Message-ID: <200505060320.j463KVA02915@databaseadvisors.com>

 Tina,

I never found anything really suitable, I ended up using ABBYY PDF
transformer. I got a text report but formatting was not maintained so I
couldn't use the files for extraction with Monarch without manual editing. I
will try the pdfedit995 and let you know how it turns out.

When I lost my dad several years ago, it was some really tough going for me
for quite some time, so I know where you are coming from. Things will get
better, but you never stop missing them, or wishing that you could talk to
them.

Thanks,

Jim

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Tina Norris
Fields
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 1:12 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] PDF data extractor recommendation

Jim,
Finally going through my email lists (Mom died the end of January, and we've
had a rough few months) - stumbled on this thread and wondered if you had
found a solution.
Would the pdfedit995  tool work?  It has a tab for grabbing the text from
the most recently created pdf file and generating a summary of the text.
Don't know whether things like columnar positioning remain intact.  Hard to
beat the software995 pricing - free for most things.
Worth checking out,
Tina

jmoss111 at bellsouth.net wrote:

>Thanks James, but that sounds like too much manual labor for what I have to
do. I will most likely go ahead and purchase something because I end up
extracting columnar data from pdfs a couple of times a year.
>
>The last time I had to extract from pdf, I had a 30 day demo of a very nice
tool that let you define your columnar data by drawing around the columns
and saving that as a model, kind of like Monarch. The problem was the
price.... $249.00.  If extracting columns from pdf files was something I did
on a daily basis, it wouldn't be a problem. Oh well, no bucks No Buck
Rogers.
>
>  
>


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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com




From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Thu May  5 23:43:01 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Thu, 05 May 2005 21:43:01 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
References: <200505051851.j45IpEY5122544@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
	<427A7E3C.80502@shaw.ca> <39cb22f3050505174945d3cc54@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <427AF5D5.2080109@shaw.ca>

Yup on the control panel --> administration -properties the I get lost.

Steve Erbach wrote:

>Marty,
>
>That winmsd thing, isn't that a shortcut to one of the utilities that
>you'd normally have to dig way down deep into the Windows XP menus to
>get at?
>
>Steve Erbach
>
>On 5/5/05, MartyConnelly <martyconnelly at shaw.ca> wrote:
>  
>
>>I found a reference to winsockfix in this forum site I often visit for
>>XP problems
>>http://www.windowsbbs.com
>>http://www.windowsbbs.com/showthread.php?t=44261&highlight=winsockfix
>>I usually read through posts here for caveats on windows utilities
>>before I try or download
>>and sure enuff I found one with a pointer here
>>
>>http://www.tek-tips.com/faqs.cfm?fid=4625
>>
>>Special Note For Win XP Service Pack 2 Users:
>>
>>Service Pack 2 adds a new command to repair the Winsock corruption
>>problem that can be caused by adware, spyware, or some other causes.
>>You should use this instead of the utility WinsockFix:
>>netsh winsock reset catalog
>>
>>Using this command should normally not do any harm, so if you have
>>unsolvable connection problems or spurious disconnections, try it. It
>>does remove all nonstandard LSP (Layered Service Provider) entries from
>>the Winsock catalog, which are usually adware or spyware entries, but if
>>you happened to have a legitimate one installed, it would also be
>>removed and would have to be reinstalled.
>>
>>If you're really curious, you can use the command:
>>
>>netsh winsock show catalog
>>
>>before and after resetting the catalog to find out whether any entries
>>were in fact removed and which ones these were. Another way to get at
>>the same information is to run
>>
>>winmsd
>>
>>and select Components, Network, Protocol. The Layered Service Providers
>>in the list should be of the MSAFD or RSVP ... Service Provider type.
>>All others are likely malevolent and should disappear after the reset
>>command shown above.
>>
>>WinSockFix
>>http://www.softpedia.com/public/cat/12/4/12-4-47.shtml
>>
>>WinSockFix offers a last resort if your Internet connectivity has been
>>corrupted due to invalid or removed registry entries.
>>It can often cure the problem of lost connections after the removal of
>>Adware components or improper uninstall of firewall applications or
>>other tools that modify the XP network and Winsock settings.
>>If you encounter connection problems after removing network related
>>software, Adware or after registry clean-up; and all other ways fail,
>>then give WinSock XP Fix a try.
>>It can create a registry backup of your current settings, so it is
>>fairly safe to use.
>>
>>    
>>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Fri May  6 03:37:49 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 09:37:49 +0100 
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2904@ALCUXB>

Yeah, I removed them all, and Belarc still seems to work ok, even thought it
has told me of a couple of holes that I should probably worry about...
although they're mostly to do with user permissions, rather than external
possibilities. They've got to get through a hardware firewall and a software
one to do anything on my pc anyway... *crosses fingers and hopes for the
best*


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Erbach [mailto:erbachs at gmail.com]
Sent: 06 May 2005 01:34
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?


Jon,

I think I'll try that IE 6 SP1 download you suggested.

Re ZoneAlarm, all right. I'll uninstall the old Pro version and see
about installing the newer free version. I agree with you about the
more recent version.

So your ASW program saw Belarc things and flagged them as spyware, eh?
Interesting. I don't think I've run a spyware check since I installed
Belarc. I'd better check.

Thanks, Jon.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> I haven't seen anything exactly like that per se, but I have had some
> trouble with IE (who hasn't?) before. If you go to
> www.microsoft.com/downloads you can download the administrator installer
for
> Internet Explorer 6 SP1, which you can run from a memory stick or a cd or
> something. Reinstall it from scratch, it should let you do that.
> 
> You can install the latest version of the free version of zonealarm
without
> any problems - if her subscription has run out then she has out of date
> protection, and my reasoning would be that a slightly downgraded up to
date
> firewall is better than a 2 year old one with bells and whistles on.
> 
> I'd also run a Panda online scan, and download McAfee Stinger and let that
> run, just to be on the safe side too.
> 
> Oh, and speaking of Belarc, I installed that last week, and the next time
I
> ran my spyware checkers, it was full of back office things... I don't
> remember visiting any spurious websites or installing anything else, and
I'm
> surprised that a security product would install something that's likely to
> be flagged as spyware without telling you...
> 
> Sorry, meant to post this hours ago, but someone went and broke a pc...
> users! :-)
> 
> Jon
>
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ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
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Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 07:25:35 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:25:35 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2904@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2904@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <39cb22f3050506052552977b49@mail.gmail.com>

Jon,

Reminds me that a client just told me that her daughter came home one
night to see a poker game on her home computer. She thought at first
that her kids had been playing it...but then she saw the mouse pointer
move. She gained control and was able to shut down the poker game but
then a message appeared, "F*** you b****!" She now knows what trojans
are.

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> Yeah, I removed them all, and Belarc still seems to work ok, even thought it
> has told me of a couple of holes that I should probably worry about...
> although they're mostly to do with user permissions, rather than external
> possibilities. They've got to get through a hardware firewall and a software
> one to do anything on my pc anyway... *crosses fingers and hopes for the
> best*
> 
> 
> Jon


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 07:27:49 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:27:49 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505060204.j46245Y6285730@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f30505051739448f0c79@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505060204.j46245Y6285730@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050605277a9cf667@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Yeah, the "upgrade" to a zero version is not appealing, especially
since it appears to be pirated. I've suggested to her a full re-format
and re-install of everything...perhaps with a purchased copy of
Windows, even!

I don't think I'll suggest Partition Magic. I've spent way too much
time on this already.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> You can reinstall XP over XP and if you run the correct options it should
> pick up the installed software. But I guess that's not really "completely"
> more like an upgrade of zero versions.
> 
> You should be able to use Part. Magic or a simial utility to convert FAT32
> to NTFS without affecting the OS.
> 
> 
> John B.


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 07:32:25 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:32:25 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505060155.j461t1qU149552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f3050505173427b9a949@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505060155.j461t1qU149552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050605322ef8df3e@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Right. I've seen Microsoft AntiSpyware react to Kaboodle as if it were
spyware, so, yeah, I follow you. And Belarc did NOT show up as spyware
when I did a scan.

I have to say I was impressed that Belarc showed me the Windows
updates that had NOT been installed. Very useful.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Just because it shows up as spyware doesn't mean it is! Many remote contorl
> programs will show up as spyware - radmin for example. Also in some
> companies they use I-spy type programs when having a difficult employee
> problem. I had a local client ask me about installing one for them last
> year. Didn't have to go there, just made a few adjustment to the email
> set-up for them and they had all they needed. So, don't always take
> anti-spyware for an absolute.
> 
> 
> John B.


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 07:33:20 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:33:20 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505060155.j461t1qT149552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f305050517356e3d9149@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505060155.j461t1qT149552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505060533729abbd0@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Oh, yeah. I even have a link to AVG on my security page...I just
hadn't noticed the company name.

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> AVG "Grisoft anti-virus" A German company. Good stuff.
> 
> John B.


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 07:40:57 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:40:57 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505060145.j461jtqi098966@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f305050517316e5216d9@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505060145.j461jtqi098966@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050605406053c3d2@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Well, I don't really want to get rid of IE. It's just that this
behavior was goofy enough that I'd considered uninstalling and
reinstalling until I figured out that it might be a pirated copy.

Here's a completely different question:

Do you have any feel for the level of acceptance of the Microsoft
enhancements to Cascading Style Sheets? I haven't exactly been like a
kid in a candy store, but they're fun to play with. For example, I've
modified a web page header for a client's web site using two different
MS Filters:

http://www.bxwi.com/builders_exchange_of_wisconsin.htm
http://www.bxwi.com/bxwiwithlights.htm

These two examples use RandomDissolve and Light filters. Of course
they only work with IE. Since my client's web site specifically
requires IE, I didn't worry about cross-platform stuff when I worked
up these samples for a new service (the logo was designed by Janet, by
the way).

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Isn't that part of MS's court argument that IE is integral with Windows?
> ;o)
> 
> Yes, it is normal. You have to do some serious hacking to get rid of IE. I
> believe if you do you are somewhat limited in much of your capabilities due
> to a whole slew of program relying on it being there. I kind of gave up
> following that whole line of thought during the big debate because I deal
> with too many small clients to ever think that I could actually replace IE
> in any great amount. I think I have one client using Firefox and that's
> mostly because of his college intern.


From john at winhaven.net  Fri May  6 07:41:55 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:41:55 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050605277a9cf667@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505061242.j46Cfxkb277880@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Sometimes these little pesky things are major time sinks aren't they?! 

John B.


I don't think I'll suggest Partition Magic. I've spent way too much time on
this already.

Steve Erbach



From john at winhaven.net  Fri May  6 07:41:55 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 07:41:55 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050605322ef8df3e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505061242.j46Cfxkc277880@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

I didn't know it did that. I haven't tried it or awhile noe though - thanks
for the update. 


John B.


I have to say I was impressed that Belarc showed me the Windows updates that
had NOT been installed. Very useful.

Steve Erbach



From john at winhaven.net  Fri May  6 08:00:04 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 08:00:04 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050605406053c3d2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505061300.j46D08kb214474@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

MS Frontpage 2003 fully supports CSS. I believe IE 6 does too. FP2k3 is
finally on par with other web site management apps.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 7:41 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE

John,

Well, I don't really want to get rid of IE. It's just that this behavior was
goofy enough that I'd considered uninstalling and reinstalling until I
figured out that it might be a pirated copy.

Here's a completely different question:

Do you have any feel for the level of acceptance of the Microsoft
enhancements to Cascading Style Sheets? I haven't exactly been like a kid in
a candy store, but they're fun to play with. For example, I've modified a
web page header for a client's web site using two different MS Filters:

http://www.bxwi.com/builders_exchange_of_wisconsin.htm
http://www.bxwi.com/bxwiwithlights.htm

These two examples use RandomDissolve and Light filters. Of course they only
work with IE. Since my client's web site specifically requires IE, I didn't
worry about cross-platform stuff when I worked up these samples for a new
service (the logo was designed by Janet, by the way).

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Isn't that part of MS's court argument that IE is integral with Windows?
> ;o)
> 
> Yes, it is normal. You have to do some serious hacking to get rid of 
> IE. I believe if you do you are somewhat limited in much of your 
> capabilities due to a whole slew of program relying on it being there. 
> I kind of gave up following that whole line of thought during the big 
> debate because I deal with too many small clients to ever think that I 
> could actually replace IE in any great amount. I think I have one 
> client using Firefox and that's mostly because of his college intern.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 08:00:46 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 08:00:46 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <200505061242.j46Cfxkc277880@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f305050605322ef8df3e@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505061242.j46Cfxkc277880@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050606002711318f@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Happy to be of service, Mr. President.

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> I didn't know it did that. I haven't tried it or awhile noe though - thanks
> for the update.
> 
> John B.


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 08:04:53 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 08:04:53 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505061300.j46D08kb214474@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f305050605406053c3d2@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505061300.j46D08kb214474@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Yes, yes (he said testily), I know about CSS support. I was wondering
if you had any feel for the "acceptance" of the MS extensions that
only work under IE. The Filter property in particular.

To me it looks like people use Java to get visual effects more often
than they use a combination of Filter with Java. I mean, have you
noticed the use of Filter very much outside of the Microsoft web site?

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> MS Frontpage 2003 fully supports CSS. I believe IE 6 does too. FP2k3 is
> finally on par with other web site management apps.
> 
> John B.


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Fri May  6 08:09:24 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 14:09:24 +0100 
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D290E@ALCUXB>

Woah, scary...

Just a thought, trojan hunter seems to be quite a good product as well...
I've only installed the trial version so far, but it lets you upgrade to the
latest set of definitions. I've had three particularly infected pc's that
I've rescued using this after all the "normal" things have failed... That
might help with the compromised version. Google for Mischel and Trojan
Hunter and it should bring up the right product.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Erbach [mailto:erbachs at gmail.com]
Sent: 06 May 2005 13:26
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?


Jon,

Reminds me that a client just told me that her daughter came home one
night to see a poker game on her home computer. She thought at first
that her kids had been playing it...but then she saw the mouse pointer
move. She gained control and was able to shut down the poker game but
then a message appeared, "F*** you b****!" She now knows what trojans
are.

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> Yeah, I removed them all, and Belarc still seems to work ok, even thought
it
> has told me of a couple of holes that I should probably worry about...
> although they're mostly to do with user permissions, rather than external
> possibilities. They've got to get through a hardware firewall and a
software
> one to do anything on my pc anyway... *crosses fingers and hopes for the
> best*
> 
> 
> Jon
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Fri May  6 08:13:08 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 14:13:08 +0100 
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D290F@ALCUXB>

Er, just me that couldn't see anything?


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Erbach [mailto:erbachs at gmail.com]
Sent: 06 May 2005 13:41
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE


John,

Well, I don't really want to get rid of IE. It's just that this
behavior was goofy enough that I'd considered uninstalling and
reinstalling until I figured out that it might be a pirated copy.

Here's a completely different question:

Do you have any feel for the level of acceptance of the Microsoft
enhancements to Cascading Style Sheets? I haven't exactly been like a
kid in a candy store, but they're fun to play with. For example, I've
modified a web page header for a client's web site using two different
MS Filters:

http://www.bxwi.com/builders_exchange_of_wisconsin.htm
http://www.bxwi.com/bxwiwithlights.htm

These two examples use RandomDissolve and Light filters. Of course
they only work with IE. Since my client's web site specifically
requires IE, I didn't worry about cross-platform stuff when I worked
up these samples for a new service (the logo was designed by Janet, by
the way).

Steve Erbach

On 5/5/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Isn't that part of MS's court argument that IE is integral with Windows?
> ;o)
> 
> Yes, it is normal. You have to do some serious hacking to get rid of IE. I
> believe if you do you are somewhat limited in much of your capabilities
due
> to a whole slew of program relying on it being there. I kind of gave up
> following that whole line of thought during the big debate because I deal
> with too many small clients to ever think that I could actually replace IE
> in any great amount. I think I have one client using Firefox and that's
> mostly because of his college intern.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 08:43:18 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 08:43:18 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D290F@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D290F@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050606435ccb6ee8@mail.gmail.com>

Jon,

Are you using IE? Move your mouse over the logos on the right. On the
one with the yellow "spotlight" then click and move and click and
move...

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> Er, just me that couldn't see anything?
> 
> Jon


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Fri May  6 08:47:39 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 14:47:39 +0100 
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2913@ALCUXB>

I can't see anything below the top frame... I've got the menu screen with
the logo, the two buttons labelled My Deskpad and My Projects, and the
"coming" thing which changes when I hover the mouse over it, but the bottom
3/4 of the screen is blank.

Using IE6 SP1 fully updated. Might be the work firewall though...


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Erbach [mailto:erbachs at gmail.com]
Sent: 06 May 2005 14:43
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE


Jon,

Are you using IE? Move your mouse over the logos on the right. On the
one with the yellow "spotlight" then click and move and click and
move...

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> Er, just me that couldn't see anything?
> 
> Jon
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 08:49:37 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 08:49:37 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Compromised Internet Explorer?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D290E@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D290E@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <39cb22f3050506064933fdc7d6@mail.gmail.com>

Jon,

Thanks for that link. It also led me to this:

http://www.anti-trojan-software-reviews.com/

and

http://www.diamondcs.com.au/?hop=supportale

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> Woah, scary...
> 
> Just a thought, trojan hunter seems to be quite a good product as well...
> I've only installed the trial version so far, but it lets you upgrade to the
> latest set of definitions. I've had three particularly infected pc's that
> I've rescued using this after all the "normal" things have failed... That
> might help with the compromised version. Google for Mischel and Trojan
> Hunter and it should bring up the right product.
> 
> 
> Jon


From john at winhaven.net  Fri May  6 08:54:56 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 08:54:56 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505061355.j46Dt0kb083190@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Oh, oh, oh...

Uhm, not positive but I don't think any other browser supports them. For
instance your little ditty there with the genie dude doesn't work with
firefox - it just shows the genie face not the spotlight thing.

If you go here:
http://www.smoketreerocks.com/winnmusic.htm
Click on a link and you get this cool fading transition. Doesn't work in
firefox but it doesn't look bad either. Just a clean transition.

I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by the
client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage have had about
1.5% hits from other browsers. I have firefox loaded to test how things look
but I haven't had any "real uglies" happen yet.

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 8:05 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE

John,

Yes, yes (he said testily), I know about CSS support. I was wondering if you
had any feel for the "acceptance" of the MS extensions that only work under
IE. The Filter property in particular.

To me it looks like people use Java to get visual effects more often than
they use a combination of Filter with Java. I mean, have you noticed the use
of Filter very much outside of the Microsoft web site?

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> MS Frontpage 2003 fully supports CSS. I believe IE 6 does too. FP2k3 
> is finally on par with other web site management apps.
> 
> John B.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 09:30:01 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 09:30:01 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2913@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2913@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505060730be05604@mail.gmail.com>

Jon,

No, that's all that you're supposed to see. It's my proposed change to
the header for my client's web pages, is all.

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> I can't see anything below the top frame... I've got the menu screen with
> the logo, the two buttons labelled My Deskpad and My Projects, and the
> "coming" thing which changes when I hover the mouse over it, but the bottom
> 3/4 of the screen is blank.
> 
> Using IE6 SP1 fully updated. Might be the work firewall though...
> 
> 
> Jon
>


From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 09:34:20 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 09:34:20 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505061355.j46Dt0kb083190@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505061355.j46Dt0kb083190@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f3050506073419ad6310@mail.gmail.com>

John,

Now that's what I'm talking about. Very nice. Did you make that site?

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Oh, oh, oh...
> 
> Uhm, not positive but I don't think any other browser supports them. For
> instance your little ditty there with the genie dude doesn't work with
> firefox - it just shows the genie face not the spotlight thing.
> 
> If you go here:
> http://www.smoketreerocks.com/winnmusic.htm
> Click on a link and you get this cool fading transition. Doesn't work in
> firefox but it doesn't look bad either. Just a clean transition.
> 
> I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by the
> client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage have had about
> 1.5% hits from other browsers. I have firefox loaded to test how things look
> but I haven't had any "real uglies" happen yet.
> 
> John B.


From john at winhaven.net  Fri May  6 12:07:05 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 12:07:05 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f3050506073419ad6310@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505061707.j46H75Y5179174@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

No, an associate did. 


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 9:34 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE

John,

Now that's what I'm talking about. Very nice. Did you make that site?

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Oh, oh, oh...
> 
> Uhm, not positive but I don't think any other browser supports them. 
> For instance your little ditty there with the genie dude doesn't work 
> with firefox - it just shows the genie face not the spotlight thing.
> 
> If you go here:
> http://www.smoketreerocks.com/winnmusic.htm
> Click on a link and you get this cool fading transition. Doesn't work 
> in firefox but it doesn't look bad either. Just a clean transition.
> 
> I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by the 
> client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage have had 
> about 1.5% hits from other browsers. I have firefox loaded to test how 
> things look but I haven't had any "real uglies" happen yet.
> 
> John B.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Fri May  6 19:06:59 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 10:06:59 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200505061300.j46D08kb214474@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <427C9343.17908.13583968@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 6 May 2005 at 8:04, Steve Erbach wrote:

> John,
> 
> Yes, yes (he said testily), I know about CSS support. I was wondering
> if you had any feel for the "acceptance" of the MS extensions that
> only work under IE. The Filter property in particular.
> 

Don't get me started on MS Extensions that only work under IE :-(
B*st*rds are doing it again!






-- 
Stuart




From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Fri May  6 19:22:41 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 10:22:41 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505061355.j46Dt0kb083190@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <427C96F1.30256.13669918@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 6 May 2005 at 8:54, John Bartow wrote:

> 
> I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by the
> client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage have had about
> 1.5% hits from other browsers.

You can't afford to ignore the other browsers any more.
IE's share of the browser market is declining. On current filgures,  using 
IE only features on a business site will stop about 15% of your visitors. 
See http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04/28/_ie_firefox/ 

I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience, the 
higher the proportion of non IE hits will be. 





-- 
Stuart




From erbachs at gmail.com  Fri May  6 20:04:29 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Fri, 6 May 2005 20:04:29 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <427C96F1.30256.13669918@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505061355.j46Dt0kb083190@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
	<427C96F1.30256.13669918@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505061804175f2f10@mail.gmail.com>

Stuart,

Well, the site that I've been working on is designated as an IE 5.5
site or greater, so I didn't feel any compunctions about using Filter.

As far as Microsoft's share declining, I cannot believe that it will
amount to much of a decrease. Personally, I use Firefox as my default
browser as I like the tabbed interface to keep the browser clutter to
a minimum. But how much do you want to bet that some future version of
IE will include that capability?

Steve Erbach

On 5/6/05, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> wrote:
> On 6 May 2005 at 8:54, John Bartow wrote:
> 
> >
> > I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by the
> > client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage have had about
> > 1.5% hits from other browsers.
> 
> You can't afford to ignore the other browsers any more.
> IE's share of the browser market is declining. On current filgures,  using
> IE only features on a business site will stop about 15% of your visitors.
> See http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04/28/_ie_firefox/
> 
> I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience, the
> higher the proportion of non IE hits will be.
> 
> --
> Stuart


From carbonnb at gmail.com  Sat May  7 14:02:48 2005
From: carbonnb at gmail.com (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 15:02:48 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <427C96F1.30256.13669918@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <39cb22f305050606046d43e35d@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505061355.j46Dt0kb083190@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
	<427C96F1.30256.13669918@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/6/05, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> wrote:
> On 6 May 2005 at 8:54, John Bartow wrote:

> > I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by the
> > client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage have had about
> > 1.5% hits from other browsers.
> 
> You can't afford to ignore the other browsers any more.
> IE's share of the browser market is declining. On current filgures,  using
> IE only features on a business site will stop about 15% of your visitors.
> See http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04/28/_ie_firefox/
> 
> I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience, the
> higher the proportion of non IE hits will be.

Yep. Just have a look at the stats for DBAs website
http://www.nedstatbasic.net/s?tab=1&link=5&id=2298610

IE - 52.1 %
FF - 41.7

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out,
shouting "What a great ride!"


From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Sat May  7 14:17:53 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 05:17:53 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>
References: <427C96F1.30256.13669918@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <427DA101.29158.3DD53F1@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 7 May 2005 at 15:02, Bryan Carbonnell wrote:

> > I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience, the
> > higher the proportion of non IE hits will be.
> 
> Yep. Just have a look at the stats for DBAs website
> http://www.nedstatbasic.net/s?tab=1&link=5&id=2298610
> 
> IE - 52.1 %
> FF - 41.7
> 

That's really interesting, and says a lot about the way the browser 
situation is going.





-- 
Stuart




From john at winhaven.net  Sat May  7 14:20:04 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 14:20:04 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505071920.j47JK69Z046552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

Stuart, Bryan:
OK - I stand, well sit, corrected. Interesting how quickly FF was adopted. I
like it too.

None of the web sites we manage have much in the way of hits from any thing
other the IE. But then none of them are "techie" in nature. I still check
them for functionality with FF though, I just don't worry about it if soome
glitzy effect doesn't work. I'm not much for glitzy to start with though!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Carbonnell
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 2:03 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE

On 5/6/05, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> wrote:
> On 6 May 2005 at 8:54, John Bartow wrote:

> > I wouldn't worry about other browser too much unless specified by 
> > the client. I think over the last 5 years all the sites we manage 
> > have had about 1.5% hits from other browsers.
> 
> You can't afford to ignore the other browsers any more.
> IE's share of the browser market is declining. On current filgures,  
> using IE only features on a business site will stop about 15% of your
visitors.
> See http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04/28/_ie_firefox/
> 
> I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience, the 
> higher the proportion of non IE hits will be.

Yep. Just have a look at the stats for DBAs website
http://www.nedstatbasic.net/s?tab=1&link=5&id=2298610

IE - 52.1 %
FF - 41.7

--
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved
body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "What a
great ride!"
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From erbachs at gmail.com  Sat May  7 14:55:36 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 14:55:36 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505071920.j47JK69Z046552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>
	<200505071920.j47JK69Z046552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f30505071255141ee97a@mail.gmail.com>

John,

>> I'm not much for glitzy to start with though! <<

A fuddy duddy! An old fuddy duddy!

Steve Erbach

On 5/7/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Stuart, Bryan:
> OK - I stand, well sit, corrected. Interesting how quickly FF was adopted. I
> like it too.
> 
> None of the web sites we manage have much in the way of hits from any thing
> other the IE. But then none of them are "techie" in nature. I still check
> them for functionality with FF though, I just don't worry about it if soome
> glitzy effect doesn't work. I'm not much for glitzy to start with though!
> 
> John B.
>


From carbonnb at sympatico.ca  Sat May  7 15:25:30 2005
From: carbonnb at sympatico.ca (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 16:25:30 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505071920.j47JK69Z046552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAYC1-PASMTP0414E6E6ACDF04166B30F4AE1C0@cez.ice>

On 7 May 2005 at 14:20, John Bartow wrote:

> Stuart, Bryan:
> OK - I stand, well sit, corrected. Interesting how quickly FF was
> adopted. I like it too.
> 
> None of the web sites we manage have much in the way of hits from any
> thing other the IE. But then none of them are "techie" in nature. I
> still check them for functionality with FF though, I just don't worry
> about it if soome glitzy effect doesn't work. I'm not much for glitzy
> to start with though!

At least it's a start :). There are too many web designers that think 
that IE is the only browser out there and don't bother checking with 
anything else.

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at sympatico.ca
Welcome to Hell. Here's your copy of Windows.




From carbonnb at sympatico.ca  Sat May  7 15:25:30 2005
From: carbonnb at sympatico.ca (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 16:25:30 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <427DA101.29158.3DD53F1@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BAYC1-PASMTP04918EE82A57CF10DFF784AE1C0@cez.ice>

On 8 May 2005 at 5:17, Stuart McLachlan wrote:

> On 7 May 2005 at 15:02, Bryan Carbonnell wrote:
> 
> > > I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience,
> > > the higher the proportion of non IE hits will be.
> > 
> > Yep. Just have a look at the stats for DBAs website
> > http://www.nedstatbasic.net/s?tab=1&link=5&id=2298610
> > 
> > IE - 52.1 %
> > FF - 41.7
> 
> That's really interesting, and says a lot about the way the browser
> situation is going.

At least with tech savy people.

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at sympatico.ca
Never put both feet in your mouth at the same time, because you won't 
have a leg to stand on. 




From carbonnb at sympatico.ca  Sat May  7 15:25:30 2005
From: carbonnb at sympatico.ca (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Sat, 07 May 2005 16:25:30 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f30505071255141ee97a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <200505071920.j47JK69Z046552@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <BAYC1-PASMTP0410965BA7D063F3676F48AE1C0@cez.ice>

On 7 May 2005 at 14:55, Steve Erbach wrote:

> John,
> 
> >> I'm not much for glitzy to start with though! <<
> 
> A fuddy duddy! An old fuddy duddy!

That's Mr Fuddy Duddy President to you :-)

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at sympatico.ca
Learn from the mistakes of others. You can't live long enough to make 
them all yourself.




From john at winhaven.net  Sat May  7 15:30:03 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 15:30:03 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f30505071255141ee97a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505072030.j47KU59Z108716@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

No, not really. Just lazy ;o)

I like:
Functional, sites with easy to find information

I appreciate:
tastefully designed sites with beautiful artwork that doesn't get in the
way.

A RARE COMBINATION!

I despise:
pointless flash animation sequences
Sites with "mystery navigation"

FAR TO COMMON!

:o)

John "back to the yard, where I only have birds to hear and a back to break"
B.
(I just came in to look directions to a business for my wife, who's out
doing all the mom's day shopping)

>> I'm not much for glitzy to start with though! <<

A fuddy duddy! An old fuddy duddy!

Steve Erbach

On 5/7/05, John Bartow <john at winhaven.net> wrote:
> Stuart, Bryan:
> OK - I stand, well sit, corrected. Interesting how quickly FF was 
> adopted. I like it too.
> 
> None of the web sites we manage have much in the way of hits from any 
> thing other the IE. But then none of them are "techie" in nature. I 
> still check them for functionality with FF though, I just don't worry 
> about it if soome glitzy effect doesn't work. I'm not much for glitzy to
start with though!
> 
> John B.
>
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Sat May  7 19:31:02 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 19:31:02 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <BAYC1-PASMTP0410965BA7D063F3676F48AE1C0@cez.ice>
Message-ID: <200505080031.j480V4qi124732@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>

Well, when you put it like that I guess it makes sense! Aren't all
prseidents fuddy duddies?

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Bryan Carbonnell
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 3:26 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE

On 7 May 2005 at 14:55, Steve Erbach wrote:

> John,
> 
> >> I'm not much for glitzy to start with though! <<
> 
> A fuddy duddy! An old fuddy duddy!

That's Mr Fuddy Duddy President to you :-)



From carbonnb at sympatico.ca  Sun May  8 07:16:17 2005
From: carbonnb at sympatico.ca (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 08:16:17 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <200505080031.j480V4qi124732@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>
References: <BAYC1-PASMTP0410965BA7D063F3676F48AE1C0@cez.ice>
Message-ID: <BAYC1-PASMTP03ED1492AEEC039F49E73CAE1D0@cez.ice>

On 7 May 2005 at 19:31, John Bartow wrote:

> Well, when you put it like that I guess it makes sense! Aren't all
> prseidents fuddy duddies?

That question is best answered over on OT :)

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at sympatico.ca
On the keyboard of life, always keep one finger on the escape key. 




From erbachs at gmail.com  Sun May  8 12:27:17 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 12:27:17 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Group,

Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
cannot complete the format.

Any of you seen this behavior?


Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security


From Gustav at cactus.dk  Sun May  8 13:03:41 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 20:03:41 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
Message-ID: <s27e70a6.059@cactus.dk>

Hi Steve

Occasionally yes, but not in general.

/gustav

>>> erbachs at gmail.com 05/08 7:27 pm >>>
Dear Group,

Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
cannot complete the format.

Any of you seen this behavior?


Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com 
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security 



From jon at tydda.plus.com  Sun May  8 14:03:00 2005
From: jon at tydda.plus.com (Jon Tydda)
Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 20:03:00 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <s27e70a6.059@cactus.dk>
Message-ID: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDOEEKCGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>

I've not seen that in XP before, but when I've seen it in other versions of
windows, I've just binned the floppy.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Gustav Brock
Sent: 08 May 2005 19:04
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes


Hi Steve

Occasionally yes, but not in general.

/gustav

>>> erbachs at gmail.com 05/08 7:27 pm >>>
Dear Group,

Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
cannot complete the format.

Any of you seen this behavior?


Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

--
This email has been verified as Virus free
Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net



From lembit.soobik at t-online.de  Sun May  8 15:12:57 2005
From: lembit.soobik at t-online.de (Lembit Soobik)
Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 22:12:57 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000c01c5540a$5362b0b0$0800a8c0@s856>

have not had any problems with it on XP

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Erbach" <erbachs at gmail.com>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues" 
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2005 7:27 PM
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes


> Dear Group,
>
> Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
> Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
> different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
> cannot complete the format.
>
> Any of you seen this behavior?
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Steve Erbach
> Scientific Marketing
> Neenah, WI
> www.swerbach.com
> Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.6 - Release Date: 06.05.2005
>
> 



-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.6 - Release Date: 06.05.2005



From bgeldart at verizon.net  Sun May  8 14:36:39 2005
From: bgeldart at verizon.net (Bob Geldart)
Date: Sun, 08 May 2005 15:36:39 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050508153502.037c5b78@incoming.verizon.net>

Steve,

I'm still doing it on my PC (XP Home, SP-2).

I still have so many 3? diskettes, and so seldom a great need, if one gives 
me a problem I toss it.

Bob

At 5/8/2005 01:27 PM, you wrote:
>Dear Group,
>
>Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
>Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
>different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
>cannot complete the format.
>
>Any of you seen this behavior?
>
>
>Regards,
>
>Steve Erbach
>Scientific Marketing
>Neenah, WI
>www.swerbach.com
>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


Bob Geldart             BGeldart at verizon.net
Maynard, MA


From erbachs at gmail.com  Sun May  8 17:04:18 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 17:04:18 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <6.2.1.2.0.20050508153502.037c5b78@incoming.verizon.net>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<6.2.1.2.0.20050508153502.037c5b78@incoming.verizon.net>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050815045dfbbdb6@mail.gmail.com>

Gustav, Jon, Lembit, Bob,

For what it's worth, I have a clue. I noticed the trouble with
formatting a 3 1/2" diskette on a friend's system that I'm cleaning of
spyware and such. When I couldn't format a diskette on that system I
tried my main workstation as well as two others in my home office.
When they ALL came up with the same message -- no matter which
diskette I inserted -- I thought I'd look further.

I put in my Gibson Research SpinRite 6 CD and ran SpinRite on my main
workstation. One of its options is to create a boot diskette. I made
sure that I could read the directory on drive A: (it had four files on
it)...then I ran SpinRite. I clicked the option for creating the boot
disk. After a moment this message appeared:

Unable to acquire exclusive access to Drive A:. In order to format and
create a SpinRite 6 diskette drive A:, no other program can be
simultaneously viewing the contents of this drive. Please select
another drive for Windows Explorer or any command prompt window to be
viewing, and close any open files on this drive. Then click the
"Format and Write Diskette" below to retry the diskette creation."

Is this the problem? That something on all these Windows XP machines
is looking at drive A: in some way -- even if Windows Explorer shows
the folder of another drive?

Steve Erbach

On 5/8/05, Bob Geldart <bgeldart at verizon.net> wrote:
> Steve,
> 
> I'm still doing it on my PC (XP Home, SP-2).
> 
> I still have so many 3? diskettes, and so seldom a great need, if one gives
> me a problem I toss it.
> 
> Bob


From erbachs at gmail.com  Sun May  8 17:07:37 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 17:07:37 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <000c01c5540a$5362b0b0$0800a8c0@s856>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<000c01c5540a$5362b0b0$0800a8c0@s856>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050815072ffaa02b@mail.gmail.com>

Gustav, Lembit, Jon, and Bob,

Might this be some MRU thing?

Steve Erbach

On 5/8/05, Lembit Soobik <lembit.soobik at t-online.de> wrote:
> have not had any problems with it on XP
>


From john at winhaven.net  Sun May  8 22:40:19 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Sun, 8 May 2005 22:40:19 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505090340.j493eMmd229732@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Steve,
I've had problems writing/formatting floppies but I only have older disks so
I put it down to that. Maybe there's more to it? I just scrapped a box of
old disks!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2005 12:27 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes

Dear Group,

Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under Windows
XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three different
diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows cannot complete the
format.

Any of you seen this behavior?


Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be  Mon May  9 03:41:10 2005
From: Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be (Erwin Craps - IT Helps)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 10:41:10 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
Message-ID: <46B976F2B698FF46A4FE7636509B22DF1B5B0F@stekelbes.ithelps.local>

Had this last week

Don't know if it was the diskette, dust in the drive or something else.
If you don't use the drive often there will be dust in the drive and
that could scratch the first disk in the drive.

Use another diskette and format the old fashion way.
Goto a command prompt and type format a:

That worked for me last week.

Erwin

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 5:40 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes

Steve,
I've had problems writing/formatting floppies but I only have older
disks so I put it down to that. Maybe there's more to it? I just
scrapped a box of old disks!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2005 12:27 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes

Dear Group,

Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows cannot
complete the format.

Any of you seen this behavior?


Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From Gustav at cactus.dk  Mon May  9 03:47:41 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 10:47:41 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
Message-ID: <s27f3fe7.065@cactus.dk>

Hi Steve

Just tried again ..
The first failed, the second succeeded.
When I tried the first again it now succeeded.
Antivirus stayed on (eTrust).

I just think WinXP is picky.

We have a common rule here: If someone needs something delivered on
diskette, always supply two copies. This is indeed true as we have found
no pattern in why diskettes fail; they can be brand new, preformatted,
reformatted, custom formatted, old and used once, old and used many
times, no name, brand name - you just don't know. Further, nowadays
people don't use diskettes much so you can't even be sure the user's
drive works. That's another reason for supplying two copies. It is not
likely that both copies will fail due to low quality; if they do it is
more likely to be an issue during transportation or at the receiver's
end.

/gustav

>>> erbachs at gmail.com 05/09 12:04 am >>>
Gustav, Jon, Lembit, Bob,

For what it's worth, I have a clue. I noticed the trouble with
formatting a 3 1/2" diskette on a friend's system that I'm cleaning of
spyware and such. When I couldn't format a diskette on that system I
tried my main workstation as well as two others in my home office.
When they ALL came up with the same message -- no matter which
diskette I inserted -- I thought I'd look further.

I put in my Gibson Research SpinRite 6 CD and ran SpinRite on my main
workstation. One of its options is to create a boot diskette. I made
sure that I could read the directory on drive A: (it had four files on
it)...then I ran SpinRite. I clicked the option for creating the boot
disk. After a moment this message appeared:

Unable to acquire exclusive access to Drive A:. In order to format and
create a SpinRite 6 diskette drive A:, no other program can be
simultaneously viewing the contents of this drive. Please select
another drive for Windows Explorer or any command prompt window to be
viewing, and close any open files on this drive. Then click the
"Format and Write Diskette" below to retry the diskette creation."

Is this the problem? That something on all these Windows XP machines
is looking at drive A: in some way -- even if Windows Explorer shows
the folder of another drive?

Steve Erbach

On 5/8/05, Bob Geldart <bgeldart at verizon.net> wrote:
> Steve,
> 
> I'm still doing it on my PC (XP Home, SP-2).
> 
> I still have so many 3? diskettes, and so seldom a great need, if one
gives
> me a problem I toss it.
> 
> Bob



From tinanfields at torchlake.com  Mon May  9 06:46:53 2005
From: tinanfields at torchlake.com (Tina Norris Fields)
Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 07:46:53 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>	<000c01c5540a$5362b0b0$0800a8c0@s856>
	<39cb22f305050815072ffaa02b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <427F4DAD.90002@torchlake.com>

All,
It sure sounds to me like a diskette pulled out of a drive while there 
was an open file.  We used to be able to do that is DOS with impunity, 
but Windows really gets upset about it.  Have you tried formatting the 
disk from DOS?  If that doesn't work, I would toss the disk.
Tina

Steve Erbach wrote:

>Gustav, Lembit, Jon, and Bob,
>
>Might this be some MRU thing?
>
>Steve Erbach
>
>On 5/8/05, Lembit Soobik <lembit.soobik at t-online.de> wrote:
>  
>
>>have not had any problems with it on XP
>>
>>    
>>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>----------------------------------------------------
>This message has been processed by Firetrust Benign.
>
>  
>



From erbachs at gmail.com  Mon May  9 09:59:10 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 09:59:10 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <427F4DAD.90002@torchlake.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<000c01c5540a$5362b0b0$0800a8c0@s856>
	<39cb22f305050815072ffaa02b@mail.gmail.com>
	<427F4DAD.90002@torchlake.com>
Message-ID: <39cb22f3050509075969af95a5@mail.gmail.com>

Tina, Gustav, Erwin, John,

I opened up DOS windows on three of my office machines. Three
different diskettes. I tried DIR A: on each one and got the same
message:

The floppy disk controller reported an error that is not recognized by
the floppy disk driver

I then went ahead on my main w/s with FORMAT A:. After the normal
prompt to insert a new disk in A:, I got this:


The type of the file system is RAW.
The new file system is FAT.
Verifying 1.44M
Format cannot run because the volume is in use by another process.
Format may run if this volume is dismounted first. ALL OPENED HANDLES
TO THIS VOLUME WOULD THEN BE INVALID. Would you like to force a
dismount on this volume? (Y/N)


I have NEVER seen this message before. I typed in Y and pressed Enter
and saw this:


Cannot lock the drive. The volume is still in use.


I got this series of two messages on all three of my workstations.
Sheesh! Does this provide any additional clues?

On 5/9/05, Tina Norris Fields <tinanfields at torchlake.com> wrote:
> All, It sure sounds to me like a diskette pulled out of a drive while there was an open file.  We used to be able to do that is DOS with impunity, but Windows really gets upset about it.  Have you tried formatting the disk from DOS?  If that doesn't work, I would toss the disk. 

Tina


On 5/9/05, Gustav Brock <Gustav at cactus.dk> wrote:

Hi Steve

Just tried again ..
The first failed, the second succeeded.
When I tried the first again it now succeeded.
Antivirus stayed on (eTrust).

I just think WinXP is picky.

We have a common rule here: If someone needs something delivered on
diskette, always supply two copies. This is indeed true as we have found
no pattern in why diskettes fail; they can be brand new, preformatted,
reformatted, custom formatted, old and used once, old and used many
times, no name, brand name - you just don't know. Further, nowadays
people don't use diskettes much so you can't even be sure the user's
drive works. That's another reason for supplying two copies. It is not
likely that both copies will fail due to low quality; if they do it is
more likely to be an issue during transportation or at the receiver's
end.

/gustav

On 5/9/05 Erwin Craps <Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be> wrote:

Had this last week

Don't know if it was the diskette, dust in the drive or something else.
If you don't use the drive often there will be dust in the drive and
that could scratch the first disk in the drive.

Use another diskette and format the old fashion way.
Goto a command prompt and type format a:

That worked for me last week.

Erwin


On 5/8/05 John Bartow wrote:

Steve,
I've had problems writing/formatting floppies but I only have older disks so
I put it down to that. Maybe there's more to it? I just scrapped a box of
old disks!

John B.


From Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be  Mon May  9 10:16:56 2005
From: Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be (Erwin Craps - IT Helps)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 17:16:56 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
Message-ID: <46B976F2B698FF46A4FE7636509B22DF1B5B21@stekelbes.ithelps.local>

You need to close the windows explorer or any other window where the a
drive is in.

There is something weird with windows XP and the use of the A drive...
I have the impression that XP corrupts the floppy hen formatting the
drive from windows.

Erwin
 

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 4:59 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes

Tina, Gustav, Erwin, John,

I opened up DOS windows on three of my office machines. Three different
diskettes. I tried DIR A: on each one and got the same
message:

The floppy disk controller reported an error that is not recognized by
the floppy disk driver

I then went ahead on my main w/s with FORMAT A:. After the normal prompt
to insert a new disk in A:, I got this:


The type of the file system is RAW.
The new file system is FAT.
Verifying 1.44M
Format cannot run because the volume is in use by another process.
Format may run if this volume is dismounted first. ALL OPENED HANDLES TO
THIS VOLUME WOULD THEN BE INVALID. Would you like to force a dismount on
this volume? (Y/N)


I have NEVER seen this message before. I typed in Y and pressed Enter
and saw this:


Cannot lock the drive. The volume is still in use.


I got this series of two messages on all three of my workstations.
Sheesh! Does this provide any additional clues?

On 5/9/05, Tina Norris Fields <tinanfields at torchlake.com> wrote:
> All, It sure sounds to me like a diskette pulled out of a drive while
there was an open file.  We used to be able to do that is DOS with
impunity, but Windows really gets upset about it.  Have you tried
formatting the disk from DOS?  If that doesn't work, I would toss the
disk. 

Tina


On 5/9/05, Gustav Brock <Gustav at cactus.dk> wrote:

Hi Steve

Just tried again ..
The first failed, the second succeeded.
When I tried the first again it now succeeded.
Antivirus stayed on (eTrust).

I just think WinXP is picky.

We have a common rule here: If someone needs something delivered on
diskette, always supply two copies. This is indeed true as we have found
no pattern in why diskettes fail; they can be brand new, preformatted,
reformatted, custom formatted, old and used once, old and used many
times, no name, brand name - you just don't know. Further, nowadays
people don't use diskettes much so you can't even be sure the user's
drive works. That's another reason for supplying two copies. It is not
likely that both copies will fail due to low quality; if they do it is
more likely to be an issue during transportation or at the receiver's
end.

/gustav

On 5/9/05 Erwin Craps <Erwin.Craps at ithelps.be> wrote:

Had this last week

Don't know if it was the diskette, dust in the drive or something else.
If you don't use the drive often there will be dust in the drive and
that could scratch the first disk in the drive.

Use another diskette and format the old fashion way.
Goto a command prompt and type format a:

That worked for me last week.

Erwin


On 5/8/05 John Bartow wrote:

Steve,
I've had problems writing/formatting floppies but I only have older
disks so I put it down to that. Maybe there's more to it? I just
scrapped a box of old disks!

John B.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From garykjos at gmail.com  Mon May  9 10:53:34 2005
From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 10:53:34 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aea6c49505050908537a4c0b5e@mail.gmail.com>

Just saw a response to this question on another tech list/site -  it
said to "Close your Anti-Virus program".. Sounds like it could be a
possiblity.

http://www.annoyances.org/exec/forum/winme/1081859003

GK

On 5/8/05, Steve Erbach <erbachs at gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear Group,
> 
> Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
> Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
> different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
> cannot complete the format.
> 
> Any of you seen this behavior?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Steve Erbach
> Scientific Marketing
> Neenah, WI
> www.swerbach.com
> Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 


-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com


From garykjos at gmail.com  Mon May  9 10:56:49 2005
From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 10:56:49 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <aea6c49505050908537a4c0b5e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea6c49505050908537a4c0b5e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aea6c495050509085647c24516@mail.gmail.com>

More info, same suggestion.

http://www.cs.bsu.edu/homepages/gjjones/administrivia/categories/computerHelpdesk/2003/06/12.html

Try the /x parameter.



On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> Just saw a response to this question on another tech list/site -  it
> said to "Close your Anti-Virus program".. Sounds like it could be a
> possiblity.
> 
> http://www.annoyances.org/exec/forum/winme/1081859003
> 
> GK
> 
> On 5/8/05, Steve Erbach <erbachs at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Dear Group,
> >
> > Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
> > Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
> > different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
> > cannot complete the format.
> >
> > Any of you seen this behavior?
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Steve Erbach
> > Scientific Marketing
> > Neenah, WI
> > www.swerbach.com
> > Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
> > _______________________________________________
> > dba-Tech mailing list
> > dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
> 
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> 


-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com


From erbachs at gmail.com  Mon May  9 11:34:17 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 11:34:17 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <aea6c495050509085647c24516@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea6c49505050908537a4c0b5e@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea6c495050509085647c24516@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305050909343e63027f@mail.gmail.com>

Gary,

Gad! I do believe that's it. I have a disk formatting on one of my
workstations as I type this. Thank you.

Steve Erbach

On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> More info, same suggestion.
> 
> http://www.cs.bsu.edu/homepages/gjjones/administrivia/categories/computerHelpdesk/2003/06/12.html
> 
> Try the /x parameter.
> 
> 
> On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Just saw a response to this question on another tech list/site -  it
> > said to "Close your Anti-Virus program".. Sounds like it could be a
> > possiblity.
> >
> > http://www.annoyances.org/exec/forum/winme/1081859003
> >
> > GK


From john at winhaven.net  Mon May  9 13:07:16 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 13:07:16 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050909343e63027f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505091807.j49I7I9Z033780@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

Along these lines you want to grab this nifty utility to check out for sure:
http://ccollomb.free.fr/unlocker/ 


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 11:34 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes

Gary,

Gad! I do believe that's it. I have a disk formatting on one of my
workstations as I type this. Thank you.

Steve Erbach

On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> More info, same suggestion.
> 
> http://www.cs.bsu.edu/homepages/gjjones/administrivia/categories/compu
> terHelpdesk/2003/06/12.html
> 
> Try the /x parameter.
> 
> 
> On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Just saw a response to this question on another tech list/site -  it 
> > said to "Close your Anti-Virus program".. Sounds like it could be a 
> > possiblity.
> >
> > http://www.annoyances.org/exec/forum/winme/1081859003
> >
> > GK
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From garykjos at gmail.com  Mon May  9 13:15:06 2005
From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos)
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 13:15:06 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050909343e63027f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea6c49505050908537a4c0b5e@mail.gmail.com>
	<aea6c495050509085647c24516@mail.gmail.com>
	<39cb22f305050909343e63027f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <aea6c4950505091115428f474e@mail.gmail.com>

Cool. Glad I could help.   Might have to go home and try and format a
floppy myself to try it out ;-)  I THINK I have a floppy drive on my
main system.....or is it a Zip Drive????? I think it's one of each -
but neither has been used in more than a year.

Happy formatting!

On 5/9/05, Steve Erbach <erbachs at gmail.com> wrote:
> Gary,
> 
> Gad! I do believe that's it. I have a disk formatting on one of my
> workstations as I type this. Thank you.
> 
> Steve Erbach
> 
> On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> > More info, same suggestion.
> >
> > http://www.cs.bsu.edu/homepages/gjjones/administrivia/categories/computerHelpdesk/2003/06/12.html
> >
> > Try the /x parameter.
> >
> >
> > On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Just saw a response to this question on another tech list/site -  it
> > > said to "Close your Anti-Virus program".. Sounds like it could be a
> > > possiblity.
> > >
> > > http://www.annoyances.org/exec/forum/winme/1081859003
> > >
> > > GK
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 


-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com


From tinanfields at torchlake.com  Mon May  9 13:16:25 2005
From: tinanfields at torchlake.com (Tina Norris Fields)
Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 14:16:25 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>	<aea6c49505050908537a4c0b5e@mail.gmail.com>	<aea6c495050509085647c24516@mail.gmail.com>
	<39cb22f305050909343e63027f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <427FA8F9.50306@torchlake.com>

Gary, Steve, and everybody,

That's wonderful!  I don't remember using the /x switch before, but I 
sure will remember it for the future.  The earl.ier times I have had 
similar problems were as I mentioned above - a file on the disk was left 
open and the disk removed.  A friend of mine saved all his data in Excel 
spreadsheets, and worried about using up too much hard drive space, he 
always saved to a diskette instead of to the hard drive.  One day after 
he had made new calculations and saved his file, he took the disk out of 
the drive without closing the file or the program.  Then he closed the 
program.  The next time he wanted to use his diskette he couldn't - he 
had to reconstruct his entire spreadsheet from scratch.  Next, he tried 
to format the disk and got the same sort of nasty messages we've been 
talking about.

Thanks for sharing the information about anti-virus programs holding 
onto disks they find in the drive - and the /x switch!!!

Have a great day,
Tina

Steve Erbach wrote:

>Gary,
>
>Gad! I do believe that's it. I have a disk formatting on one of my
>workstations as I type this. Thank you.
>
>Steve Erbach
>
>On 5/9/05, Gary Kjos <garykjos at gmail.com> wrote:
>  
>
>>More info, same suggestion.
>>
>>http://www.cs.bsu.edu/homepages/gjjones/administrivia/categories/computerHelpdesk/2003/06/12.html
>>
>>Try the /x parameter.
>>
>>
>>    
>>




From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Mon May  9 16:33:56 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 07:33:56 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <427FA8F9.50306@torchlake.com>
Message-ID: <428063E4.5211.50F8F06@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 9 May 2005 at 14:16, Tina Norris Fields wrote:

> Gary, Steve, and everybody,
> 
> That's wonderful!  I don't remember using the /x switch before, but I 
> sure will remember it for the future. 

Had to smile at the "Its not graphical and if you can't remember the syntax 
required to make it work,  it is not helpful"  followed by *extremely* 
detailed instructions on how to write a one line batch file  and create a 
shortcut.  :-)    





-- 
Stuart




From artful at rogers.com  Mon May  9 16:42:11 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 17:42:11 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] MS CSS enhancements -- was Compromised IE
In-Reply-To: <BAYC1-PASMTP04918EE82A57CF10DFF784AE1C0@cez.ice>
References: <e04a6c9205050712025ed63476@mail.gmail.com>
	<BAYC1-PASMTP04918EE82A57CF10DFF784AE1C0@cez.ice>
Message-ID: <427FD933.3090202@rogers.com>

I think the penetration level extends beyond the tech-savvy. At least in 
my own case. I introduced the pres and vp of a client company to FF and 
showed them the features I love most. Two days later the mandate went 
down from on high to all the employees. Cease and desist IE, move to FF.

Bryan Carbonnell wrote:

>On 8 May 2005 at 5:17, Stuart McLachlan wrote:
>
>  
>
>>On 7 May 2005 at 15:02, Bryan Carbonnell wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>>I'd also suspect that the more "tech savvy" your target audience,
>>>>the higher the proportion of non IE hits will be.
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>Yep. Just have a look at the stats for DBAs website
>>>http://www.nedstatbasic.net/s?tab=1&link=5&id=2298610
>>>
>>>IE - 52.1 %
>>>FF - 41.7
>>>      
>>>
>>That's really interesting, and says a lot about the way the browser
>>situation is going.
>>    
>>
>
>At least with tech savy people.
>
>  
>
-------------- next part --------------
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.6 - Release Date: 5/6/2005

From artful at rogers.com  Mon May  9 16:44:31 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Mon, 09 May 2005 17:44:31 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>

What's a floppy disk? LOL.

Yes, far too often I have seen this same behaviour. However, given the 
cost of CDs, I have abandoned diskettes forever, except when I have to 
boot a system to DOS.

Steve Erbach wrote:

>Dear Group,
>
>Have any of you tried to format a 3 1/2" floppy disk lately under
>Windows XP? I tried just now on four separate machines with three
>different diskettes. Every machine presented the message: Windows
>cannot complete the format.
>
>Any of you seen this behavior?
>
>
>Regards,
>
>Steve Erbach
>Scientific Marketing
>Neenah, WI
>www.swerbach.com
>Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>  
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.6 - Release Date: 5/6/2005



From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Mon May  9 16:46:27 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 07:46:27 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <428066D3.31900.51B0411@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 9 May 2005 at 17:44, Arthur Fuller wrote:

> What's a floppy disk? LOL.
> 
> Yes, far too often I have seen this same behaviour. However, given the 
> cost of CDs, I have abandoned diskettes forever, except when I have to 
> boot a system to DOS.
> 

What's DOS? LOL

-- 
Stuart




From erbachs at gmail.com  Tue May 10 16:53:58 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 16:53:58 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Formatting diskettes
In-Reply-To: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305051014532d366059@mail.gmail.com>

Arthur,

For what it's worth, I use SpinRite 6. Gibson has included FreeDOS
with the program so that a CD can boot to DOS.

Steve Erbach

On 5/9/05, Arthur Fuller <artful at rogers.com> wrote:
> What's a floppy disk? LOL.
> 
> Yes, far too often I have seen this same behaviour. However, given the
> cost of CDs, I have abandoned diskettes forever, except when I have to
> boot a system to DOS.
>


From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Thu May 12 19:21:56 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 10:21:56 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] Office 12
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305051014532d366059@mail.gmail.com>
References: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
Message-ID: <42847FC4.9815.151C5249@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

The next Office. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/05/12/_office_2006/

Interesting quote:

No matter what Microsoft throws into Office 12, the company faces an up-
hill task persuading users happy with older versions of Office to upgrade. 
Office 97 accounts for 30 per cent of the customer base according to 
analysts. Customers are happy that Office 97 provides them with the level 
of functionality need to simply get their job done, without the need for 
advanced collaboration capabilities so beloved by Gates and found in later 
versions of Office





-- 
Stuart




From fhtapia at gmail.com  Fri May 13 10:23:05 2005
From: fhtapia at gmail.com (Francisco Tapia)
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 08:23:05 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Office 12
In-Reply-To: <42847FC4.9815.151C5249@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
	<39cb22f305051014532d366059@mail.gmail.com>
	<42847FC4.9815.151C5249@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <b874372a05051308234cd61ff7@mail.gmail.com>

30% woooow.

On 5/12/05, Stuart McLachlan <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> wrote:
> 
> The next Office. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/05/12/_office_2006/
> 
> Interesting quote:
> 
> No matter what Microsoft throws into Office 12, the company faces an up-
> hill task persuading users happy with older versions of Office to upgrade.
> Office 97 accounts for 30 per cent of the customer base according to
> analysts. Customers are happy that Office 97 provides them with the level
> of functionality need to simply get their job done, without the need for
> advanced collaboration capabilities so beloved by Gates and found in later
> versions of Office
> 
> --
> Stuart
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



-- 
-Francisco
http://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!
http://sqlthis.blogspot.com | Tsql and More...


From artful at rogers.com  Fri May 13 17:09:05 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 18:09:05 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Thunderbird Question
In-Reply-To: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>
	<427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
Message-ID: <42852581.4010109@rogers.com>

Where does Thunderbird save its files? I just got a new box and want to 
move Thunderbird's data files to the new box.

>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.9 - Release Date: 5/12/2005



From peter.brawley at earthlink.net  Fri May 13 17:15:24 2005
From: peter.brawley at earthlink.net (Peter Brawley)
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 17:15:24 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Thunderbird Question
In-Reply-To: <42852581.4010109@rogers.com>
References: <39cb22f305050810276ebf9109@mail.gmail.com>	<427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
	<42852581.4010109@rogers.com>
Message-ID: <428526FC.8060707@earthlink.net>

Documents and Settings\<username>\Application Data\Thunderbird\Profiles\Mail


Arthur Fuller wrote:

> Where does Thunderbird save its files? I just got a new box and want 
> to move Thunderbird's data files to the new box.
>
>>
>
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.9 - Release Date: 5/12/2005



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Tue May 17 11:23:43 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 17:23:43 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29C9@ALCUXB>

I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?
 
I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other... 
 
Any thoughts anyone? :-P
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From bheid at appdevgrp.com  Tue May 17 11:51:19 2005
From: bheid at appdevgrp.com (Bobby Heid)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 12:51:19 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
In-Reply-To: <916187228923D311A6FE00A0CC3FAA30BB36F3@ADGSERVER>
Message-ID: <916187228923D311A6FE00A0CC3FAA30ABEB4C@ADGSERVER>

No ideas about the cables.

But what is a skip?  The trash?

Obviously from the other side of the pond,
Bobby

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 12:24 PM
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables


I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?
 
I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other... 
 
Any thoughts anyone? :-P
 
 
Jon



From Gustav at cactus.dk  Tue May 17 12:12:37 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 19:12:37 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
Message-ID: <s28a4237.086@cactus.dk>

Hi Jon

We only receive the EU cables.

Surplus equipment we pass on to friends of the house or charity or to a
local broker.
Here defective equipment must be returned to an authorised recycling
station which we do.

/gustav

>>> Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/17 6:23 pm >>>
I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're
all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing
them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of
the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question
struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power
cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?
 
I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards,
and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to
not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other... 



From lembit.soobik at t-online.de  Tue May 17 12:20:37 2005
From: lembit.soobik at t-online.de (Lembit Soobik)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 19:20:37 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29C9@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <002301c55b04$be4a3be0$0800a8c0@s856>

I have never received any UK cables, just EU

Lembit

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jon Tydda" <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk>
To: "Dba-Tech (E-mail)" <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 6:23 PM
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables


> I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
> full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing 
> them
> in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
> whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck 
> me
> - when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power 
> cables
> as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?
>
> I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, 
> and
> if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
> chuck them away, but to send them to each other...
>
> Any thoughts anyone? :-P
>
>
> Jon
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.11 - Release Date: 16.05.2005
>
> 



-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.11 - Release Date: 16.05.2005



From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Tue May 17 13:02:52 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 11:02:52 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29C9@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <428A31CC.3060804@shaw.ca>

Flog them on eBay.

Jon Tydda wrote:

>I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
>full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing them
>in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
>whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck me
>- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power cables
>as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?
> 
>I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, and
>if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
>chuck them away, but to send them to each other... 
> 
>Any thoughts anyone? :-P
> 
> 
>Jon
>
>
>The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
>privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
>to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
>ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
>Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
>Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From jon at tydda.plus.com  Tue May 17 14:39:15 2005
From: jon at tydda.plus.com (Jon Tydda)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 20:39:15 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
In-Reply-To: <916187228923D311A6FE00A0CC3FAA30ABEB4C@ADGSERVER>
Message-ID: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDMEGLCGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>

Yeah, industrial sized bin that lorries come to pick up.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Bobby Heid
Sent: 17 May 2005 17:51
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Power cables


No ideas about the cables.

But what is a skip?  The trash?

Obviously from the other side of the pond,
Bobby

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 12:24 PM
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables


I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?

I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other...

Any thoughts anyone? :-P


Jon

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From jon at tydda.plus.com  Tue May 17 14:42:02 2005
From: jon at tydda.plus.com (Jon Tydda)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 20:42:02 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
In-Reply-To: <s28a4237.086@cactus.dk>
Message-ID: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDAEGMCGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>

Interesting... I just thought it was a complete waste because we get the EU
ones with virtually every piece of electronic equipment. Maybe I will start
saving them and ebay them... Thanks guys :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Gustav Brock
Sent: 17 May 2005 18:13
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Power cables


Hi Jon

We only receive the EU cables.

Surplus equipment we pass on to friends of the house or charity or to a
local broker.
Here defective equipment must be returned to an authorised recycling
station which we do.

/gustav

>>> Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/17 6:23 pm >>>
I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're
all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing
them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of
the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question
struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power
cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?

I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards,
and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to
not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other...

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

--
This email has been verified as Virus free
Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Tue May 17 22:22:10 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 20:22:10 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29C9@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <047d01c55b58$c76e9550$6501a8c0@HAL9004>

It's a cost thing in manufacturing. It's cheaper to put in both cables than 
to separate the finished goods inventory into two lots, and then someone 
ships a box with the wrong cable to a customer, or you run short of one and 
not the other, all sorts of additional expenses.  Cables probably cost them 
a buck.

Rocky

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jon Tydda" <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk>
To: "Dba-Tech (E-mail)" <dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 9:23 AM
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables


> I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
> full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing 
> them
> in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
> whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck 
> me
> - when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power 
> cables
> as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?
>
> I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, 
> and
> if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
> chuck them away, but to send them to each other...
>
> Any thoughts anyone? :-P
>
>
> Jon
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Wed May 18 00:56:36 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 22:56:36 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Kids - Ya Gotta love 'em
References: <427FD9BF.70207@rogers.com>
	<42847FC4.9815.151C5249@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <04f401c55b6e$5a2324f0$6501a8c0@HAL9004>

So Max comandeered my new laptop for his desk at the start of his freshman 
year in September and has kept it pretty clean because he knows I still take 
it with me when see a client.  (He's got another box for AIM and music 
downloads and net games, etc.)

But he managed to do something I've never seen before - the printer 
properties dialog comes up in Arabic.  I couldn't fix it with Lanugage 
settings and regional options (it's WIN XP Home BTW).

Anyone know how to get him back to English?

MTIA,

Rocky Smolin
Beach Access Software
http://www.e-z-mrp.com
858-259-4334



From pharold at proftesting.com  Wed May 18 08:34:23 2005
From: pharold at proftesting.com (Perry Harold)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 09:34:23 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
In-Reply-To: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDAEGMCGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>
Message-ID: <001401c55bae$4e0f9b90$192da8c0@D58BT131Perry>

Maybe a plot to attempt to force the UK into line with the rest of the EU.

Perry Harold

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 3:42 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Power cables


Interesting... I just thought it was a complete waste because we get the EU
ones with virtually every piece of electronic equipment. Maybe I will start
saving them and ebay them... Thanks guys :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Gustav Brock
Sent: 17 May 2005 18:13
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Power cables


Hi Jon

We only receive the EU cables.

Surplus equipment we pass on to friends of the house or charity or to a
local broker. Here defective equipment must be returned to an authorised
recycling station which we do.

/gustav

>>> Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/17 6:23 pm >>>
I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?

I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other...

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

--
This email has been verified as Virus free
Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com





From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 18 08:38:01 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 14:38:01 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Power cables
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29D3@ALCUXB>

They'll never take me alive! :)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Perry Harold [mailto:pharold at proftesting.com]
Sent: 18 May 2005 14:34
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Power cables


Maybe a plot to attempt to force the UK into line with the rest of the EU.

Perry Harold

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 3:42 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Power cables


Interesting... I just thought it was a complete waste because we get the EU
ones with virtually every piece of electronic equipment. Maybe I will start
saving them and ebay them... Thanks guys :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Gustav Brock
Sent: 17 May 2005 18:13
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Power cables


Hi Jon

We only receive the EU cables.

Surplus equipment we pass on to friends of the house or charity or to a
local broker. Here defective equipment must be returned to an authorised
recycling station which we do.

/gustav

>>> Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk 05/17 6:23 pm >>>
I've just opened a fairly large consignment of printers, and they're all
full of European power cables as well as the UK type. As I was throwing them
in the skip, it struck me that this was a huge waste, both in terms of the
whole manufacturing process and the environment... then a question struck me
- when you buy electronic goods in Europe do they come with UK power cables
as well as the EU ones or is it just unique to the UK?

I must have 50 or 60 of the things here in various boxes and cupboards, and
if anyone in the EU has a load of UK cables then it seems obvious to not
chuck them away, but to send them to each other...

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

--
This email has been verified as Virus free
Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From erbachs at gmail.com  Wed May 18 11:07:28 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 11:07:28 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
Message-ID: <39cb22f305051809071e120881@mail.gmail.com>

Dear Group,

In all the years I've been using Windows I've never found the answer
to this question: When viewing a folder with Windows Explorer I want
to search just that folder and its sub-folders for a file. So I press
Ctrl-F and get the "Search Companion" where the tree-list of folders
was. I then click on "All Files and Folders" and the Search form
appears. I enter my criteria and click Search. My file is found and
shows up in the right-hand pane of Windows Explorer. Now  that I know
where the file is, I'd like to go back to regular old Windows Explorer
mode.

How do I do that? What option or icon do I select to "put away" the
search panes and return the Windows Explorer panes? I've never figured
this out. I've always closed the Explorer and opened it again to
"reset" it.

-- 
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security


From jwcolby at colbyconsulting.com  Wed May 18 11:12:03 2005
From: jwcolby at colbyconsulting.com (John W. Colby)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 12:12:03 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305051809071e120881@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>

You need the standards button toolbar showing.  Doing that will display a
tool button for search and another for folders.

John W. Colby
www.ColbyConsulting.com 

Contribute your unused CPU cycles to a good cause:
http://folding.stanford.edu/

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 12:07 PM
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull


Dear Group,

In all the years I've been using Windows I've never found the answer to this
question: When viewing a folder with Windows Explorer I want to search just
that folder and its sub-folders for a file. So I press Ctrl-F and get the
"Search Companion" where the tree-list of folders was. I then click on "All
Files and Folders" and the Search form appears. I enter my criteria and
click Search. My file is found and shows up in the right-hand pane of
Windows Explorer. Now  that I know where the file is, I'd like to go back to
regular old Windows Explorer mode.

How do I do that? What option or icon do I select to "put away" the search
panes and return the Windows Explorer panes? I've never figured this out.
I've always closed the Explorer and opened it again to "reset" it.

-- 
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com





From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 18 11:12:04 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 17:12:04 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29D7@ALCUXB>

On the toolbar above the window, where you have the backwards and forwards
arrows, there should be one marked "search", next to one marked "folders".
Click the folders one and all should be well with the world... same goes for
when you're exploring - either right click to search a specific folder, or
press the search button on the toolbar.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Erbach [mailto:erbachs at gmail.com]
Sent: 18 May 2005 17:07
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull


Dear Group,

In all the years I've been using Windows I've never found the answer
to this question: When viewing a folder with Windows Explorer I want
to search just that folder and its sub-folders for a file. So I press
Ctrl-F and get the "Search Companion" where the tree-list of folders
was. I then click on "All Files and Folders" and the Search form
appears. I enter my criteria and click Search. My file is found and
shows up in the right-hand pane of Windows Explorer. Now  that I know
where the file is, I'd like to go back to regular old Windows Explorer
mode.

How do I do that? What option or icon do I select to "put away" the
search panes and return the Windows Explorer panes? I've never figured
this out. I've always closed the Explorer and opened it again to
"reset" it.

-- 
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From carbonnb at gmail.com  Wed May 18 11:13:49 2005
From: carbonnb at gmail.com (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 12:13:49 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305051809071e120881@mail.gmail.com>
References: <39cb22f305051809071e120881@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <e04a6c9205051809131d6f75d1@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/18/05, Steve Erbach <erbachs at gmail.com> wrote:

> In all the years I've been using Windows I've never found the answer
> to this question: When viewing a folder with Windows Explorer I want
> to search just that folder and its sub-folders for a file. So I press
> Ctrl-F and get the "Search Companion" where the tree-list of folders
> was. I then click on "All Files and Folders" and the Search form
> appears. I enter my criteria and click Search. My file is found and
> shows up in the right-hand pane of Windows Explorer. Now  that I know
> where the file is, I'd like to go back to regular old Windows Explorer
> mode.
> 
> How do I do that? What option or icon do I select to "put away" the
> search panes and return the Windows Explorer panes? I've never figured
> this out. I've always closed the Explorer and opened it again to
> "reset" it.

On the toolbar, right beside the search icon is an icon that looks
like two folders that overlap one another. Click on that and it will
return the right pane to the folders view.

Or you can use the menus: View|Explorer Bar|Folders

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out,
shouting "What a great ride!"


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 18 11:13:41 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 17:13:41 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Kids - Ya Gotta love 'em
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D29D8@ALCUXB>

That's a new one on me Rocky... I'm surprised that the language settings
didn't work - did you try all the options in there? The default language,
the keyboard input language, everything?

If not, now seems like an appropriate time to learn Arabic, or at least make
Max learn it so he can figure out how to revert it :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software [mailto:bchacc at san.rr.com]
Sent: 18 May 2005 06:57
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Kids - Ya Gotta love 'em


So Max comandeered my new laptop for his desk at the start of his freshman 
year in September and has kept it pretty clean because he knows I still take

it with me when see a client.  (He's got another box for AIM and music 
downloads and net games, etc.)

But he managed to do something I've never seen before - the printer 
properties dialog comes up in Arabic.  I couldn't fix it with Lanugage 
settings and regional options (it's WIN XP Home BTW).

Anyone know how to get him back to English?

MTIA,

Rocky Smolin
Beach Access Software
http://www.e-z-mrp.com
858-259-4334

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 18 11:19:58 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 11:19:58 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305051809071e120881@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505181620.j4IGK0fh270864@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Steve,
With XP you click the "folders" icon. IIRC with older versions of Windows
you have to use the menu item View | Explorer Bar | Folder.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Steve Erbach
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 11:07 AM
To: dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull

Dear Group,

In all the years I've been using Windows I've never found the answer to this
question: When viewing a folder with Windows Explorer I want to search just
that folder and its sub-folders for a file. So I press Ctrl-F and get the
"Search Companion" where the tree-list of folders was. I then click on "All
Files and Folders" and the Search form appears. I enter my criteria and
click Search. My file is found and shows up in the right-hand pane of
Windows Explorer. Now  that I know where the file is, I'd like to go back to
regular old Windows Explorer mode.

How do I do that? What option or icon do I select to "put away" the search
panes and return the Windows Explorer panes? I've never figured this out.
I've always closed the Explorer and opened it again to "reset" it.

--
Regards,

Steve Erbach
Scientific Marketing
Neenah, WI
www.swerbach.com
Security Page: www.swerbach.com/security
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 18 12:14:13 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 12:14:13 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Kids - Ya Gotta love 'em
In-Reply-To: <04f401c55b6e$5a2324f0$6501a8c0@HAL9004>
Message-ID: <200505181714.j4IHEFRb090372@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

Rocky,
I had this issue once but with Spanish being the language. I had to
uninstall the print driver and reinstall using the english. Not sure if this
will be the answer but its wouldn't take long to try.

HTH

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin -
Beach Access Software
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 12:57 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Kids - Ya Gotta love 'em

So Max comandeered my new laptop for his desk at the start of his freshman
year in September and has kept it pretty clean because he knows I still take
it with me when see a client.  (He's got another box for AIM and music
downloads and net games, etc.)

But he managed to do something I've never seen before - the printer
properties dialog comes up in Arabic.  I couldn't fix it with Lanugage
settings and regional options (it's WIN XP Home BTW).

Anyone know how to get him back to English?

MTIA,

Rocky Smolin
Beach Access Software
http://www.e-z-mrp.com
858-259-4334

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From erbachs at gmail.com  Wed May 18 19:48:42 2005
From: erbachs at gmail.com (Steve Erbach)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 19:48:42 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
In-Reply-To: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
References: <39cb22f305051809071e120881@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
Message-ID: <39cb22f305051817484ee1dc44@mail.gmail.com>

John, Jon, Bryan, and John,

Gad! RIght after I posted that message, wouldn't you know it, I saw
that very icon you guys are talking about. I thought that I might as
well leave the message intact and taste a bit of humility for a
change. Thanks, guys for the help.

Steve Erbach

On 5/18/05, John W. Colby <jwcolby at colbyconsulting.com> wrote:
> You need the standards button toolbar showing.  Doing that will display a
> tool button for search and another for folders.
> 
> John W. Colby
> www.ColbyConsulting.com


From carbonnb at sympatico.ca  Wed May 18 20:17:08 2005
From: carbonnb at sympatico.ca (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 21:17:08 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Windows Explorer numbskull
In-Reply-To: <39cb22f305051817484ee1dc44@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
Message-ID: <BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>

On 18 May 2005 at 19:48, Steve Erbach wrote:

> John, Jon, Bryan, and John,
> 
> Gad! RIght after I posted that message, wouldn't you know it, I saw
> that very icon you guys are talking about. I thought that I might as
> well leave the message intact and taste a bit of humility for a
> change. Thanks, guys for the help.

As someone said in a recent post, that was probably in the OHNOSECOND 
of posting :)

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at sympatico.ca
We're all here because we're not all there.




From artful at rogers.com  Thu May 19 16:45:56 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 17:45:56 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Word Tables and Bookmarks Question
In-Reply-To: <BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>
References: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
	<BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>
Message-ID: <428D0914.3080700@rogers.com>

I haven't tried to do this before, but before I begin I thought I'd run 
the question past this most esteemed group.

Assume a Word template (.dot) containing a table. This table contains 
bookmarks which are filled from an Access app using code that finds the 
bookmarks and stuffs text into them.

This works fine for individual bookmarks, but what if the table has 
multiple rows. How do I distinguish them? Often the query in Access will 
return only one row, but sometimes it might return say 10 rows. Then 
what do I do? Am I going about this in completely the wrong way, using 
bookmarks? Should I be thinking of a completely other approach, such as, 
I don't know, maybe embedding an Excel sheet in place of the table and 
drawing the data from SQL into the sheet first?

Perhaps I should mention that the whole reason for doing this is that 
the document must be saved to a unique name and be editable. So I start 
with a Word template, programmatically create the document, then offer 
the user the option to edit the document or save it for editing later 
on. The client ideally would like to do the data entry, have the app 
create the document at once, make the usual edits, save and print it, 
and give it to the client on the spot.

TIA for your suggestions,
Arthur

>  
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 - Release Date: 5/17/2005



From carbonnb at sympatico.ca  Thu May 19 20:35:22 2005
From: carbonnb at sympatico.ca (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 21:35:22 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Word Tables and Bookmarks Question
In-Reply-To: <428D0914.3080700@rogers.com>
References: <BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>
Message-ID: <BAYC1-PASMTP01606F448B54E02A51BC27AE090@cez.ice>

On 19 May 2005 at 17:45, Arthur Fuller wrote:

> Assume a Word template (.dot) containing a table. This table contains
> bookmarks which are filled from an Access app using code that finds
> the bookmarks and stuffs text into them.
> 
> This works fine for individual bookmarks, but what if the table has
> multiple rows. How do I distinguish them? Often the query in Access
> will return only one row, but sometimes it might return say 10 rows.
> Then what do I do? Am I going about this in completely the wrong way,
> using bookmarks? Should I be thinking of a completely other approach,
> such as, I don't know, maybe embedding an Excel sheet in place of the
> table and drawing the data from SQL into the sheet first?

Why a table? Is it tabular data?

Why not try using tabstops for alignment, or do you need the borders.

If you look at the sample db and word doc that are part of the 
article I wrote for M2M, you can see how I wrote multi-line tabular 
data with tabstops from Access out to Word. The article and demo file 
can be found at 
http://www.databaseadvisors.com/newsletters/newsletter072002/0207worda
utomationpt2.htm

Basically in the template you set the tabstops (right, left, 
centre...) to where you want them, insert a bookmark and then insert 
the data, complete with tabs at the bookmark on record at a time. 
When you hit the next record, send a CrLf to the doc, and then insert 
the next record.

The demo shows it much better that I have explained it.

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at sympatico.ca
Why is it that inside every older person is a younger person 
wondering what the heck happened? 




From shamil at users.mns.ru  Fri May 20 00:37:00 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 09:37:00 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Word Tables and Bookmarks Question
References: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805><BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>
	<428D0914.3080700@rogers.com>
Message-ID: <006301c55cfd$ff820700$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

Arthur,

You can try 4TOPS WordLink Add-in http://www.4tops.com/wordlink.htm 
(shareware - 30 days free trial). It does what you need and much more
http://www.4tops.com/word_mail_merge_examples.htm

You can find it uses MS Word quote fields as place holders and bookmarks.
For tables you just have one row definition and insert as many rows as you
need on runtime but without quote fields/bokmarks - the first row keeping
definition fields and bookmarks is good enough to calculate the cell for
subsequent rows' fields.

Nothing complicated but programming of all that is rather time consuming...

Shamil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Arthur Fuller" <artful at rogers.com>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues"
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 1:45 AM
Subject: [dba-Tech] Word Tables and Bookmarks Question


> I haven't tried to do this before, but before I begin I thought I'd run
> the question past this most esteemed group.
>
> Assume a Word template (.dot) containing a table. This table contains
> bookmarks which are filled from an Access app using code that finds the
> bookmarks and stuffs text into them.
>
> This works fine for individual bookmarks, but what if the table has
> multiple rows. How do I distinguish them? Often the query in Access will
> return only one row, but sometimes it might return say 10 rows. Then
> what do I do? Am I going about this in completely the wrong way, using
> bookmarks? Should I be thinking of a completely other approach, such as,
> I don't know, maybe embedding an Excel sheet in place of the table and
> drawing the data from SQL into the sheet first?
>
> Perhaps I should mention that the whole reason for doing this is that
> the document must be saved to a unique name and be editable. So I start
> with a Word template, programmatically create the document, then offer
> the user the option to edit the document or save it for editing later
> on. The client ideally would like to do the data entry, have the app
> create the document at once, make the usual edits, save and print it,
> and give it to the client on the spot.
>
> TIA for your suggestions,
> Arthur
>
> >
> >
>
>
> -- 
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 - Release Date: 5/17/2005
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Fri May 20 09:56:06 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 07:56:06 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint:  Linking versus Embedding sound files
References: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
	<BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>
	<428D0914.3080700@rogers.com>
	<006301c55cfd$ff820700$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <00e401c55d4c$0d0b01d0$6801a8c0@HAL9004>

Dear List:

I want to embed two mp3 files in my powerpoint presentation.  On 
Tools-->Options-->General Tab I raised the Link sounds with file size 
greater than: to 5000 kb which is larger than either of the two mp3 files 
I'm inserting.  But it still links instead of embedding.

What am I doing wrong?

TIA

Rocky Smolin
Beach Access Software
http://www.e-z-mrp.com
858-259-4334



From fhtapia at gmail.com  Fri May 20 10:58:19 2005
From: fhtapia at gmail.com (Francisco Tapia)
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 08:58:19 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] XBOX gaming can be done on a Mac?
Message-ID: <b874372a0505200858354f5b1e@mail.gmail.com>

http://anandtech.com/tradeshows/showdoc.aspx?i=2420&p=5

That's what they're saying over at anandtech

-- 
-Francisco
http://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!
http://sqlthis.blogspot.com | Tsql and More...


From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Fri May 20 17:57:02 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Sat, 21 May 2005 08:57:02 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint:  Linking versus Embedding sound files
In-Reply-To: <00e401c55d4c$0d0b01d0$6801a8c0@HAL9004>
Message-ID: <428EF7DE.15762.28CFE04@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 20 May 2005 at 7:56, Rocky Smolin - Beach Access S wrote:

> Dear List:
> 
> I want to embed two mp3 files in my powerpoint presentation.  On 
> Tools-->Options-->General Tab I raised the Link sounds with file size 
> greater than: to 5000 kb which is larger than either of the two mp3 files 
> I'm inserting.  But it still links instead of embedding.
> 
> What am I doing wrong?
> 
Just a WAG, but does Powerpoint convert the MP3 to raw WAV before 
embedding? If so the resulting file to embed is possibly more than your 
limit.-- 
Stuart




From artful at rogers.com  Fri May 20 18:03:08 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 19:03:08 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Word Tables and Bookmarks Question
In-Reply-To: <006301c55cfd$ff820700$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
References: <000001c55bc4$58655240$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805><BAYC1-PASMTP04BADED231D56F1E9DCE34AE080@cez.ice>	<428D0914.3080700@rogers.com>
	<006301c55cfd$ff820700$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <428E6CAC.1080901@rogers.com>

Thanks Shamil. I just downloaded this and will check into it.

A.

Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:

>Arthur,
>
>You can try 4TOPS WordLink Add-in http://www.4tops.com/wordlink.htm 
>(shareware - 30 days free trial). It does what you need and much more
>http://www.4tops.com/word_mail_merge_examples.htm
>
>You can find it uses MS Word quote fields as place holders and bookmarks.
>For tables you just have one row definition and insert as many rows as you
>need on runtime but without quote fields/bokmarks - the first row keeping
>definition fields and bookmarks is good enough to calculate the cell for
>subsequent rows' fields.
>
>Nothing complicated but programming of all that is rather time consuming...
>
>Shamil
>
>  
>
>  
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.13 - Release Date: 5/19/2005



From listmaster at databaseadvisors.com  Fri May 20 16:31:15 2005
From: listmaster at databaseadvisors.com (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:31:15 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Administrivia - Emergency Server Repair
Message-ID: <428E1EE3.9260.B9793E@localhost>

I just got a notice from the host that hosts our mail server that 
they have had a HD failure.

They will be taking our server down from 0900 - 1200 CST (14:00 - 
17:00:00 UTC) tomorrow, Sat May 21, to replace the HD and upgrade the 
RAID software.

Sorry for any inconveniance this may cause anyone.

Bryan



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Fri May 20 19:33:40 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:33:40 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint:  Linking versus Embedding sound files
References: <428EF7DE.15762.28CFE04@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <02d901c55d9c$bc3db850$6801a8c0@HAL9004>

Don't know if it converts.  I gotten the advice to convert it before 
inserting.  Now all I have to do is convert it.  Somehow.  There's gotta be 
some software on my box that'll do that.

Rocky

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Stuart McLachlan" <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues" 
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:57 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint: Linking versus Embedding sound files


> On 20 May 2005 at 7:56, Rocky Smolin - Beach Access S wrote:
>
>> Dear List:
>>
>> I want to embed two mp3 files in my powerpoint presentation.  On
>> Tools-->Options-->General Tab I raised the Link sounds with file size
>> greater than: to 5000 kb which is larger than either of the two mp3 files
>> I'm inserting.  But it still links instead of embedding.
>>
>> What am I doing wrong?
>>
> Just a WAG, but does Powerpoint convert the MP3 to raw WAV before
> embedding? If so the resulting file to embed is possibly more than your
> limit.-- 
> Stuart
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Fri May 20 19:56:39 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Sat, 21 May 2005 10:56:39 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint:  Linking versus Embedding sound files
In-Reply-To: <02d901c55d9c$bc3db850$6801a8c0@HAL9004>
Message-ID: <428F13E7.26276.2FA813B@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 20 May 2005 at 17:33, Rocky Smolin - Beach Access S wrote:

> Don't know if it converts.  I gotten the advice to convert it before 
> inserting.  Now all I have to do is convert it.  Somehow.  There's gotta be 
> some software on my box that'll do that.
> 

If you don't have anything grab a copy of the freeware SIMPLE (SImple Mp3 
PLayer and Encoder/decoder)  from 
http://www.geocities.com/simplelance/release/simple45v.zip

It's what I use to rip music CDs to mp3. It also does mp3<>wav convertions.

(Note, the site is frequently over it's allocated "data transfer limit". 
You may need to try it a few times.)

-- 
Stuart




From john at winhaven.net  Mon May 23 12:38:04 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 12:38:04 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint:  Linking versus Embedding sound files
In-Reply-To: <00e401c55d4c$0d0b01d0$6801a8c0@HAL9004>
Message-ID: <200505231738.j4NHc9HW066938@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Hi Rocky,
A bit late on this but as far as I can tell PowerPoint (I have 2k3) does not
allow embedding any sounds other than .wav file format. Which is huge
compared to .mp3 or the like.

I tried a .wma since that is MS's own format but won't embed do that either.

You can google up dozens of free/shareware converters if you haven't found
one yet.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin -
Beach Access Software
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 9:56 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint: Linking versus Embedding sound files

Dear List:

I want to embed two mp3 files in my powerpoint presentation.  On 
Tools-->Options-->General Tab I raised the Link sounds with file size
greater than: to 5000 kb which is larger than either of the two mp3 files
I'm inserting.  But it still links instead of embedding.

What am I doing wrong?

TIA

Rocky Smolin
Beach Access Software
http://www.e-z-mrp.com
858-259-4334

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Mon May 23 12:52:02 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 10:52:02 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint:  Linking versus Embedding sound files
References: <200505231738.j4NHc9HW066938@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <004701c55fc0$20535960$6801a8c0@HAL9004>

Yeah, I converted the mp3 to wav and it worked just fine.  Only added 65MB 
to a 75 MB 7 minute PowerPoint presentation. :)

Rocky

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Bartow" <john at winhaven.net>
To: "'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'" 
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Monday, May 23, 2005 10:38 AM
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint: Linking versus Embedding sound files


> Hi Rocky,
> A bit late on this but as far as I can tell PowerPoint (I have 2k3) does 
> not
> allow embedding any sounds other than .wav file format. Which is huge
> compared to .mp3 or the like.
>
> I tried a .wma since that is MS's own format but won't embed do that 
> either.
>
> You can google up dozens of free/shareware converters if you haven't found
> one yet.
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin -
> Beach Access Software
> Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 9:56 AM
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] PowerPoint: Linking versus Embedding sound files
>
> Dear List:
>
> I want to embed two mp3 files in my powerpoint presentation.  On
> Tools-->Options-->General Tab I raised the Link sounds with file size
> greater than: to 5000 kb which is larger than either of the two mp3 files
> I'm inserting.  But it still links instead of embedding.
>
> What am I doing wrong?
>
> TIA
>
> Rocky Smolin
> Beach Access Software
> http://www.e-z-mrp.com
> 858-259-4334
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From artful at rogers.com  Mon May 23 16:51:53 2005
From: artful at rogers.com (Arthur Fuller)
Date: Mon, 23 May 2005 17:51:53 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Quote of the Decade
In-Reply-To: <428F13E7.26276.2FA813B@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
References: <428F13E7.26276.2FA813B@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>
Message-ID: <42925079.4020505@rogers.com>

Forwarded to me from my best bud Peter...

?Nobody in football should be called a genius. A genius is somebody like 
Norman Einstein.?
-- comment by Joe Theismann doing NFL play-by-play

Arthur

>  
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.15 - Release Date: 5/22/2005



From Gustav at cactus.dk  Tue May 24 07:59:24 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Tue, 24 May 2005 14:59:24 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Quote of the Decade
Message-ID: <s293415e.074@cactus.dk>

Hi Arthur

Great humour!

/gustav

>>> artful at rogers.com 05/23 11:51 pm >>>
Forwarded to me from my best bud Peter...

"Nobody in football should be called a genius. A genius is somebody
like 
Norman Einstein."
-- comment by Joe Theismann doing NFL play-by-play

Arthur



From shamil at users.mns.ru  Wed May 25 05:03:27 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:03:27 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] A C/C++ compiler+linker to make on MS Windows
	executables for Linux
Message-ID: <001e01c56111$001b61e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

Hi All,

Does anybody know is there anywhere 

a C/C++ compiler+linker to make on MS Windows executables for Linux

?

Thank you,
Shamil



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 05:43:36 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 11:43:36 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] UDP problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A2F@ALCUXB>

Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 06:33:59 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 12:33:59 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A32@ALCUXB>

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda 
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From garykjos at gmail.com  Wed May 25 08:07:17 2005
From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 08:07:17 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?
In-Reply-To: <001e01c56111$001b61e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
References: <001e01c56111$001b61e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <aea6c49505052506073acb9026@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
I do need as good of protection as I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
Norton to McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 08:15:47 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:15:47 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A3A@ALCUXB>

I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in conjunction with
ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus products, I don't like their
firewall. ZoneAlarm has no issues with McAfee anymore, they fixed that
within two days of discovering the compatibility problem. I've been using
McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically check out my pc with
Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, and it always comes up
blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to recommend McAfee. But make sure you just buy
the virusscan, and not the firewall too.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
like?


Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
I do need as good of protection as I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
Norton to McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 08:27:06 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 08:27:06 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A32@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505251327.j4PDR6M3150688@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Jon,
To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
problem because it did not repair the UDP table?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Wed May 25 08:33:24 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 06:33:24 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
References: <001e01c56111$001b61e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<aea6c49505052506073acb9026@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <007401c5612e$53a80f80$6801a8c0@HAL9004>

Gary:

I use NAV 2005 - came with System Works.  I never buy it however.  Seems 
every time I want it, Fry's has it on sale for $60 with 2 $30 rebates.  The 
rebates came in like clockwork, the system went onto and registered for a 
year on ALL of my boxes.

NAV vs. MacAfee is like PC vs. Mac - everybody's got a strong preference - 
but I don't know that there's any real difference any more.

I just have been using NAV for years because it's free.  I've got System 
Works 2001, 2003, 2004, and 2005 on the shelf.  I think their marketing gig 
is that they'll give you the first one cheap and when the time comes to 
renew, the user will rather spend 3 minutes and $39 right at their desk 
rather than going out and getting the latest version for free after the 
rebates.


Rocky

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gary Kjos" <garykjos at gmail.com>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues" 
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:07 AM
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?


> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
> other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
> be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
> -- 
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 08:32:08 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:32:08 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A3F@ALCUXB>

No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and told
me that it was there, and was a "thrid party" (That's what is says, check it
out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
table, but it was "broken". I then tried to remove it, and that didn't work
either, even after rebooting.

LSPFix did the trick.

HTH


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Jon,
To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
problem because it did not repair the UDP table?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From JRojas at tnco-inc.com  Wed May 25 08:45:57 2005
From: JRojas at tnco-inc.com (Joe Rojas)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:45:57 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
Message-ID: <0CC84C9461AE6445AD5A602001C41C4B05A2D9@mercury.tnco-inc.com>

I use CA's eTrust.

It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it!
The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every day
as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update definitions once a
week (unless there is a sever outbreak).
Symantec does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must
be applied manually.

JR
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
I do need as good of protection as I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
Norton to McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. and
intended solely for the addressee. It may contain information which is
covered by legal, professional, or other privileges. If you are not the
intended addressee, or someone authorized by the intended addressee to
receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not retain,
disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in reliance on this
transmission. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify
the sender as soon as possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc.
uses virus protection, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. TNCO, Inc. accepts no liability for
any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 08:48:26 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:48:26 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A43@ALCUXB>

McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week and last week...
I don't know why.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
not like?


I use CA's eTrust.

It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it!
The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every day
as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update definitions once a
week (unless there is a sever outbreak).
Symantec does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must
be applied manually.

JR
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
I do need as good of protection as I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
Norton to McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. and
intended solely for the addressee. It may contain information which is
covered by legal, professional, or other privileges. If you are not the
intended addressee, or someone authorized by the intended addressee to
receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not retain,
disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in reliance on this
transmission. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify
the sender as soon as possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc.
uses virus protection, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. TNCO, Inc. accepts no liability for
any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 08:54:31 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 08:54:31 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A3F@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505251354.j4PDsWM4316476@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Thanks for the heads up. I've run across new.net many times but never had an
issue removing it before. Problem is these buggers keep changing their
methods. I wonder if Spybot S&D would have removed I correctly?

Can you report that to MS? 


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:32 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and told
me that it was there, and was a "thrid party" (That's what is says, check it
out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
table, but it was "broken". I then tried to remove it, and that didn't work
either, even after rebooting.

LSPFix did the trick.

HTH


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Jon,
To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
problem because it did not repair the UDP table?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject to
the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject to
the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 08:54:31 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 08:54:31 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
In-Reply-To: <aea6c49505052506073acb9026@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <200505251354.j4PDsWM5316476@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Gary,
Don't do it! My Sister in-law just went through a Norton 2005 issue (because
she's too proud to ask). Screwed up the entire PC. Just the last in a long
list of Norton problems I've had to hear about. If you're one of those
REALLY lucky people then you stand a chance, otherwise the chances are that
you will eventually regret it.

I was a Norton supporter until the 2005 version was released. I can fully
recommend any Norton product up to 2004 (which you can still get for a
steal) but I ABSOLUTELY do not recommend Norton 2005. It is quickly rising
on my list of most problematic products. I have now removed Norton 2005 from
almost as many PCs as McAfee products (which I don't recommend either - yes
Jon I know you like McAfee, but like NAV, I used it many years before it
started causing more problems than it was worth, we'll just have to agree to
disagree :o)

If you want to go with something else I recommend CA's security products.
Their home products are EZ-AV (uses the same engine as their corporate
eTrust AV), EZ firewall (which is apparently re-GUI-ed ZoneLabs) and Pest
Patrol are top notch products. Also Trend Micro products are very good.
Trends online scan is tops and their downloadable emergency AV "SysClean" is
the best (kicks McAfee's Stinger all over the place). Counterspy from
Sunbelt Software (which is based on the same engine as Giant AS, MS-AS) but
is has more advanced functionality is probably the very best anti-spy.
Sunbelt had contracted with Giant to write this for them before MS bought
out Giant. The signature updates actually come from MS now!

If you want to go the free route Grisoft AV is free for personal use and
very good, Sygate Personal Firewall is free for personal use and is very
good, and of course MS anti-spy is very good and free. All highly
recommended!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gary Kjos
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button
thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I
have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they
had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 08:58:22 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:58:22 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A45@ALCUXB>

My dad likes Norman Anti Virus, that's available for free as well. I just
happen to have a firm belief that you get what you pay for...

I'll have to have a look at sysclean, as I think Stigner is fantastic. Does
it really kick its ass that much?


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
not like?


Gary,
Don't do it! My Sister in-law just went through a Norton 2005 issue (because
she's too proud to ask). Screwed up the entire PC. Just the last in a long
list of Norton problems I've had to hear about. If you're one of those
REALLY lucky people then you stand a chance, otherwise the chances are that
you will eventually regret it.

I was a Norton supporter until the 2005 version was released. I can fully
recommend any Norton product up to 2004 (which you can still get for a
steal) but I ABSOLUTELY do not recommend Norton 2005. It is quickly rising
on my list of most problematic products. I have now removed Norton 2005 from
almost as many PCs as McAfee products (which I don't recommend either - yes
Jon I know you like McAfee, but like NAV, I used it many years before it
started causing more problems than it was worth, we'll just have to agree to
disagree :o)

If you want to go with something else I recommend CA's security products.
Their home products are EZ-AV (uses the same engine as their corporate
eTrust AV), EZ firewall (which is apparently re-GUI-ed ZoneLabs) and Pest
Patrol are top notch products. Also Trend Micro products are very good.
Trends online scan is tops and their downloadable emergency AV "SysClean" is
the best (kicks McAfee's Stinger all over the place). Counterspy from
Sunbelt Software (which is based on the same engine as Giant AS, MS-AS) but
is has more advanced functionality is probably the very best anti-spy.
Sunbelt had contracted with Giant to write this for them before MS bought
out Giant. The signature updates actually come from MS now!

If you want to go the free route Grisoft AV is free for personal use and
very good, Sygate Personal Firewall is free for personal use and is very
good, and of course MS anti-spy is very good and free. All highly
recommended!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gary Kjos
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button
thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I
have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they
had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 09:00:14 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:00:14 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A46@ALCUXB>

Go to www.new.net and read their blurb... I think they're a legitimate
company, but I don't see the point in what they do... you need to install
their software before you can get to these other sites, and if you don't
know about them then you won't go to them... catch 22...

I don't know, I followed New.Net's instructions that were on their site, but
they were useless.

I can't remember... it was yesterday :-P


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Thanks for the heads up. I've run across new.net many times but never had an
issue removing it before. Problem is these buggers keep changing their
methods. I wonder if Spybot S&D would have removed I correctly?

Can you report that to MS? 


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:32 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and told
me that it was there, and was a "thrid party" (That's what is says, check it
out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
table, but it was "broken". I then tried to remove it, and that didn't work
either, even after rebooting.

LSPFix did the trick.

HTH


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Jon,
To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
problem because it did not repair the UDP table?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject to
the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject to
the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 09:01:43 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:01:43 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A43@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505251401.j4PE1iM3150690@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Do any of you use Sophos? (IIRC they are based in the UK)


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:48 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week and last week...
I don't know why.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
like?


I use CA's eTrust.

It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it!
The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every day
as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update definitions once a
week (unless there is a sever outbreak).
Symantec does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must
be applied manually.

JR
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button
thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I
have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they
had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. and
intended solely for the addressee. It may contain information which is
covered by legal, professional, or other privileges. If you are not the
intended addressee, or someone authorized by the intended addressee to
receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not retain,
disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in reliance on this
transmission. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify
the sender as soon as possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc.
uses virus protection, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. TNCO, Inc. accepts no liability for
any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.
_______________________________________________
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The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
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From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 09:05:08 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:05:08 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A48@ALCUXB>

I've heard of them, but never to the extent of anyone saying that they were
good or bad.

Sorry, no help there :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 15:02
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?


Do any of you use Sophos? (IIRC they are based in the UK)


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:48 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week and last week...
I don't know why.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
like?


I use CA's eTrust.

It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it!
The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every day
as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update definitions once a
week (unless there is a sever outbreak).
Symantec does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must
be applied manually.

JR
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button
thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I
have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they
had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. and
intended solely for the addressee. It may contain information which is
covered by legal, professional, or other privileges. If you are not the
intended addressee, or someone authorized by the intended addressee to
receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not retain,
disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in reliance on this
transmission. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify
the sender as soon as possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc.
uses virus protection, the recipient should check this email and any
attachments for the presence of viruses. TNCO, Inc. accepts no liability for
any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
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the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
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The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
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ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
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Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 09:12:53 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:12:53 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A46@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505251413.j4PECssk049896@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

I have generally run acroos it whenkids have the computer while waiting for
Mom/Dad to get done at work. I don't know how they pick it up though. Maybe
file sharing or chat software uses it?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:00 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Go to www.new.net and read their blurb... I think they're a legitimate
company, but I don't see the point in what they do... you need to install
their software before you can get to these other sites, and if you don't
know about them then you won't go to them... catch 22...

I don't know, I followed New.Net's instructions that were on their site, but
they were useless.

I can't remember... it was yesterday :-P


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Thanks for the heads up. I've run across new.net many times but never had an
issue removing it before. Problem is these buggers keep changing their
methods. I wonder if Spybot S&D would have removed I correctly?

Can you report that to MS? 


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:32 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and told
me that it was there, and was a "thrid party" (That's what is says, check it
out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
table, but it was "broken". I then tried to remove it, and that didn't work
either, even after rebooting.

LSPFix did the trick.

HTH


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Jon,
To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
problem because it did not repair the UDP table?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
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ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
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From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 09:12:53 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:12:53 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A45@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505251413.j4PECssl049896@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

The single advantage of stinger is that it always fits on a floppy. Of
course Dell, HP and other PCs ship without floppies now so that isn't much
of an advantage. I use a USB flash drive for my emergency procedures.
SysClean uses the full extent of the latest virus pattern file. So it checks
and cleans everything. Stinger check for the worst 40 signatures or
something of the sort. Not bad, and I have used it, just not very thorough.

I'll have to check out Norman AV. Grisoft is a IIRC German AV company that
sells corporate AV products so it has a top notch company behind it, not
some guy in his home office - but hey, what am I saying there!


John "some guy in his home office" B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:58 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

My dad likes Norman Anti Virus, that's available for free as well. I just
happen to have a firm belief that you get what you pay for...

I'll have to have a look at sysclean, as I think Stigner is fantastic. Does
it really kick its ass that much?


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
like?


Gary,
Don't do it! My Sister in-law just went through a Norton 2005 issue (because
she's too proud to ask). Screwed up the entire PC. Just the last in a long
list of Norton problems I've had to hear about. If you're one of those
REALLY lucky people then you stand a chance, otherwise the chances are that
you will eventually regret it.

I was a Norton supporter until the 2005 version was released. I can fully
recommend any Norton product up to 2004 (which you can still get for a
steal) but I ABSOLUTELY do not recommend Norton 2005. It is quickly rising
on my list of most problematic products. I have now removed Norton 2005 from
almost as many PCs as McAfee products (which I don't recommend either - yes
Jon I know you like McAfee, but like NAV, I used it many years before it
started causing more problems than it was worth, we'll just have to agree to
disagree :o)

If you want to go with something else I recommend CA's security products.
Their home products are EZ-AV (uses the same engine as their corporate
eTrust AV), EZ firewall (which is apparently re-GUI-ed ZoneLabs) and Pest
Patrol are top notch products. Also Trend Micro products are very good.
Trends online scan is tops and their downloadable emergency AV "SysClean" is
the best (kicks McAfee's Stinger all over the place). Counterspy from
Sunbelt Software (which is based on the same engine as Giant AS, MS-AS) but
is has more advanced functionality is probably the very best anti-spy.
Sunbelt had contracted with Giant to write this for them before MS bought
out Giant. The signature updates actually come from MS now!

If you want to go the free route Grisoft AV is free for personal use and
very good, Sygate Personal Firewall is free for personal use and is very
good, and of course MS anti-spy is very good and free. All highly
recommended!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gary Kjos
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button
thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I
have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they
had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject to
the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From bchacc at san.rr.com  Wed May 25 09:14:21 2005
From: bchacc at san.rr.com (Rocky Smolin - Beach Access Software)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 07:14:21 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
References: <200505251354.j4PDsWM5316476@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <00e001c56134$0e7af520$6801a8c0@HAL9004>

John:

What specific problems did you have with NAV.  I'm using it and would like 
to avoid them if I can.

Rocky

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Bartow" <john at winhaven.net>
To: "'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'" 
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:54 AM
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not 
like?


> Gary,
> Don't do it! My Sister in-law just went through a Norton 2005 issue 
> (because
> she's too proud to ask). Screwed up the entire PC. Just the last in a long
> list of Norton problems I've had to hear about. If you're one of those
> REALLY lucky people then you stand a chance, otherwise the chances are 
> that
> you will eventually regret it.
>
> I was a Norton supporter until the 2005 version was released. I can fully
> recommend any Norton product up to 2004 (which you can still get for a
> steal) but I ABSOLUTELY do not recommend Norton 2005. It is quickly rising
> on my list of most problematic products. I have now removed Norton 2005 
> from
> almost as many PCs as McAfee products (which I don't recommend either - 
> yes
> Jon I know you like McAfee, but like NAV, I used it many years before it
> started causing more problems than it was worth, we'll just have to agree 
> to
> disagree :o)
>
> If you want to go with something else I recommend CA's security products.
> Their home products are EZ-AV (uses the same engine as their corporate
> eTrust AV), EZ firewall (which is apparently re-GUI-ed ZoneLabs) and Pest
> Patrol are top notch products. Also Trend Micro products are very good.
> Trends online scan is tops and their downloadable emergency AV "SysClean" 
> is
> the best (kicks McAfee's Stinger all over the place). Counterspy from
> Sunbelt Software (which is based on the same engine as Giant AS, MS-AS) 
> but
> is has more advanced functionality is probably the very best anti-spy.
> Sunbelt had contracted with Giant to write this for them before MS bought
> out Giant. The signature updates actually come from MS now!
>
> If you want to go the free route Grisoft AV is free for personal use and
> very good, Sygate Personal Firewall is free for personal use and is very
> good, and of course MS anti-spy is very good and free. All highly
> recommended!
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gary Kjos
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:07 AM
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not 
> like?
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
> button
> thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and 
> I
> have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that 
> they
> had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
> want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than 
> that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while 
> I
> have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
> any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
> expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection 
> as
> I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton 
> to
> McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
> versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making 
> a
> purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 09:16:38 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:16:38 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A49@ALCUXB>

Yeah, it's possible... I wonder how it got onto the company pc... *shrug*


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 15:13
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


I have generally run acroos it whenkids have the computer while waiting for
Mom/Dad to get done at work. I don't know how they pick it up though. Maybe
file sharing or chat software uses it?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:00 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Go to www.new.net and read their blurb... I think they're a legitimate
company, but I don't see the point in what they do... you need to install
their software before you can get to these other sites, and if you don't
know about them then you won't go to them... catch 22...

I don't know, I followed New.Net's instructions that were on their site, but
they were useless.

I can't remember... it was yesterday :-P


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Thanks for the heads up. I've run across new.net many times but never had an
issue removing it before. Problem is these buggers keep changing their
methods. I wonder if Spybot S&D would have removed I correctly?

Can you report that to MS? 


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:32 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and told
me that it was there, and was a "thrid party" (That's what is says, check it
out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
table, but it was "broken". I then tried to remove it, and that didn't work
either, even after rebooting.

LSPFix did the trick.

HTH


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


Jon,
To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
problem because it did not repair the UDP table?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems

Success!
 
I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com <http://www.windowsbbs.com> ), so
I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the job.
 
So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
 
 
Jon
-----Original Message-----
From: Jon Tydda
Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
Subject: UDP problems


Hi all
 
I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday, and
both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to "start the network
connections" and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log in. It's
added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the network.
 
I've been to www.new.net <http://www.new.net>  and it tells me that it's a
way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet, such
as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
 
If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells me
that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are "broken"... how do I
remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
 
I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that it
might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
 
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
Jon


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Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From andy at minstersystems.co.uk  Wed May 25 09:21:59 2005
From: andy at minstersystems.co.uk (Andy Lacey)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:21:59 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
Message-ID: <20050525142156.E082F24D29C@smtp.nildram.co.uk>

I use NAV2004. No problems. If 2005's a bummer can't you get 2004 on ebay?
We had the same issue with 2000 no longer being supported so I guess 2004
has got about a 5-year life by which time a better version than 2005 will
hopefully be around.

--
Andy Lacey
http://www.minstersystems.co.uk



--------- Original Message --------
From: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?
Date: 25/05/05 13:07

>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
> other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
> be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
>
>
>

________________________________________________
Message sent using UebiMiau 2.7.2



From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 09:22:04 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:22:04 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A48@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <200505251422.j4PEM5sk043194@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>

I got their trial software a couple of years ago but t was cost prohibitive
for small businesses. I signed up for their email virus updates. I still get
them - at the rate of 2-3 per day!

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:05 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

I've heard of them, but never to the extent of anyone saying that they were
good or bad.

Sorry, no help there :-)


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
Sent: 25 May 2005 15:02
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?


Do any of you use Sophos? (IIRC they are based in the UK)


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:48 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week and last week...
I don't know why.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
like?


I use CA's eTrust.

It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it!
The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every day
as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update definitions once a
week (unless there is a sever outbreak).
Symantec does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must
be applied manually.

JR
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?

Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button
thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I
have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they
had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they
want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

--
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. and
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receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not retain,
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transmission. If you have received this transmission in error, please notify
the sender as soon as possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc.
uses virus protection, the recipient should check this email and any
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ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
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ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
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From jim.moss at jlmoss.net  Wed May 25 09:30:18 2005
From: jim.moss at jlmoss.net (Jim Moss)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:30:18 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A43@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A43@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <46057.143.116.116.197.1117031418.squirrel@143.116.116.197>

I use Trend Micro PC-Cillin, and have for years with no problems. It's
easy on system resources, highly configurable, and includes spyware and a
firewall to boot. Trend will sometimes update my virus definitions four
times a day.

JM


> McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week and last
> week...
> I don't know why.
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
> not like?
>
>
> I use CA's eTrust.
>
> It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it!
> The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every
> day
> as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update definitions once
> a
> week (unless there is a sever outbreak).
> Symantec does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must
> be applied manually.
>
> JR
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
> like?
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
> other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
> be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
> This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. and
> intended solely for the addressee. It may contain information which is
> covered by legal, professional, or other privileges. If you are not the
> intended addressee, or someone authorized by the intended addressee to
> receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not retain,
> disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in reliance on this
> transmission. If you have received this transmission in error, please
> notify
> the sender as soon as possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc.
> uses virus protection, the recipient should check this email and any
> attachments for the presence of viruses. TNCO, Inc. accepts no liability
> for
> any damage caused by any virus transmitted by this email.
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>




From andy at minstersystems.co.uk  Wed May 25 09:38:00 2005
From: andy at minstersystems.co.uk (Andy Lacey)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:38:00 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Message-ID: <20050525143758.19DA824CD88@smtp.nildram.co.uk>

new.net definitely comes in with some peer-to-peer sharing stuff.
--
Andy Lacey
http://www.minstersystems.co.uk



--------- Original Message --------
From: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Date: 25/05/05 14:18

>
> Yeah, it's possible... I wonder how it got onto the company pc... *shrug*
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 15:13
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
>
> I have generally run acroos it whenkids have the computer while waiting
for
> Mom/Dad to get done at work. I don't know how they pick it up though.
Maybe
> file sharing or chat software uses it?
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:00 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
> Go to www.new.net and read their blurb... I think they're a legitimate
> company, but I don't see the point in what they do... you need to install
> their software before you can get to these other sites, and if you don't
> know about them then you won't go to them... catch 22...
>
> I don't know, I followed New.Net's instructions that were on their site,
but
> they were useless.
>
> I can't remember... it was yesterday :-P
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
>
> Thanks for the heads up. I've run across new.net many times but never had
an
> issue removing it before. Problem is these buggers keep changing their
> methods. I wonder if Spybot S&amp;D would have removed I correctly?
>
> Can you report that to MS?
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:32 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
> No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and
told
> me that it was there, and was a &quot;thrid party&quot; (That's what is
says, check it
> out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
> table, but it was &quot;broken&quot;. I then tried to remove it, and that
didn't work
> either, even after rebooting.
>
> LSPFix did the trick.
>
> HTH
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
>
> Jon,
> To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
> problem because it did not repair the UDP table?
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
> To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
> Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
> Success!
>
> I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
> subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com
&lt;http://www.windowsbbs.com&gt; ), so
> I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
> program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the
job.
>
> So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
>
>
> Jon
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
> To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
> Subject: UDP problems
>
>
> Hi all
>
> I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday,
and
> both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
> various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
> listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to &quot;start the
network
> connections&quot; and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log
in. It's
> added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the
network.
>
> I've been to www.new.net &lt;http://www.new.net&gt;  and it tells me that
it's a
> way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet,
such
> as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
> they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
>
> If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells
me
> that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are &quot;broken&quot;...
how do I
> remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
>
> I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that
it
> might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
> anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
>
> Jon
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to
> the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to
> the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to
> the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
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> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
>
>

________________________________________________
Message sent using UebiMiau 2.7.2



From bheid at appdevgrp.com  Wed May 25 09:41:59 2005
From: bheid at appdevgrp.com (Bobby Heid)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:41:59 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
In-Reply-To: <916187228923D311A6FE00A0CC3FAA30BC66C5@ADGSERVER>
Message-ID: <916187228923D311A6FE00A0CC3FAA30ABEB93@ADGSERVER>

I use NAV 2005 (well, actually systemworks 2005).  Like others, I just buy
the new version for free/almost free every year after rebates.

I have not had any problems with NAV 2005 (nor any other versions) on my
system (XP Pro sp2).

I used McAfee for years until out of the blue, it comes up and tells me my
thing had expired and I needed to renew.  It would not do any updates
(whereas NAV will still do some sort of updates).  That pissed me off
because 1) There was no warning that my subscription was about to expire and
2) I was left with a system that could not handle any new viruses until I
renewed/upgraded.  That is when I switched to NAV.

Bobby

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gary Kjos
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not like?


Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.

Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew. OK, no
big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now button thing
and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I have
to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they had
issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they want
$39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.

I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and while I
have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me
any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is
expiring is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of protection as
I can get.

The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from Norton to
McAffee on their new machines?

So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or other
versions or even other companies software because I will need to be making a
purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.

-- 
Gary Kjos



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 09:40:50 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:40:50 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A4B@ALCUXB>

Hmm, I might have to have a sniff around some of the other pc's then...

Thanks Andy


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Andy Lacey [mailto:andy at minstersystems.co.uk]
Sent: 25 May 2005 15:38
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems


new.net definitely comes in with some peer-to-peer sharing stuff.
--
Andy Lacey
http://www.minstersystems.co.uk



--------- Original Message --------
From: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
Date: 25/05/05 14:18

>
> Yeah, it's possible... I wonder how it got onto the company pc... *shrug*
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 15:13
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
>
> I have generally run acroos it whenkids have the computer while waiting
for
> Mom/Dad to get done at work. I don't know how they pick it up though.
Maybe
> file sharing or chat software uses it?
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:00 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
> Go to www.new.net and read their blurb... I think they're a legitimate
> company, but I don't see the point in what they do... you need to install
> their software before you can get to these other sites, and if you don't
> know about them then you won't go to them... catch 22...
>
> I don't know, I followed New.Net's instructions that were on their site,
but
> they were useless.
>
> I can't remember... it was yesterday :-P
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:55
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
>
> Thanks for the heads up. I've run across new.net many times but never had
an
> issue removing it before. Problem is these buggers keep changing their
> methods. I wonder if Spybot S&amp;D would have removed I correctly?
>
> Can you report that to MS?
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:32 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
> No - the uninstaller did not clean up the UDP table. MS AS found it and
told
> me that it was there, and was a &quot;thrid party&quot; (That's what is
says, check it
> out for yourselves) program. After I removed it, it was still in the UDP
> table, but it was &quot;broken&quot;. I then tried to remove it, and that
didn't work
> either, even after rebooting.
>
> LSPFix did the trick.
>
> HTH
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:27
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
>
> Jon,
> To clarify this - are you saying that MS AS removed New.net but caused a
> problem because it did not repair the UDP table?
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:34 AM
> To: 'Dba-Tech (E-mail)'
> Subject: [dba-Tech] RE: UDP problems
>
> Success!
>
> I had a look at some previous posts, and found a forum that Marty Connelly
> subscribes to ( http://www.windowsbbs.com
&lt;http://www.windowsbbs.com&gt; ), so
> I signed up and searched in there. They recommended that I download a
> program called LSPFix, whish is absolutely brilliant, and has done the
job.
>
> So, thanks Marty, for whatever that previous post was :-)
>
>
> Jon
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 11:44
> To: Dba-Tech (E-mail)
> Subject: UDP problems
>
>
> Hi all
>
> I was doing a routine update/spyware/virus scan of a pc here yesterday,
and
> both Spybot and MS Anti Spyware came up with a thing called New.Net in
> various places, so I removed it from add/remove programs, where I saw it
> listed. Now when you turn the pc on, it takes forever to &quot;start the
network
> connections&quot; and comes up with a UDP error when you eventually log
in. It's
> added a good 3 minutes to the boot time, and I can't see any of the
network.
>
> I've been to www.new.net &lt;http://www.new.net&gt;  and it tells me that
it's a
> way of seeing websites with extensions that ICANN haven't released yet,
such
> as .shop or .mp3, but the removal instructions aren't terribly helpful -
> they just tell me to uninstall it from add/remove programs, which I did.
>
> If I open MS Anti Spyware, and look at the advanced tools part, it tells
me
> that there are 4 entries in the UDP table that are &quot;broken&quot;...
how do I
> remove them and hopefully get this pc back on the network?
>
> I've tried uninstalling the network card and reinstalling it, hoping that
it
> might start with new network settings, but to no avail. I can't find
> anything on google, but maybe I'm not asking the right questions...
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated.
>
>
> Jon
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to
> the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to
> the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to
> the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
>
>

________________________________________________
Message sent using UebiMiau 2.7.2

_______________________________________________
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 09:58:22 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:58:22 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
In-Reply-To: <00e001c56134$0e7af520$6801a8c0@HAL9004>
Message-ID: <200505251458.j4PEwNPB172710@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>

Many installation problems. After that however, avoidance is difficult at
best.

He problems just pop up for no apparent reason, although I think it must
have to do with system conflicts and auto updates. The problem is that once
you get a Norton malfunction it is difficult to fix. You can spend an hour
trying to correct it and to be quite frank you generally have to go to the
last step in Norton's "troubleshooting techniques" which is uninstall ALL
Norton products and reinstall in a specific order! I did this once on my own
PC and that took about 3 hours. The second time I tossed NIS. (I still use
System Works and Partition Manager). Its one thing to put up with crap on my
own PC but when my customers have to pay for this more than once they get a
bit irritated. Thankfully I didn't recommend 2005 to anyone, for the most
part they all fell into the upgrade trap. So I can just advise them to dump
it and replace it with something else. Many ISP are not offering free
downloads of security products.

Roadrunner offers something but I forget what (I only have one customer with
RR and their on NIS 2004).

SBC offers CA's line which is the best thing about SBC support by far!

Charter offers Charter Security Suite (which uses F-secure's AV/firewall -
it has issues too though and is slow).

I avoided one issue by turning off auto updates for a certain piece of
Norton Internet Security 2005, IIRC it was the firewall - which of course is
hardly an acceptable practice. I turned it off because after the update
installed it would not allow network access. I used System Restore (which
doesn't always work with Norton products - and sometimes screws it up) and
it removed the patch. I turned it off and will try to update it next time
I'm on site there.


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Rocky Smolin -
Beach Access Software
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:14 AM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,who do we not
like?

John:

What specific problems did you have with NAV.  I'm using it and would like
to avoid them if I can.

Rocky

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Bartow" <john at winhaven.net>
To: "'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'" 
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 6:54 AM
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
like?


> Gary,
> Don't do it! My Sister in-law just went through a Norton 2005 issue 
> (because she's too proud to ask). Screwed up the entire PC. Just the 
> last in a long list of Norton problems I've had to hear about. If 
> you're one of those REALLY lucky people then you stand a chance, 
> otherwise the chances are that you will eventually regret it.
>
> I was a Norton supporter until the 2005 version was released. I can 
> fully recommend any Norton product up to 2004 (which you can still get 
> for a
> steal) but I ABSOLUTELY do not recommend Norton 2005. It is quickly 
> rising on my list of most problematic products. I have now removed 
> Norton 2005 from almost as many PCs as McAfee products (which I don't 
> recommend either - yes Jon I know you like McAfee, but like NAV, I 
> used it many years before it started causing more problems than it was 
> worth, we'll just have to agree to disagree :o)
>
> If you want to go with something else I recommend CA's security products.
> Their home products are EZ-AV (uses the same engine as their corporate 
> eTrust AV), EZ firewall (which is apparently re-GUI-ed ZoneLabs) and 
> Pest Patrol are top notch products. Also Trend Micro products are very
good.
> Trends online scan is tops and their downloadable emergency AV "SysClean" 
> is
> the best (kicks McAfee's Stinger all over the place). Counterspy from 
> Sunbelt Software (which is based on the same engine as Giant AS, 
> MS-AS) but is has more advanced functionality is probably the very 
> best anti-spy.
> Sunbelt had contracted with Giant to write this for them before MS 
> bought out Giant. The signature updates actually come from MS now!
>
> If you want to go the free route Grisoft AV is free for personal use 
> and very good, Sygate Personal Firewall is free for personal use and 
> is very good, and of course MS anti-spy is very good and free. All 
> highly recommended!
>
>
> John B.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Gary Kjos
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:07 AM
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not 
> like?
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my 
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been 
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing 
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and 
> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have 
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet 
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and 
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus 
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail 
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so 
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from 
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or 
> other versions or even other companies software because I will need to 
> be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From Jeff at outbaktech.com  Wed May 25 10:23:13 2005
From: Jeff at outbaktech.com (Jeff Barrows)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:23:13 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
Message-ID: <E2FBF0A51D2A324C90BA16C566366A6D0D910B@belgarion.Outbak.local>

I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Wed May 25 10:28:05 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 16:28:05 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A4D@ALCUXB>

Do you need to use the disks again? :-P

There are various "shredder" programs available... get one and install each
hard drive as a slave in your pc, then run the shredder on it. I've
formatted a drive with a Win 98SE boot disk, and put it in a pc running Win
2K, run scandisk, and all the data has appeared again. Format isn't as good
as it should be...


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Barrows [mailto:Jeff at outbaktech.com]
Sent: 25 May 2005 16:23
To: Dba-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive


I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard
drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and
wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From garykjos at gmail.com  Wed May 25 10:39:43 2005
From: garykjos at gmail.com (Gary Kjos)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:39:43 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <E2FBF0A51D2A324C90BA16C566366A6D0D910B@belgarion.Outbak.local>
References: <E2FBF0A51D2A324C90BA16C566366A6D0D910B@belgarion.Outbak.local>
Message-ID: <aea6c49505052508393b81278b@mail.gmail.com>

If you have a PC Magazine Utilities Subscription you could use their
SHRED 2 program to write over stuff before reformatting.

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1759,13352,00.asp

If you don't already have a subscription it may be worthwhile - it's
not that expensive and they have lots of valuable utilities available.


On 5/25/05, Jeff Barrows <Jeff at outbaktech.com> wrote:
> I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
> 
> TIA
> 
> 
> Jeff Barrows
> MCP, MCAD, MCSD
> 
> Outbak Technologies, LLC
> Racine, WI
> jeff at outbaktech.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 


-- 
Gary Kjos
garykjos at gmail.com


From Gustav at cactus.dk  Wed May 25 10:41:21 2005
From: Gustav at cactus.dk (Gustav Brock)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 17:41:21 +0200
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
Message-ID: <s294b8de.002@cactus.dk>

Hi Jeff

You need a pro tool for this, like this Linux boot diskette with the
excellent:

 Darik's Boot and Nuke
  Warning: This software irrecoverably destroys data.

  http://dban.sourceforge.net/ 

  * Press the F2 key to learn about DBAN
  * Press the F3 key for a list of quick commands.
  * Press the ENTER key to start DBAN in interactive mode.
  * Enter autonuke at this prompt to start DBAN in automatic mode.

  You may enter these commands at the boot prompt. In each case, all
disks in
  the computer will be wiped automatically without confirmation.

   dod       Wipe all disks with the DoD 5220-22.M method.
   ops2      Wipe all disks with the RCMP TSSIT OPS-II method.
   gutmann   Wipe all disks with the Gutmann method.
   prng      Wipe all disks with the PRNG Stream method.
   quick     Wipe all disks with the Quick Erase method.

Please note, these methods can take a _very_ long time.

/gustav

>>> Jeff at outbaktech.com 05/25 5:23 pm >>>
I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a
hard drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their
hardware and wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not
retrievable by anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each
hard drive, but I was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com 



From andy at minstersystems.co.uk  Wed May 25 10:43:48 2005
From: andy at minstersystems.co.uk (Andy Lacey)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 16:43:48 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
Message-ID: <20050525154346.76936252AA5@smtp.nildram.co.uk>

I read a book by a computer forensics guy (people who're called in by police
to get what they can off disks as evidence). He scoffed at format as a
method of wiping data. If the data is really sensitive a big hammer is the
best way - seriously.

--
Andy Lacey
http://www.minstersystems.co.uk



--------- Original Message --------
From: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
Date: 25/05/05 15:29

>
> Do you need to use the disks again? :-P
>
> There are various &quot;shredder&quot; programs available... get one and
install each
> hard drive as a slave in your pc, then run the shredder on it. I've
> formatted a drive with a Win 98SE boot disk, and put it in a pc running
Win
> 2K, run scandisk, and all the data has appeared again. Format isn't as
good
> as it should be...
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Barrows [mailto:Jeff at outbaktech.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 16:23
> To: Dba-Tech
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
>
>
> I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a
hard
> drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware
and
> wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
> anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
> was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
>
> TIA
>
>
> Jeff Barrows
> MCP, MCAD, MCSD
>
> Outbak Technologies, LLC
> Racine, WI
> jeff at outbaktech.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
>
>

________________________________________________
Message sent using UebiMiau 2.7.2



From pharold at proftesting.com  Wed May 25 10:46:10 2005
From: pharold at proftesting.com (Perry Harold)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 11:46:10 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <E2FBF0A51D2A324C90BA16C566366A6D0D910B@belgarion.Outbak.local>
Message-ID: <000501c56140$e0152310$192da8c0@D58BT131Perry>

DBAN looks to be pretty good

http://dban.sourceforge.net/

Perry Harold

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Barrows
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 11:23 AM
To: Dba-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive


I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard
drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and
wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com _______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com





From fhtapia at gmail.com  Wed May 25 11:00:17 2005
From: fhtapia at gmail.com (Francisco Tapia)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 09:00:17 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
	who do we not like?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A3A@ALCUXB>
References: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A3A@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <b874372a05052509008e6ccb3@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/25/05, Jon Tydda <Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk> wrote:
> I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in conjunction with
> ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus products, I don't like their
> firewall. ZoneAlarm has no issues with McAfee anymore, they fixed that
> within two days of discovering the compatibility problem. I've been using
> McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically check out my pc with
> Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, and it always comes up
> blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to recommend McAfee. But make sure you just buy
> the virusscan, and not the firewall too.

I use McAfee 8 Corp  here at work and my biggest gripe is that even
tho I have a "full local drives" scan every night... it still fails to
find certain trojans that make their way onto my pc.  If not for dirms
defragmenting my hdd once a month I'd never would have thought I had
any infections on this pc.

At home I used to use TrendMicro 2003, but when I was hit w/ the
Upgrade to 2005 edition I quit on them simply because I hate the
whole.. upgrade now plus you can have anti-spam anti-spyware etc..

I want antivirus protection... I have my own FW thank you.. why can't
I just by a GOOD a/v.  Trend micro was good at scanning every file on
my hdd, but could not scan inside .rar files or my thunderbird mail
(unless it was open).

I recently switched to NOD32.. and I do love it.. it's FAST.. it does
A/V only (tho the new 2.5 also does spyware i'm told. since I just
bought a license the upgrade is free).  I like knowing that if I
request a "FULL LOCAL DISKS" scan it actually does it.. unlike mcafee.
 McAfee is also a resource hog.  I'm now testing a NOD32 corp for the
office and my DELL 1.6ghz machine running on 512 runs SOOO FAST it's
not even funny, it caught some trojans that mcAfee never could clean
(just left in quaranteen). I have found my scan times are quicker, and
more accurate from NOD32.  When the 30day trial I'm supposed to give a
full report to our main sysadmin guy who will be pushing towards a
diffrent product (other than mcAfee).

The only thing bad about NOD32 is that you can't run google desktop
search, it has an incompatibility w/ the Internet monitor.  that's it.
-- 
-Francisco
http://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!
http://sqlthis.blogspot.com | Tsql and More...


From peter.brawley at earthlink.net  Wed May 25 11:06:04 2005
From: peter.brawley at earthlink.net (Peter Brawley)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 11:06:04 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
In-Reply-To: <aea6c49505052506073acb9026@mail.gmail.com>
References: <001e01c56111$001b61e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<aea6c49505052506073acb9026@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4294A26C.9040400@earthlink.net>

Gary,

We had W2K/XP machines running NAV/NIS 2003/2004 badly infected. It 
seemed the more intrusive and bloated NAV became, the less effective it 
was. We uninstalled NAV/NIS on all machines (not trivial: Norton junk 
does not want to be uninstalled; expect to spend some time) and 
installed Grisoft Antivirus (AVG). No problems in half a year.

PB

---

Gary Kjos wrote:

>Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
>Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
>subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
>OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
>button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
>DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
>people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
>did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
>seen it in stores for less than that.
>
>I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
>Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
>while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
>hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
>though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
>I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
>The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
>That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
>Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
>So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
>other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
>be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
>  
>


-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.322 / Virus Database: 266.11.17 - Release Date: 5/25/2005



From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 12:06:31 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 12:06:31 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <E2FBF0A51D2A324C90BA16C566366A6D0D910B@belgarion.Outbak.local>
Message-ID: <200505251706.j4PH6Voo159298@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

Hi Jeff,
I have similar requests from accountants, financial planners, etc.

If they're just disposing of them:
If you have a bunch of PCs then buy one of those huge-electro magnets from
the hardware store or radio shack. Takes a few seconds per unit. Otherwise,
if you only have a couple remove the hard drive and smack it dead center
with a hammer. It takes less than five minutes.

Your customer will be impressed with your thoroughness, and as a byproduct,
it alleviates job related stress. :o)



-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Barrows
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:23 AM
To: Dba-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive

I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard
drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and
wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From jwcolby at colbyconsulting.com  Wed May 25 12:16:25 2005
From: jwcolby at colbyconsulting.com (John W. Colby)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 13:16:25 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <200505251706.j4PH6Voo159298@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <002a01c5614d$7fbff5f0$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>

The "smack it" advice is ill placed.  While it will probably stop the casual
"next owner" from using the disk, any police force (or anyone else for that
matter) can hire a firm to just remove the disk platter and have it read.  

If the platter itself isn't destroyed, then scrambling the data is required.
Any of the good programs will write alternating ones and zeros in every bit
position N times which will scramble the data.  The US government has
specified N for government drives being wiped.

John W. Colby
www.ColbyConsulting.com 

Contribute your unused CPU cycles to a good cause:
http://folding.stanford.edu/

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:07 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive


Hi Jeff,
I have similar requests from accountants, financial planners, etc.

If they're just disposing of them:
If you have a bunch of PCs then buy one of those huge-electro magnets from
the hardware store or radio shack. Takes a few seconds per unit. Otherwise,
if you only have a couple remove the hard drive and smack it dead center
with a hammer. It takes less than five minutes.

Your customer will be impressed with your thoroughness, and as a byproduct,
it alleviates job related stress. :o)



-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Barrows
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:23 AM
To: Dba-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive

I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard
drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and
wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com _______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com





From chizotz at mchsi.com  Wed May 25 12:34:36 2005
From: chizotz at mchsi.com (chizotz at mchsi.com)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 17:34:36 +0000
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
Message-ID: <052520051734.1201.4294B72B000D9DA8000004B12197912995969B019607080C@mchsi.com>

Jeff,

Well... I think that you can do easy and inexpensive, but not quick :)

There are many utilities available to do this, some free some not. FWIW I use 
Clean Disk Security http://www.theabsolute.net/sware/clndisk.html which is $25 
and is easy to use and has been reliable for me (at least as far as I know, it 
hasn't trashed any systems and as far as I can tell it works as advertised).

As I understand it, the US government specifies, or did at one time, that data 
must be overwritten 7 times to be irretrievable. Others say 35 times (Gutman) 
is what's really needed. I suppose it depends on how secure you want the disk 
to be. If the goal is simply to prevent a typical user who buys the disk from 
retrieving the data, I'd say that 1 pass is probably enough. A format doesn't 
really delete or overwrite anything, but overwriting the whole disk with a 1 
or 0 will prevent anyone without special tools from retrieving any data. But 
if you want to prevent someone with the special tools and the know-how from 
getting the data, you'll need to do at least 7 passes, maybe more.

And it will take a long time to run on each drive, hours or even days if the 
drive is large and you're doing 35 passes.

Good luck,

Ron



> I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard 
> drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and 
> wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by 
> anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I was 
> wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
>  
> TIA
>  
>  
> Jeff Barrows
> MCP, MCAD, MCSD
>  
> Outbak Technologies, LLC
> Racine, WI
> jeff at outbaktech.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


From drboz at pacbell.net  Wed May 25 12:44:32 2005
From: drboz at pacbell.net (Don Bozarth)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 10:44:32 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
References: <002a01c5614d$7fbff5f0$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
Message-ID: <001c01c56151$69024990$6401a8c0@don>

The Norton System Works package has a ditty called "Wipe Info" that uses the
DoD method (7 steps) for "cleaning" a hard disk.

Don B.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John W. Colby" <jwcolby at colbyconsulting.com>
To: "'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'"
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:16 AM
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive


> The "smack it" advice is ill placed.  While it will probably stop the
casual
> "next owner" from using the disk, any police force (or anyone else for
that
> matter) can hire a firm to just remove the disk platter and have it read.
>
> If the platter itself isn't destroyed, then scrambling the data is
required.
> Any of the good programs will write alternating ones and zeros in every
bit
> position N times which will scramble the data.  The US government has
> specified N for government drives being wiped.
>
> John W. Colby
> www.ColbyConsulting.com
>
> Contribute your unused CPU cycles to a good cause:
> http://folding.stanford.edu/
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:07 PM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
>
>
> Hi Jeff,
> I have similar requests from accountants, financial planners, etc.
>
> If they're just disposing of them:
> If you have a bunch of PCs then buy one of those huge-electro magnets from
> the hardware store or radio shack. Takes a few seconds per unit.
Otherwise,
> if you only have a couple remove the hard drive and smack it dead center
> with a hammer. It takes less than five minutes.
>
> Your customer will be impressed with your thoroughness, and as a
byproduct,
> it alleviates job related stress. :o)
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Barrows
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:23 AM
> To: Dba-Tech
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
>
> I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a
hard
> drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware
and
> wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
> anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
> was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
>
> TIA
>
>
> Jeff Barrows
> MCP, MCAD, MCSD
>
> Outbak Technologies, LLC
> Racine, WI
> jeff at outbaktech.com _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>




From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 12:58:24 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 12:58:24 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <002a01c5614d$7fbff5f0$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
Message-ID: <200505251758.j4PHwPM3367528@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

Of course you are correct that in the most extreme examples of want/need
data can be recovered from most damaged media however, he did state quick,
easy, inexpensive. If you hit it good it damages all the platters. I've
taken them apart to check. (There used to be a web site on this that some
joker put up.) And once you have it out you certainly aren't going to put it
back in! If recycling this for another user then smacking is not a very good
idea - as the hard drive won't work :o)))

>From my experience running a wipe program takes a couple of hours to run.
That's not quick and what's the point if its just going to be discarded?


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John W. Colby
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 12:16 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive

The "smack it" advice is ill placed.  While it will probably stop the casual
"next owner" from using the disk, any police force (or anyone else for that
matter) can hire a firm to just remove the disk platter and have it read.  

If the platter itself isn't destroyed, then scrambling the data is required.
Any of the good programs will write alternating ones and zeros in every bit
position N times which will scramble the data.  The US government has
specified N for government drives being wiped.

John W. Colby
www.ColbyConsulting.com 

Contribute your unused CPU cycles to a good cause:
http://folding.stanford.edu/

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:07 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive


Hi Jeff,
I have similar requests from accountants, financial planners, etc.

If they're just disposing of them:
If you have a bunch of PCs then buy one of those huge-electro magnets from
the hardware store or radio shack. Takes a few seconds per unit. Otherwise,
if you only have a couple remove the hard drive and smack it dead center
with a hammer. It takes less than five minutes.

Your customer will be impressed with your thoroughness, and as a byproduct,
it alleviates job related stress. :o)



-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Barrows
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:23 AM
To: Dba-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive

I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard
drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and
wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com _______________________________________________
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
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From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 13:20:19 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 13:20:19 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <002a01c5614d$7fbff5f0$6c7aa8c0@ColbyM6805>
Message-ID: <200505251820.j4PIKKM3041748@pimout2-ext.prodigy.net>

I wrote that somewhat tongue in cheek too. Obviously you aren't going into
some corporate office and start smashing things! Especially when you're a
MCP, MCAD, MCSD.

However at the small business/SOHO setting this may be OK. I have a friendly
relationship with many of my clients where I can do this kind of thing and
not get replaced :o)


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John W. Colby
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 12:16 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive

The "smack it" advice is ill placed.  While it will probably stop the casual
"next owner" from using the disk, any police force (or anyone else for that
matter) can hire a firm to just remove the disk platter and have it read.  

If the platter itself isn't destroyed, then scrambling the data is required.
Any of the good programs will write alternating ones and zeros in every bit
position N times which will scramble the data.  The US government has
specified N for government drives being wiped.

John W. Colby
www.ColbyConsulting.com 

Contribute your unused CPU cycles to a good cause:
http://folding.stanford.edu/

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:07 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive


Hi Jeff,
I have similar requests from accountants, financial planners, etc.

If they're just disposing of them:
If you have a bunch of PCs then buy one of those huge-electro magnets from
the hardware store or radio shack. Takes a few seconds per unit. Otherwise,
if you only have a couple remove the hard drive and smack it dead center
with a hammer. It takes less than five minutes.

Your customer will be impressed with your thoroughness, and as a byproduct,
it alleviates job related stress. :o)



-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jeff Barrows
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:23 AM
To: Dba-Tech
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive

I am looking for a quick, easy, inexpensive way to wipe ALL data from a hard
drive.  A local non-profit business has recently replaced their hardware and
wants to be sure that their data on the old machines is not retrievable by
anyone before they dispose of them.  I could format each hard drive, but I
was wondering if anyone here had a better idea.
 
TIA
 
 
Jeff Barrows
MCP, MCAD, MCSD
 
Outbak Technologies, LLC
Racine, WI
jeff at outbaktech.com _______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
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http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



_______________________________________________
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Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From djkr at msn.com  Wed May 25 13:40:06 2005
From: djkr at msn.com (DJK(John) Robinson)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 19:40:06 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <200505251422.j4PEM5sk043194@pimout1-ext.prodigy.net>
Message-ID: <BAY106-DAV214E1A500223B7012681E8D20E0@phx.gbl>

I use Sophos on all my PCs.  Currently licensed for 10 PCs for 3 years.
(Consumers with single PCs are not their target market.)

Why Sophos?  Because they -
- are always bang up to date (once a day is NOT often enough, as some people
on the AccessD list discovered awhile back)
- never give time-wasting false positives 
- just work, silently and efficiently
- never cause me any problems 
- have free 24/365 support (which I have never needed)

And I or my clients over the years have had problems of one sort or another
with Norton and McAfee (and others); these problems are boring and
time-wasting.  Sophos may cost a bit more, but it saves me money!  And no, I
don't work for them, etc.

John


> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com 
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of 
> John Bartow
> Sent: 25 May 2005 15:22
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, 
> who do we notlike?
> 
> 
> I got their trial software a couple of years ago but t was 
> cost prohibitive for small businesses. I signed up for their 
> email virus updates. I still get them - at the rate of 2-3 per day!
> 
> John B.
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:05 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, 
> who do we notlike?
> 
> I've heard of them, but never to the extent of anyone saying 
> that they were good or bad.
> 
> Sorry, no help there :-)
> 
> 
> Jon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 15:02
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, 
> who do we notlike?
> 
> 
> Do any of you use Sophos? (IIRC they are based in the UK)
> 
> 
> John B.
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:48 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, 
> who do we notlike?
> 
> McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week 
> and last week... I don't know why.
> 
> 
> Jon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, 
> who do we not like?
> 
> 
> I use CA's eTrust.
> 
> It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with 
> it! The deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus 
> definitions every day as opposed to Symantec which only 
> updates it live update definitions once a week (unless there 
> is a sever outbreak). Symantec does have a daily update of 
> its intelligent updater but that must be applied manually.
> 
> JR
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who 
> do we not like?
> 
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
> 
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that 
> my subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed 
> to renew. OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I 
> click the Renew Now button thing and it comes up and tells me 
> that NAV 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 
> 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they had 
> issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - 
> plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in 
> stores for less than that.
> 
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton 
> Internet Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the 
> NAV 2004 - and while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, 
> the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use 
> that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is expiring 
> is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of 
> protection as I can get.
> 
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - 
> uses McAfee. That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has 
> changed over from Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
> 
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software 
> because I will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not 
> sure what direction to go.
> 
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com 
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> 
> This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to 
> TNCO, Inc. and intended solely for the addressee. It may 
> contain information which is covered by legal, professional, 
> or other privileges. If you are not the intended addressee, 
> or someone authorized by the intended addressee to receive 
> transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you must not 
> retain, disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in 
> reliance on this transmission. If you have received this 
> transmission in error, please notify the sender as soon as 
> possible and destroy this message. While TNCO, Inc. uses 
> virus protection, the recipient should check this email and 
> any attachments for the presence of viruses. TNCO, Inc. 
> accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus 
> transmitted by this email. 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com 
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also 
> be legally privileged. The contents are intended for 
> recipient only and are subject to the legal notice available 
> on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk ALcontrol 
> Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited. 
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, 
> Rotherham, S60 1BZ. Registered in England and Wales No 
> 4057291 _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com 
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com 
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also 
> be legally privileged. The contents are intended for 
> recipient only and are subject to the legal notice available 
> on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk ALcontrol 
> Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited. 
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, 
> Rotherham, S60 1BZ. Registered in England and Wales No 
> 4057291 _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com 
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com 
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 


From tinanfields at torchlake.com  Wed May 25 14:45:15 2005
From: tinanfields at torchlake.com (Tina Norris Fields)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:45:15 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
	like?
References: <001e01c56111$001b61e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<aea6c49505052506073acb9026@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4294D5CB.9040004@torchlake.com>

Gary,

Some while back I abandoned Norton (I think it was about the time their 
live update got infected, thus infecting several thousands of their 
customers).  I abandoned McAfee over price issues and the tendency to 
install stuff I really didn't want.  For the last three years I have 
been using F-Prot (dumb name, I know) by a fellow named Frisk in 
Reykjavick, Iceland (now Frisk International Software).  I buy a 
10-computer license every year, keep it updated by checking regularly 
(can have it set to do that automatically, but - hey, I prefer a stick 
shift to an automatic, too).  I first heard of it while researching how 
to properly disinfect a pc - somebody (could have been on this list) 
mentioned the best site he had ever seen on straightforward instructions 
for just about any infection (um, if I can find that link I'll post it 
later) - I went there, printed out the instructions, learned of F-Prot 
and went looking.  The program is easy to use, has a clean simple 
interface, and works very well - without insisting on running everything 
for me.

There - my 2 cents' worth,

Tina

Gary Kjos wrote:

>Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
>Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my
>subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
>OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now
>button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been
>DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing
>people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
>did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have
>seen it in stores for less than that.
>
>I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet
>Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and
>while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus
>hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail
>though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so
>I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
>The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
>That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from
>Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
>So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 2005 - or
>other versions or even other companies software because I will need to
>be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction to go.
>
>  
>




From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 15:46:34 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:46:34 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <BAY106-DAV214E1A500223B7012681E8D20E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <200505252046.j4PKkZon351934@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

Thanks for the info!

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of DJK(John)
Robinson
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 1:40 PM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

I use Sophos on all my PCs.  Currently licensed for 10 PCs for 3 years.
(Consumers with single PCs are not their target market.)

Why Sophos?  Because they -
- are always bang up to date (once a day is NOT often enough, as some people
on the AccessD list discovered awhile back)
- never give time-wasting false positives
- just work, silently and efficiently
- never cause me any problems
- have free 24/365 support (which I have never needed)

And I or my clients over the years have had problems of one sort or another
with Norton and McAfee (and others); these problems are boring and
time-wasting.  Sophos may cost a bit more, but it saves me money!  And no, I
don't work for them, etc.

John


> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John 
> Bartow
> Sent: 25 May 2005 15:22
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we 
> notlike?
> 
> 
> I got their trial software a couple of years ago but t was cost 
> prohibitive for small businesses. I signed up for their email virus 
> updates. I still get them - at the rate of 2-3 per day!
> 
> John B.
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:05 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we 
> notlike?
> 
> I've heard of them, but never to the extent of anyone saying that they 
> were good or bad.
> 
> Sorry, no help there :-)
> 
> 
> Jon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Bartow [mailto:john at winhaven.net]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 15:02
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we 
> notlike?
> 
> 
> Do any of you use Sophos? (IIRC they are based in the UK)
> 
> 
> John B.
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 8:48 AM
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we 
> notlike?
> 
> McAfee have been updating theirs almost every day this week and last 
> week... I don't know why.
> 
> 
> Jon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Joe Rojas [mailto:JRojas at tnco-inc.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:46
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we 
> not like?
> 
> 
> I use CA's eTrust.
> 
> It's lightweight and cheap. I have been very satisfied with it! The 
> deciding factor for me is that CA updates it virus definitions every 
> day as opposed to Symantec which only updates it live update 
> definitions once a week (unless there is a sever outbreak). Symantec 
> does have a daily update of its intelligent updater but that must be 
> applied manually.
> 
> JR
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:07 AM
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not 
> like?
> 
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
> 
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my 
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew. 
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been 
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to
> 2005 version. I recall hearing people indicate that they had issues 
> with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - plus they want 
> $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in stores for less than that.
> 
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet 
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and 
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus 
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail 
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so 
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
> 
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee. 
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from 
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
> 
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software because I 
> will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction 
> to go.
> 
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> 
> This electronic transmission is strictly confidential to TNCO, Inc. 
> and intended solely for the addressee. It may contain information 
> which is covered by legal, professional, or other privileges. If you 
> are not the intended addressee, or someone authorized by the intended 
> addressee to receive transmissions on behalf of the addressee, you 
> must not retain, disclose in any form, copy, or take any action in 
> reliance on this transmission. If you have received this transmission 
> in error, please notify the sender as soon as possible and destroy 
> this message. While TNCO, Inc. uses virus protection, the recipient 
> should check this email and any attachments for the presence of 
> viruses. TNCO, Inc.
> accepts no liability for any damage caused by any virus transmitted by 
> this email.
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally 
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are 
> subject to the legal notice available on request from : 
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division 
> of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 
> 1BZ. Registered in England and Wales No
> 4057291 _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally 
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are 
> subject to the legal notice available on request from : 
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division 
> of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 
> 1BZ. Registered in England and Wales No
> 4057291 _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From stuart at lexacorp.com.pg  Wed May 25 16:29:55 2005
From: stuart at lexacorp.com.pg (Stuart McLachlan)
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 07:29:55 +1000
Subject: [dba-Tech] Wiping ALL data from a hard drive
In-Reply-To: <E2FBF0A51D2A324C90BA16C566366A6D0D910B@belgarion.Outbak.local>
Message-ID: <42957AF3.29159.4D324B7@stuart.lexacorp.com.pg>

On 25 May 2005 at 10:23, Jeff Barrows wrote:

quick, easy, inexpensive way 

It's the old story - pick any two :-(

It also depends on the end purpose. Do the disks need to be re-usede or 
will they be junked?


For re-use - 
IF you can drop the quick - any of the free diskwipe tools mentioned by 
others.
If you can frop the inexpensive - a humungous electro magnet

For "junking"
If you can drop the easy - smash them open with a sledge hammer and 
pulverise the platters.

.

-- 
Stuart




From kathryn at bassett.net  Wed May 25 16:30:23 2005
From: kathryn at bassett.net (Kathryn Bassett)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 14:30:23 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A3A@ALCUXB>
Message-ID: <20050525213025.A5FD84000E@omta16.mta.everyone.net>

I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years I've used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need for it. I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.

--
Kathryn Rhinehart Bassett (Pasadena CA)
"Genealogy is my bag" "GH is my soap"
kathryn at bassett.net
http://bassett.net   

> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com 
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 6:16 am
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, 
> who do we notlike?
> 
> I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in 
> conjunction with ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus 
> products, I don't like their firewall. ZoneAlarm has no 
> issues with McAfee anymore, they fixed that within two days 
> of discovering the compatibility problem. I've been using 
> McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically check out 
> my pc with Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, 
> and it always comes up blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to 
> recommend McAfee. But make sure you just buy the virusscan, 
> and not the firewall too.
> 
> 
> Jon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who 
> do we not like?
> 
> 
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
> 
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that 
> my subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the 
> Renew Now button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 
> 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 
> version. I recall hearing people indicate that they had 
> issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue - 
> plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in 
> stores for less than that.
> 
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton 
> Internet Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the 
> NAV 2004 - and while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, 
> the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use 
> that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is expiring 
> is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of 
> protection as I can get.
> 
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over 
> from Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
> 
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV 
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software 
> because I will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not 
> sure what direction to go.
> 
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> 
> 
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and 
> are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from : 
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, 
> Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From jon at tydda.plus.com  Wed May 25 16:31:16 2005
From: jon at tydda.plus.com (Jon Tydda)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 22:31:16 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <20050525213025.A5FD84000E@omta16.mta.everyone.net>
Message-ID: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDOEIICGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>

Yeah, to prove it, I've just run trojan hunter and trend micro's sysclean
(just to check for myself too) and they've both come up clean.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Kathryn
Bassett
Sent: 25 May 2005 22:30
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?


I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years I've
used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need for it.
I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.

--
Kathryn Rhinehart Bassett (Pasadena CA)
"Genealogy is my bag" "GH is my soap"
kathryn at bassett.net
http://bassett.net

> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 6:16 am
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like,
> who do we notlike?
>
> I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in
> conjunction with ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus
> products, I don't like their firewall. ZoneAlarm has no
> issues with McAfee anymore, they fixed that within two days
> of discovering the compatibility problem. I've been using
> McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically check out
> my pc with Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side,
> and it always comes up blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to
> recommend McAfee. But make sure you just buy the virusscan,
> and not the firewall too.
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who
> do we not like?
>
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that
> my subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the
> Renew Now button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV
> 2000 has been DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005
> version. I recall hearing people indicate that they had
> issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and did not continue -
> plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have seen it in
> stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton
> Internet Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the
> NAV 2004 - and while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall,
> the 2004 Antivirus hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use
> that machind for E-Mail though. The machine that is expiring
> is my main e-mail machine and so I do need as good of
> protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over
> from Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software
> because I will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not
> sure what direction to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and
> are subject
> to the legal notice available on request from :
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close,
> Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From fhtapia at gmail.com  Wed May 25 17:20:36 2005
From: fhtapia at gmail.com (Francisco Tapia)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 15:20:36 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDOEIICGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>
References: <20050525213025.A5FD84000E@omta16.mta.everyone.net>
	<HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDOEIICGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>
Message-ID: <b874372a050525152010313268@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/25/05, Jon Tydda <jon at tydda.plus.com> wrote:
> Yeah, to prove it, I've just run trojan hunter and trend micro's sysclean
> (just to check for myself too) and they've both come up clean.
> 
> 
> Jon
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Kathryn
> Bassett
> Sent: 25 May 2005 22:30
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
> notlike?
> 
> 
> I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years I've
> used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need for it.
> I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.
> 

It's the typical YMMV.  I remember McAfee from back in the days of
Network Associates and having it run a typical boot scan before win
3.1 would even boot up... But even tho here at work we went from NAV
to McAfee 4.6 and now we're up to 8, I continue to find that many
people's machines continue to get infected reguardless... and From my
own experiance a Full Disk Scan is not a full disk scan.. I run a
defrag software called dirms which moves all fragmented files on the
disk... often times the McAfee onAccess will fire off because the
dirms software is attempting to defrag a trojan file on the disk. 
McAfee should have caught this file at the gate and prevented it from
ever loading... I'm much more secure now-a-days.. ie, running IE only
when absoutly necessary. I keep a firewall on my pc at all times. 
Here at work whenever someone would be caught w/ a virus I
automatically went to TrendMicro's HouseCall.. now that I'm Trying out
NOD32, it IS a great product. it's lightweight, scan your entire disk,
has an internet/ms document/onaccess monitor... scheduler etc.



-- 
-Francisco
http://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!
http://sqlthis.blogspot.com | Tsql and More...


From john at winhaven.net  Wed May 25 17:27:25 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 17:27:25 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <HAELJOBEJAIGMIEGGPPDOEIICGAA.jon@tydda.plus.com>
Message-ID: <200505252227.j4PMRQPA116858@pimout4-ext.prodigy.net>

Consider yourselves lucky.

I used McAfee for years and when NAI bought them I got frustrated with the
conglomerated mess they put together, the uninstalls no longer worked and it
was just a royal PITA. So be it, I moved to use different products in
different circumstances. In the following years I didn't run into McAfee
much other than when it had caused grief or someone wanted something else.
It was still a pain to uninstall. Last year I took on a new small business
client with about 15 PCs and half a dozen Macs. One of the few legal
multi-pack software they ran was McAfee. I concentrated on getting them
working correctly and getting them legal. (I didn't hate McAfee, I just
didn't recommend it, so replacing it wasn't on my agenda.) Last fall they
got viruses. We checked the whole system and they should have been up to
date with McAfee's dat, etc. They were. They still got the viruses. None of
my other clients got a virus -zero, zilch, none. And I have at least 5
different AVs going in that regards: NAV, eTrust, EZ-AV, AVG, Panda,
F-secure. They asked me to replace McAfee for them when I told them that. CA
eTrust went in. One positive, McAffee uninstalled much better than it had
been doing in the previous versions :o) About a month later McAfee announced
they were going to change the way the did DAT updates.

I don't trust any company/brand. I look at it as an ongoing test of
dependability and performance. McAfee and now Symantec have failed.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck in your choices,

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 4:31 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

Yeah, to prove it, I've just run trojan hunter and trend micro's sysclean
(just to check for myself too) and they've both come up clean.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Kathryn Bassett
Sent: 25 May 2005 22:30
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?


I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years I've
used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need for it.
I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.

--
Kathryn Rhinehart Bassett (Pasadena CA)
"Genealogy is my bag" "GH is my soap"
kathryn at bassett.net
http://bassett.net

> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 6:16 am
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we 
> notlike?
>
> I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in conjunction 
> with ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus products, I don't like 
> their firewall. ZoneAlarm has no issues with McAfee anymore, they 
> fixed that within two days of discovering the compatibility problem. 
> I've been using McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically 
> check out my pc with Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, 
> and it always comes up blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to recommend 
> McAfee. But make sure you just buy the virusscan, and not the firewall 
> too.
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not 
> like?
>
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my 
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been 
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing 
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and 
> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have 
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet 
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and 
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus 
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail 
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so 
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from 
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software because I 
> will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction 
> to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally 
> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are 
> subject to the legal notice available on request from :
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 
> 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From andrew.haslett at ilc.gov.au  Wed May 25 21:08:49 2005
From: andrew.haslett at ilc.gov.au (Haslett, Andrew)
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 11:38:49 +0930
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
Message-ID: <0A870603A2A816459078203FC07F4CD2604A10@adl01s055.ilcorp.gov.au>

We use McAffee linked up with Epolicy Orchestrator - 100 odd machines -
never had a problem. 

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Thursday, 26 May 2005 7:57 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

Consider yourselves lucky.

I used McAfee for years and when NAI bought them I got frustrated with
the conglomerated mess they put together, the uninstalls no longer
worked and it was just a royal PITA. So be it, I moved to use different
products in different circumstances. In the following years I didn't run
into McAfee much other than when it had caused grief or someone wanted
something else.
It was still a pain to uninstall. Last year I took on a new small
business client with about 15 PCs and half a dozen Macs. One of the few
legal multi-pack software they ran was McAfee. I concentrated on getting
them working correctly and getting them legal. (I didn't hate McAfee, I
just didn't recommend it, so replacing it wasn't on my agenda.) Last
fall they got viruses. We checked the whole system and they should have
been up to date with McAfee's dat, etc. They were. They still got the
viruses. None of my other clients got a virus -zero, zilch, none. And I
have at least 5 different AVs going in that regards: NAV, eTrust, EZ-AV,
AVG, Panda, F-secure. They asked me to replace McAfee for them when I
told them that. CA eTrust went in. One positive, McAffee uninstalled
much better than it had been doing in the previous versions :o) About a
month later McAfee announced they were going to change the way the did
DAT updates.

I don't trust any company/brand. I look at it as an ongoing test of
dependability and performance. McAfee and now Symantec have failed.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck in your choices,

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 4:31 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

Yeah, to prove it, I've just run trojan hunter and trend micro's
sysclean (just to check for myself too) and they've both come up clean.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Kathryn
Bassett
Sent: 25 May 2005 22:30
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?


I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years
I've used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need
for it.
I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.

--
Kathryn Rhinehart Bassett (Pasadena CA)
"Genealogy is my bag" "GH is my soap"
kathryn at bassett.net
http://bassett.net

> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 6:16 am
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we

> notlike?
>
> I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in conjunction

> with ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus products, I don't like 
> their firewall. ZoneAlarm has no issues with McAfee anymore, they 
> fixed that within two days of discovering the compatibility problem.
> I've been using McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically 
> check out my pc with Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, 
> and it always comes up blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to recommend 
> McAfee. But make sure you just buy the virusscan, and not the firewall

> too.
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not

> like?
>
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my 
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been 
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing 
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and

> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have 
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet 
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and 
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus 
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail 
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so 
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from 
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software because I 
> will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction

> to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally

> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are 
> subject to the legal notice available on request from :
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 
> 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


IMPORTANT - PLEASE READ *** This email any any files transmitted with it are confidential and may contain information protected by law from disclosure. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your system. No warranty is given that this email or files, if attached to this email, are free from computer viruses or other defects. They are provided on the basis the user assumes all responsibility for loss, damage or consequence resulting directly or indirectly from their use, whether caused by the negligence of the sender or not.


From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Wed May 25 22:43:18 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 20:43:18 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
References: <0A870603A2A816459078203FC07F4CD2604A10@adl01s055.ilcorp.gov.au>
Message-ID: <429545D6.2040306@shaw.ca>

I use AVG for personal use, it is free, updates daily. Run in 
conjunction with MS Spyware
I am still trying to get rid of parts of McAfee, it has a phone home bit 
that isn't removed from the control panel
AVG
http://www.grisoft.com

Haslett, Andrew wrote:

>We use McAffee linked up with Epolicy Orchestrator - 100 odd machines -
>never had a problem. 
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
>Sent: Thursday, 26 May 2005 7:57 AM
>To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
>notlike?
>
>Consider yourselves lucky.
>
>I used McAfee for years and when NAI bought them I got frustrated with
>the conglomerated mess they put together, the uninstalls no longer
>worked and it was just a royal PITA. So be it, I moved to use different
>products in different circumstances. In the following years I didn't run
>into McAfee much other than when it had caused grief or someone wanted
>something else.
>It was still a pain to uninstall. Last year I took on a new small
>business client with about 15 PCs and half a dozen Macs. One of the few
>legal multi-pack software they ran was McAfee. I concentrated on getting
>them working correctly and getting them legal. (I didn't hate McAfee, I
>just didn't recommend it, so replacing it wasn't on my agenda.) Last
>fall they got viruses. We checked the whole system and they should have
>been up to date with McAfee's dat, etc. They were. They still got the
>viruses. None of my other clients got a virus -zero, zilch, none. And I
>have at least 5 different AVs going in that regards: NAV, eTrust, EZ-AV,
>AVG, Panda, F-secure. They asked me to replace McAfee for them when I
>told them that. CA eTrust went in. One positive, McAffee uninstalled
>much better than it had been doing in the previous versions :o) About a
>month later McAfee announced they were going to change the way the did
>DAT updates.
>
>I don't trust any company/brand. I look at it as an ongoing test of
>dependability and performance. McAfee and now Symantec have failed.
>
>I sincerely wish you the best of luck in your choices,
>
>John B.
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
>Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 4:31 PM
>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
>notlike?
>
>Yeah, to prove it, I've just run trojan hunter and trend micro's
>sysclean (just to check for myself too) and they've both come up clean.
>
>
>Jon
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Kathryn
>Bassett
>Sent: 25 May 2005 22:30
>To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
>notlike?
>
>
>I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years
>I've used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need
>for it.
>I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.
>
>--
>Kathryn Rhinehart Bassett (Pasadena CA)
>"Genealogy is my bag" "GH is my soap"
>kathryn at bassett.net
>http://bassett.net
>
>  
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
>>[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
>>Sent: 25 May 2005 6:16 am
>>To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
>>Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>notlike?
>>
>>I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in conjunction
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>with ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus products, I don't like 
>>their firewall. ZoneAlarm has no issues with McAfee anymore, they 
>>fixed that within two days of discovering the compatibility problem.
>>I've been using McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically 
>>check out my pc with Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, 
>>and it always comes up blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to recommend 
>>McAfee. But make sure you just buy the virusscan, and not the firewall
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>too.
>>
>>
>>Jon
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
>>Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
>>To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
>>Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>like?
>>
>>
>>Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>>
>>Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my 
>>subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
>>OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
>>button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been 
>>DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing 
>>people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have 
>>seen it in stores for less than that.
>>
>>I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet 
>>Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and 
>>while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus 
>>hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail 
>>though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so 
>>I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>>
>>The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
>>That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from 
>>Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>>
>>So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV
>>2005 - or other versions or even other companies software because I 
>>will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>to go.
>>
>>--
>>Gary Kjos
>>garykjos at gmail.com
>>_______________________________________________
>>dba-Tech mailing list
>>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>
>>
>>The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are 
>>subject to the legal notice available on request from :
>>webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
>>ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
>>Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 
>>1BZ.
>>Registered in England and Wales No 4057291 
>>_______________________________________________
>>dba-Tech mailing list
>>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>    
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>IMPORTANT - PLEASE READ *** This email any any files transmitted with it are confidential and may contain information protected by law from disclosure. If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender immediately and delete this email from your system. No warranty is given that this email or files, if attached to this email, are free from computer viruses or other defects. They are provided on the basis the user assumes all responsibility for loss, damage or consequence resulting directly or indirectly from their use, whether caused by the negligence of the sender or not.
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada




From fhtapia at gmail.com  Wed May 25 23:45:52 2005
From: fhtapia at gmail.com (Francisco Tapia)
Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 21:45:52 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <0A870603A2A816459078203FC07F4CD2604A10@adl01s055.ilcorp.gov.au>
References: <0A870603A2A816459078203FC07F4CD2604A10@adl01s055.ilcorp.gov.au>
Message-ID: <b874372a05052521452adbe03e@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/25/05, Haslett, Andrew <andrew.haslett at ilc.gov.au> wrote:
> We use McAffee linked up with Epolicy Orchestrator - 100 odd machines -
> never had a problem.
> 

When we had McAfee A/V 4.6 corp, we got slammed w/ the LSSA worm... we
lost over half a day of work...

We also got hit w/ that one that was triggerd from teh emptying the
recycling bin...
-- 
-Francisco
http://pcthis.blogspot.com |PC news with out the jargon!
http://sqlthis.blogspot.com | Tsql and More...


From john at winhaven.net  Thu May 26 00:29:42 2005
From: john at winhaven.net (John Bartow)
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 00:29:42 -0500
Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we notlike?
In-Reply-To: <0A870603A2A816459078203FC07F4CD2604A10@adl01s055.ilcorp.gov.au>
Message-ID: <200505260529.j4Q5Tioo293216@pimout3-ext.prodigy.net>

And I wish you continued success. I sincerely hope no one else has to deal
with problematic security software.

I just think it's a travesty that big companies like these release poorly
written software that it causes problems, crashes, won't uninstall, can't be
fixed unless you uninstall/reinstall it...

It says something about how they view their customers.

If one of us did that we'd be through!


John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Haslett, Andrew
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 9:09 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

We use McAffee linked up with Epolicy Orchestrator - 100 odd machines -
never had a problem. 

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of John Bartow
Sent: Thursday, 26 May 2005 7:57 AM
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

Consider yourselves lucky.

I used McAfee for years and when NAI bought them I got frustrated with the
conglomerated mess they put together, the uninstalls no longer worked and it
was just a royal PITA. So be it, I moved to use different products in
different circumstances. In the following years I didn't run into McAfee
much other than when it had caused grief or someone wanted something else.
It was still a pain to uninstall. Last year I took on a new small business
client with about 15 PCs and half a dozen Macs. One of the few legal
multi-pack software they ran was McAfee. I concentrated on getting them
working correctly and getting them legal. (I didn't hate McAfee, I just
didn't recommend it, so replacing it wasn't on my agenda.) Last fall they
got viruses. We checked the whole system and they should have been up to
date with McAfee's dat, etc. They were. They still got the viruses. None of
my other clients got a virus -zero, zilch, none. And I have at least 5
different AVs going in that regards: NAV, eTrust, EZ-AV, AVG, Panda,
F-secure. They asked me to replace McAfee for them when I told them that. CA
eTrust went in. One positive, McAffee uninstalled much better than it had
been doing in the previous versions :o) About a month later McAfee announced
they were going to change the way the did DAT updates.

I don't trust any company/brand. I look at it as an ongoing test of
dependability and performance. McAfee and now Symantec have failed.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck in your choices,

John B.


-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 4:31 PM
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?

Yeah, to prove it, I've just run trojan hunter and trend micro's sysclean
(just to check for myself too) and they've both come up clean.


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Kathryn Bassett
Sent: 25 May 2005 22:30
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we
notlike?


I could have written Jon's message. I've lost track of how many years I've
used McAfee -it's been as long as there has been an internet need for it.
I've *never* had an infection. I also use SpyBot and AdAware.

--
Kathryn Rhinehart Bassett (Pasadena CA)
"Genealogy is my bag" "GH is my soap"
kathryn at bassett.net
http://bassett.net

> -----Original Message-----
> From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Jon Tydda
> Sent: 25 May 2005 6:16 am
> To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
> Subject: RE: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we

> notlike?
>
> I have a fully licenced copy of McAfee VirusScan 9, run in conjunction

> with ZoneAlarm Pro. I like McAfee's anti virus products, I don't like 
> their firewall. ZoneAlarm has no issues with McAfee anymore, they 
> fixed that within two days of discovering the compatibility problem.
> I've been using McAfee for 8 years with no problems. I periodically 
> check out my pc with Panda online scan, just to be on the safe side, 
> and it always comes up blank. I'd be perfectly hapy to recommend 
> McAfee. But make sure you just buy the virusscan, and not the firewall

> too.
>
>
> Jon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Kjos [mailto:garykjos at gmail.com]
> Sent: 25 May 2005 14:07
> To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
> Subject: [dba-Tech] Antivirus Software - Who do we like, who do we not

> like?
>
>
> Hi all,  I'm looking for opinions here.
>
> Got a message from my Norton Antivirus 2000 this morning that my 
> subscription for updates was about to expire and I needed to renew.
> OK, no big deal, let's to it right now..... so I click the Renew Now 
> button thing and it comes up and tells me that NAV 2000 has been 
> DISCONTINUED and I have to upgrade to 2005 version. I recall hearing 
> people indicate that they had issues with NAV 2005 so I backed out and

> did not continue - plus they want $39.95 to upgrade. I know I have 
> seen it in stores for less than that.
>
> I've been a faithfull NAV user for many years. I have Norton Internet 
> Securiity 2004 on another machine which includes the NAV 2004 - and 
> while I have come to HATE the Norton Firewall, the 2004 Antivirus 
> hasn't caused me any grief. I don't use that machind for E-Mail 
> though. The machine that is expiring is my main e-mail machine and so 
> I do need as good of protection as I can get.
>
> The most recent machine I bought - a Notebook from Dell - uses McAfee.
> That's just what it came with. So maybe Dell has changed over from 
> Norton to McAffee on their new machines?
>
> So, please post your stories of horror or success with NAV
> 2005 - or other versions or even other companies software because I 
> will need to be making a purchase soon and I'm not sure what direction

> to go.
>
> --
> Gary Kjos
> garykjos at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
> The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally

> privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are 
> subject to the legal notice available on request from :
> webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
> ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
> Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 
> 1BZ.
> Registered in England and Wales No 4057291 
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


IMPORTANT - PLEASE READ *** This email any any files transmitted with it are
confidential and may contain information protected by law from disclosure.
If you have received this message in error, please notify the sender
immediately and delete this email from your system. No warranty is given
that this email or files, if attached to this email, are free from computer
viruses or other defects. They are provided on the basis the user assumes
all responsibility for loss, damage or consequence resulting directly or
indirectly from their use, whether caused by the negligence of the sender or
not.
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From bheid at appdevgrp.com  Thu May 26 09:26:19 2005
From: bheid at appdevgrp.com (Bobby Heid)
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 10:26:19 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] FW: [H] Exchange server 5.5 mail problems
Message-ID: <916187228923D311A6FE00A0CC3FAA30ABEBA4@ADGSERVER>

Hey,

We are a small, 4 person shop.  We have Exchange Server (ES) 5.5.  We use an
ISP for outgoing and incoming mail.  The ES allows us to manage the email
centrally and to send each other mail without it going out first.

Well, starting about a month or so ago, our clients were not receiving some
of our emails.  I would send an email home and sometimes it would get there
and sometimes it would not (with and w/o attachments).

So I proceed to bounce the server.  A flood of e-mails went out!  Before
bouncing the server, the output queues were empty on the ES.  Bouncing the
server seems to release any "stuck" emails.

Anyone have any idea as to what may be going on?

The ES is running on an aging NT 4.0 server.

Thanks,
Bobby



From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Thu May 26 09:30:14 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 15:30:14 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] FW: [H] Exchange server 5.5 mail problems
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A54@ALCUXB>

I get that too sometimes... the trick is to not bounce the server, but stop
and restart all the exchange related services... you save a bit of downtime
that way. We haven't figured out why it does it, but our best guess is that
it's an old aging NT4 server with way too much stuff on it... it's creaking
at the seams some days. I try and keep it windows updated as far as I can,
but it's not always possible. Especially as it's our main file/print/mail
server in this site, and a BDC on the domain... they don't like me bouncing
it unless it's strictly necessary.

HTH


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Bobby Heid [mailto:bheid at appdevgrp.com]
Sent: 26 May 2005 15:26
To: 'Discussion of Hardware and Software issues'
Subject: [dba-Tech] FW: [H] Exchange server 5.5 mail problems


Hey,

We are a small, 4 person shop.  We have Exchange Server (ES) 5.5.  We use an
ISP for outgoing and incoming mail.  The ES allows us to manage the email
centrally and to send each other mail without it going out first.

Well, starting about a month or so ago, our clients were not receiving some
of our emails.  I would send an email home and sometimes it would get there
and sometimes it would not (with and w/o attachments).

So I proceed to bounce the server.  A flood of e-mails went out!  Before
bouncing the server, the output queues were empty on the ES.  Bouncing the
server seems to release any "stuck" emails.

Anyone have any idea as to what may be going on?

The ES is running on an aging NT 4.0 server.

Thanks,
Bobby

_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From shamil at users.mns.ru  Mon May 30 10:06:08 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 19:06:08 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
Message-ID: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

Hi All,

I'm getting W32.Mydoom.BT at mm viruses for several days from 195.167.69.130. 

The virus sender's e-mail address is simulating my provider's "services":
admin at mns.ru, service at mns.ru etc.
 
What are the most effective ways to stop these viruses sending?

Thank you,
Shamil

P.S.:

whois 195.167.69.130
     
% This is the RIPE Whois query server #1.
% The objects are in RPSL format.
%
% Note: the default output of the RIPE Whois server
% is changed. Your tools may need to be adjusted. See
% http://www.ripe.net/db/news/abuse-proposal-20050331.html
% for more details.
%
% Rights restricted by copyright.
% See http://www.ripe.net/db/copyright.html

% Note: This output has been filtered.
%       To receive output for a database update, use the "-B" flag.

% Information related to '195.167.69.0 - 195.167.69.255'

inetnum:      195.167.69.0 - 195.167.69.255
netname:      PROFILE-O
descr:        23 Praxitelous str
descr:        10562 ATHENS
country:      GR
admin-c:      CS1409-RIPE
tech-c:       GS1522-RIPE
status:       ASSIGNED PA
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered

person:       Ch Stasinopoulos
address:      23 Praxitelous str
address:      10562 ATHENS
address:      GR
phone:        +30-1-3315060
fax-no:       +30-1-3221268
nic-hdl:      CS1409-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered

person:       G Stamatopoulos
address:      23 Praxitelous str
address:      10562 ATHENS
address:      GR
phone:        +30-1-3315060
fax-no:       +30-1-3221268
nic-hdl:      GS1522-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered

% Information related to '195.167.0.0/17AS6799'

route:        195.167.0.0/17
descr:        OTEnet
origin:       AS6799
remarks:      OTEnet S.A. Multiprotocol Backbone & ISP
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
 



From carbonnb at gmail.com  Mon May 30 11:36:42 2005
From: carbonnb at gmail.com (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 12:36:42 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
In-Reply-To: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
References: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <e04a6c9205053009361aab8de5@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/30/05, Shamil Salakhetdinov <shamil at users.mns.ru> wrote:
> Hi All,
> 
> I'm getting W32.Mydoom.BT at mm viruses for several days from 195.167.69.130.
> 
> The virus sender's e-mail address is simulating my provider's "services":
> admin at mns.ru, service at mns.ru etc.
> 
> What are the most effective ways to stop these viruses sending?

If you can filter it at the server level, then that's the best way.

Failing that, contact you ISP, and send them the received header lines
from a couple of the virii, and ask them to block the IP.

Also, send an e-mail to:
noc at otenet.gr, abuse at otenet.gr, hostmaster at otenet.gr. postmaster at otennet.gr
with a few of the received headers as well and ask them to contact
thier client and inform them that they are sending out virii. Also ask
them if they could block this person until they have cleaned the virri
from their PC.

I have done this before and it has worked. Just make sure that you
send the recieved headers so they can trace it back to their system
and you are polite and non-confrontational.

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out,
shouting "What a great ride!"


From shamil at users.mns.ru  Mon May 30 12:33:29 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 21:33:29 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
References: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<e04a6c9205053009361aab8de5@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <003701c5653d$b288d710$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

Thank you, Bryan!

Yes, I have these messages headers - here are the two of them - all coming
from 195.167.69.130:

1.

>From Service at mns.ru  Thu May 26 12:10:30 2005
Received: from babylon5.mns.ru ([80.70.224.25])
  (TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,256bits,AES256-SHA)
  by batman.mns.ru with esmtp; Thu, 26 May 2005 12:10:30 +0400
  id 000104E8.42958476.00000419
Received: from mns.ru ([195.167.69.130])
  by babylon5.mns.ru with esmtp; Thu, 26 May 2005 12:10:20 +0400
  id 000182EF.4295846C.00005A64
From: Service at mns.ru
To: shamil-users at mns.ru
Subject: *IMPORTANT* Your Account Has Been Locked
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 11:11:48 +0300
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_2DB2B65A.C74339E8"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
Message-ID: <courier.42958476.00000419 at batman.mns.ru>
X-Spam-Status: Yes, hits=9.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=8.0
 tests=MICROSOFT_EXECUTABLE, MISSING_MIMEOLE, NO_REAL_NAME, PRIORITY_NO_NAME
X-Spam-Level: *********
X-Spam-Flag: YES

2.

>From Service at mns.ru  Thu May 26 14:43:37 2005
Received: from babylon5.mns.ru ([80.70.224.25])
  (TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,256bits,AES256-SHA)
  by batman.mns.ru with esmtp; Thu, 26 May 2005 14:43:36 +0400
  id 00004FF9.4295A858.00005A00
Received: from mns.ru ([195.167.69.130])
  by babylon5.mns.ru with esmtp; Thu, 26 May 2005 14:43:34 +0400
  id 0001C22B.4295A856.0000234A
From: Service at mns.ru
To: shamil-users at mns.ru
Subject: Your Email Account is Suspended For Security Reasons
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 13:45:02 +0300
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed;
 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_C8178C57.146A5279"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
Message-ID: <courier.4295A858.00005A00 at batman.mns.ru>
X-Spam-Status: No, hits=4.1 tagged_above=3.0 required=8.0 tests=HTML_00_10,
 MISSING_MIMEOLE, NO_REAL_NAME, PRIORITY_NO_NAME, UPPERCASE_25_50
X-Spam-Level: ****

I will try to inform  noc at otenet.gr, abuse at otenet.gr, hostmaster at otenet.gr.
postmaster at otennet.gr about the problem...

Shamil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bryan Carbonnell" <carbonnb at gmail.com>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues"
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 8:36 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from
195.167.69.130....


> On 5/30/05, Shamil Salakhetdinov <shamil at users.mns.ru> wrote:
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I'm getting W32.Mydoom.BT at mm viruses for several days from
195.167.69.130.
> >
> > The virus sender's e-mail address is simulating my provider's
"services":
> > admin at mns.ru, service at mns.ru etc.
> >
> > What are the most effective ways to stop these viruses sending?
>
> If you can filter it at the server level, then that's the best way.
>
> Failing that, contact you ISP, and send them the received header lines
> from a couple of the virii, and ask them to block the IP.
>
> Also, send an e-mail to:
> noc at otenet.gr, abuse at otenet.gr, hostmaster at otenet.gr.
postmaster at otennet.gr
> with a few of the received headers as well and ask them to contact
> thier client and inform them that they are sending out virii. Also ask
> them if they could block this person until they have cleaned the virri
> from their PC.
>
> I have done this before and it has worked. Just make sure that you
> send the recieved headers so they can trace it back to their system
> and you are polite and non-confrontational.
>
> -- 
> Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
> Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
> preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out,
> shouting "What a great ride!"
> _______________________________________________
> dba-Tech mailing list
> dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com



From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Mon May 30 15:22:03 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Mon, 30 May 2005 13:22:03 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
References: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
Message-ID: <429B75EB.7010502@shaw.ca>

Sounds like someone has borrowed your email address. if you are getting 
bounced viruses or spam reports.
I had this happen about 6 months ago and got 300 or so pieces of mail a day
Since my address was a large cross Canada ISP with a million users, 
nobody was going to blacklist it.
The blitz lasted about 2 1/2 weeks. I just ignored it.

One other way to deal with it, if you want to take out a big hammer.

http://news.com.com/When+a+lawyer+gets+hit+by+spammers%2C+expect+a+lawsuit/2100-1030_3-5723497.html?tag=nefd.pop


Shamil Salakhetdinov wrote:

>Hi All,
>
>I'm getting W32.Mydoom.BT at mm viruses for several days from 195.167.69.130. 
>
>The virus sender's e-mail address is simulating my provider's "services":
>admin at mns.ru, service at mns.ru etc.
> 
>What are the most effective ways to stop these viruses sending?
>
>Thank you,
>Shamil
>
>P.S.:
>
>whois 195.167.69.130
>     
>% This is the RIPE Whois query server #1.
>% The objects are in RPSL format.
>%
>% Note: the default output of the RIPE Whois server
>% is changed. Your tools may need to be adjusted. See
>% http://www.ripe.net/db/news/abuse-proposal-20050331.html
>% for more details.
>%
>% Rights restricted by copyright.
>% See http://www.ripe.net/db/copyright.html
>
>% Note: This output has been filtered.
>%       To receive output for a database update, use the "-B" flag.
>
>% Information related to '195.167.69.0 - 195.167.69.255'
>
>inetnum:      195.167.69.0 - 195.167.69.255
>netname:      PROFILE-O
>descr:        23 Praxitelous str
>descr:        10562 ATHENS
>country:      GR
>admin-c:      CS1409-RIPE
>tech-c:       GS1522-RIPE
>status:       ASSIGNED PA
>mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
>source:       RIPE # Filtered
>
>person:       Ch Stasinopoulos
>address:      23 Praxitelous str
>address:      10562 ATHENS
>address:      GR
>phone:        +30-1-3315060
>fax-no:       +30-1-3221268
>nic-hdl:      CS1409-RIPE
>mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
>source:       RIPE # Filtered
>
>person:       G Stamatopoulos
>address:      23 Praxitelous str
>address:      10562 ATHENS
>address:      GR
>phone:        +30-1-3315060
>fax-no:       +30-1-3221268
>nic-hdl:      GS1522-RIPE
>mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
>source:       RIPE # Filtered
>
>% Information related to '195.167.0.0/17AS6799'
>
>route:        195.167.0.0/17
>descr:        OTEnet
>origin:       AS6799
>remarks:      OTEnet S.A. Multiprotocol Backbone & ISP
>mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
>source:       RIPE # Filtered
> 
>
>_______________________________________________
>dba-Tech mailing list
>dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
>http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
>Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From carbonnb at gmail.com  Tue May 31 06:48:27 2005
From: carbonnb at gmail.com (Bryan Carbonnell)
Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 07:48:27 -0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
In-Reply-To: <429B75EB.7010502@shaw.ca>
References: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<429B75EB.7010502@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <e04a6c92050531044839b2a178@mail.gmail.com>

On 5/30/05, MartyConnelly <martyconnelly at shaw.ca> wrote:
> Sounds like someone has borrowed your email address. if you are getting
> bounced viruses or spam reports.
> I had this happen about 6 months ago and got 300 or so pieces of mail a day
> Since my address was a large cross Canada ISP with a million users,
> nobody was going to blacklist it.
> The blitz lasted about 2 1/2 weeks. I just ignored it.

True, very few people are going to blacklist an entire ISP, but Shamil
is/was receiving virii from a specific IP address.

I have had this happen before. With the received headers, I could
trace it back to a specific IP (and e-mail address) and armed with
that info, I contacted the offender and when that fell on deaf ears, I
contacted the offenders ISP.

They, the offenders ISP, blocked them for a while (it appeared that it
was in the order of several weeks) until the offender got their PC
cleaned up.

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out,
shouting "What a great ride!"


From Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk  Tue May 31 06:53:12 2005
From: Jon.Tydda at alcontrol.co.uk (Jon Tydda)
Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 12:53:12 +0100
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.13
	0....
Message-ID: <87C856B802C3D511B69B0002A5CD10EA9D2A73@ALCUXB>

One of my friends had that - despite being a fairly knowledgeable computer
literate bloke, he was running his pc on broadband with no firewall, no
anti-virus and without running windows update. One day he got a letter from
his ISP saying that his account was being disconnected until he cleaned his
pc up, which is when I got the job of fixing it. That took some doing...
Thank god for the online sites that don't need installers which can be
blocked...


Jon

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Carbonnell [mailto:carbonnb at gmail.com]
Sent: 31 May 2005 12:48
To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from
195.167.69.130....


On 5/30/05, MartyConnelly <martyconnelly at shaw.ca> wrote:
> Sounds like someone has borrowed your email address. if you are getting
> bounced viruses or spam reports.
> I had this happen about 6 months ago and got 300 or so pieces of mail a
day
> Since my address was a large cross Canada ISP with a million users,
> nobody was going to blacklist it.
> The blitz lasted about 2 1/2 weeks. I just ignored it.

True, very few people are going to blacklist an entire ISP, but Shamil
is/was receiving virii from a specific IP address.

I have had this happen before. With the received headers, I could
trace it back to a specific IP (and e-mail address) and armed with
that info, I contacted the offender and when that fell on deaf ears, I
contacted the offenders ISP.

They, the offenders ISP, blocked them for a while (it appeared that it
was in the order of several weeks) until the offender got their PC
cleaned up.

-- 
Bryan Carbonnell - carbonnb at gmail.com
Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well
preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out,
shouting "What a great ride!"
_______________________________________________
dba-Tech mailing list
dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com
http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech
Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com


The information in this e-mail is confidential and may also be legally
privileged. The contents are intended for recipient only and are subject
to the legal notice available on request from : webmaster at alcontrol.co.uk
ALcontrol Laboratories is a trading division of ALcontrol UK Limited.
Registered Office: Templeborough House, Mill Close, Rotherham, S60 1BZ.
Registered in England and Wales No 4057291


From martyconnelly at shaw.ca  Tue May 31 09:20:37 2005
From: martyconnelly at shaw.ca (MartyConnelly)
Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 07:20:37 -0700
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
References: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>
	<429B75EB.7010502@shaw.ca> <e04a6c92050531044839b2a178@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <429C72B5.8020700@shaw.ca>

Well if you track down that ip address 

195.167.69.130

through whois http://www.eventid.net/whois.asp
and then the ripe.net whois
You get to this isp site  in athens.
http://www.otenet.gr/english/index.htm

Abuse & Spam:   abuse at otenet.gr 


  Query the RIPE Whois Database
  Search for   

% This is the RIPE Whois query server #2.
% The objects are in RPSL format.
%
% Note: the default output of the RIPE Whois server
% is changed. Your tools may need to be adjusted. See
% http://www.ripe.net/db/news/abuse-proposal-20050331.html
% for more details.
%
% Rights restricted by copyright.
% See http://www.ripe.net/db/copyright.html
% Note: This output has been filtered.
%       To receive output for a database update, use the "-B" flag
% Information related to '195.167.69.0 - 195.167.69.255'
inetnum:      195.167.69.0 - 195.167.69.255
netname:      PROFILE-O
descr:        23 Praxitelous str
descr:        10562 ATHENS
country:      GR
admin-c:      CS1409-RIPE
tech-c:       GS1522-RIPE
status:       ASSIGNED PA
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
person:       Ch Stasinopoulos
address:      23 Praxitelous str
address:      10562 ATHENS
address:      GR
phone:        +30-1-3315060
fax-no:       +30-1-3221268
nic-hdl:      CS1409-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
person:       G Stamatopoulos
address:      23 Praxitelous str
address:      10562 ATHENS
address:      GR
phone:        +30-1-3315060
fax-no:       +30-1-3221268
nic-hdl:      GS1522-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
% Information related to '195.167.0.0/17AS6799'
route:        195.167.0.0/17
descr:        OTEnet
origin:       AS6799
remarks:      OTEnet S.A. Multiprotocol Backbone & ISP
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
Bold: Object type.
Underlined: Primary key(s).
Hyperlinks: Searchable Attributes.
 
 % Information related to 'OTENET-GR-MNT'
mntner:       OTENET-GR-MNT
descr:        OTEnet S.A.
descr:        Provider Local Registry
descr:        GR
admin-c:      CZ586-RIPE
tech-c:       AV323-RIPE
tech-c:       KK656-RIPE
upd-to:       koskar at otenet.gr
mnt-nfy:      hostmaster at otenet.gr
auth:         MD5-PW $1$WGf12NLy$S/5FNuPeVTs14UUxoM3i61
auth:         MD5-PW $1$wWvJCcm7$7WN21dLp1BfV9yrCVzcKI/
remarks:      +---------------------------------+
remarks:      |General enquiries: noc at otenet.gr |
remarks:      |Abuse & Spam:   abuse at otenet.gr  |
remarks:      |DNS & RIPE: hostmaster at otenet.gr |
remarks:      +---------------------------------+
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
referral-by:  RIPE-DBM-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
person:       Christos Zampiras
address:      OTEnet S.A.
address:      109 Kifissias Ave. & Sina Str.
address:      Maroussi 15124
address:      GR
phone:        +302106151961
fax-no:       +302106151900
e-mail:       xrizamp at otenet.gr
nic-hdl:      CZ586-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
person:       Achilles Voliotis
address:      OTEnet S.A.
address:      109 Kifissias Ave. & Sina Str.
address:      Maroussi 15124
address:      GR
phone:        +30-210-6151900
fax-no:       +30-210-6151900
e-mail:       achilles at otenet.gr
nic-hdl:      AV323-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered
person:       Karatheodorou Kostas
address:      Network Operation and Management Center - NOMC
address:      OTEnet SA
address:      OTE Building, 3rd floor
address:      47 Mpenaki Str. & Koletti Str.
address:      GR 10681, Athens GREECE
phone:        +30-210-6151600
fax-no:       +30-210-6151900
e-mail:       koskar at otenet.gr
nic-hdl:      KK656-RIPE
mnt-by:       OTENET-GR-MNT
source:       RIPE # Filtered

Bryan Carbonnell wrote:

>On 5/30/05, MartyConnelly <martyconnelly at shaw.ca> wrote:
>  
>
>>Sounds like someone has borrowed your email address. if you are getting
>>bounced viruses or spam reports.
>>I had this happen about 6 months ago and got 300 or so pieces of mail a day
>>Since my address was a large cross Canada ISP with a million users,
>>nobody was going to blacklist it.
>>The blitz lasted about 2 1/2 weeks. I just ignored it.
>>    
>>
>
>True, very few people are going to blacklist an entire ISP, but Shamil
>is/was receiving virii from a specific IP address.
>
>I have had this happen before. With the received headers, I could
>trace it back to a specific IP (and e-mail address) and armed with
>that info, I contacted the offender and when that fell on deaf ears, I
>contacted the offenders ISP.
>
>They, the offenders ISP, blocked them for a while (it appeared that it
>was in the order of several weeks) until the offender got their PC
>cleaned up.
>
>  
>

-- 
Marty Connelly
Victoria, B.C.
Canada





From shamil at users.mns.ru  Tue May 31 09:53:05 2005
From: shamil at users.mns.ru (Shamil Salakhetdinov)
Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 18:53:05 +0400
Subject: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from 195.167.69.130....
References: <002201c56529$294fd750$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru><429B75EB.7010502@shaw.ca>
	<e04a6c92050531044839b2a178@mail.gmail.com>
	<429C72B5.8020700@shaw.ca>
Message-ID: <001801c565f0$7972f2e0$6401a8c0@fincomplex.spb.ru>

> You get to this isp site  in athens.
> http://www.otenet.gr/english/index.htm
> Abuse & Spam:   abuse at otenet.gr
Yes, as Bryan advised me yesterday I did send to abuse at otenet.gr information
about infected e-mails coming to me from 195.167.69.130. Their automatic
reply service answered promptly:

<<<
******* Greek text. English text follows *******

T? ?????? ??? ???????????. ??? ?????????????? ??? ?? ??????????? ??? ???
????????? ?? ????????? ???????.
???????????? ??? ?????????????? ?? ??? Y??????? Abuse ??? OTEnet.

We have received your message. We assure you that the above incident will be
thoroughly examined.
Thank you for contacting OTEnet's Abuse service.
>>>

But this morning I did get the new infected message still from
195.167.69.130.
Hopefully they will fix the problem in the near future...
It's interesting that I'm getting not more than three-four virii a day from
195.167.69.130.
So the problem is not that big - Agnitum Outpost Firewall blocks e-mail
attachments to run and even if I save attachment to hdd NAV RealTime File
Protection quarantines them on-the-fly...

So I feel rather safe and with Agnitum Tauscan parasites seems to be also
blocked well..

Shamil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "MartyConnelly" <martyconnelly at shaw.ca>
To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues"
<dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2005 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] Viruses coming for several days from
195.167.69.130....


> Well if you track down that ip address
>
> 195.167.69.130
>
> through whois http://www.eventid.net/whois.asp
> and then the ripe.net whois
> You get to this isp site  in athens.
> http://www.otenet.gr/english/index.htm
>
> Abuse & Spam:   abuse at otenet.gr
>
>
>   Query the RIPE Whois Database
>   Search for
>
<<< tail skipped >>>