Arthur Fuller
fuller.artful at gmail.com
Fri Jan 31 18:16:55 CST 2014
Shamil, I think that you dismiss flow-based-programming too quickly. I do not dispute your contention that it's always good to know how to do it by hand. Bur when was the last time you built a chesterfield? I personally have never built one, but have refinished my beloved couch and chesterfield twice. This I know how to do. The set was made by Koehler in 1856 (I've researched this) and there's no way that I could emulate their skills. I content myself with re-upholstering it every few decades. I've owned this set of furniture since 1969 and plan never to replace it. Arthur On Fri, Jan 31, 2014 at 5:22 PM, Salakhetdinov Shamil <mcp2004 at mail.ru>wrote: > Hi Jim -- > > Actually, AFAIKR, the heated debate that time was about > > - hierarchical vs. network (CODASYL) databases (70-ies last century) and > then > - network (CODASYL) vs. relational databases (80-ies last century). > > And ISAM/VSAM (and even BDAM) were a "parallel" theme - file access > methods to use to implement RDMBSes physical layers. > There were a lot of research on distributed databases also in 80-ies as > well as on parallel/multi-threaded programming. > AFAIU Oracle got a lot from DB2 and other relational DB research projects > of 80-ies. > > Nowadays NoSQL "movement" for Big Data manipulation is looking as "another > circle of evolution spiral" (back to hierarchical/network databases) - so > one can expect that relational databases will get back in even "bigger that > nowadays Big Data Manipulation real business" in 30 years or less on > another higher level of never ending evolution spiral... > > As for Flow-Based Programming - IMO that is a "birds view" or tip of > iceberg of what an experienced modern programmer has(/is able) to do by > hands. And the gap between what can be done by using Flow-Based Programming > (Automation) and by hands will only grow with time. Just my opinion based > on my own experience. I can be wrong. > > Thank you. > > -- Shamil > > > Wednesday, January 29, 2014 5:31 PM -07:00 from Jim Lawrence < > accessd at shaw.ca>: > >Hi Shamil: > > > >I remember around the time Borland was totting their new product, which > at the time I thought was impossible, by the way, there was a heated debate > about whether ISAM and indexed flat-based files were going to be replaced > by Oracle's new SQL server. We all now know what happened. > > > >Products will live and die as the capabilities, needs and understand > grows. Whether it is the right time for Flow-Based Programming the market > will tell but the concept is not going away. The only thing that is giving > me some hope that there actually be a working version, at the end of the > design phase, is the very strong team of developers, working on the project. > > > >Jim > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Salakhetdinov Shamil" < mcp2004 at mail.ru > > >To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues" < > dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com > > >Sent: Wednesday, January 29, 2014 2:58:44 AM > >Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] A new graphic program builder > > > > Hi Jim et All -- > > > >I'm sorry to be rather skeptical on all that "new way" visual "logic > drawing-driven" "rapid application development" tools - have a look: > > > >"by CBR Staff Writer| 12 February 1991 > >... In another age the product might have been described as an expert > system, but the buzz word now is Object and the product offers visual > programming techniques to enable users to stipulate objects and processes > via drawings..." > http://www.cbronline.com/news/borland_objectvision_makes_writing_windows_programs_easy > > > >Do you remember it - Borland Object Vision? I do. > > > >And before that around year 1981 last century there was > > > >"Application Development Without Programmers" > >James Martin (Author) > http://www.amazon.com/Application-Development-Without-Programmers-Martin/dp/0130389439 > > > >Did you read it? I did. And I did read it on that ancient now times. It > was exciting reading... that time. > > > >And the "Application Development Without Programmers" was published a few > years *after* this well known book: > > > >"The Mythical Man-Month" by Fred Brooks > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mythical_Man-Month > > > >Did you read it? I did. And I did read it nearly the same time as I did > read the "Application Development Without Programmers" book somewhere in > the beginning of 80-ies of last century. (NB: that were ex-USSR times here, > mainstream/bestselling there on "wild West" books were available here, but > sometimes with considerable delay.) > > > >And somewhere in the beginning of 90-ies there was the "The Computer > Revolution in Software System Development" ( > http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/The_Computer_Revolution/Software/System_Development) - all kinds of software design case systems: does anybody of you using > something like that in your everyday software development work? > > > >---- > >Resume: there exists "something" elusive, subtle, intangible, > imponderable, evasive, vague, volatile, subtle, inappreciable, impalpable - > sorry for my English - select any word, which you suppose is better > highlighting "never ending, durable software development crisis" issue.. > there exists something, which will always make the "new ways of > programming" getting obsolete rather quick. And this "something" is > "Governing in details" ( > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_is_in_the_detail ), which will always > require 80% of software projects development time to be spent on to keep > competing in this accelerating world... > > > >-- Shamil > > > > > >Tuesday, January 28, 2014 7:59 PM -07:00 from Jim Lawrence < > accessd at shaw.ca >: > >>Hi All: > >> > >>For all you developers out there a new way of programming. Check out > NoFlo another application that has reached (and surpassed) it financial > goal and now is in full development on Kickstarter...another startup > program out of San-Francisco. > >> > >> > https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/noflo/noflo-development-environment?ref=category > >> > >>Check this out and what do you think? > >> > >>Jim > >> > >>PS It is OSS > >>_______________________________________________ > >> > > > > > -- > Салахетдинов Шамиль > _______________________________________________ > dba-Tech mailing list > dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- Arthur