Jim Lawrence (AccessD)
accessd at shaw.ca
Fri May 21 20:12:39 CDT 2004
Bleeding edge or old antique...the only way to make money programming. Jim -----Original Message----- From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Andy Lacey Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 11:03 AM To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' Subject: RE: [AccessD] On DB Bloat, Bad DB Design, and various >> a primitive spreadsheet program which ran on an IBM 370 Wow that takes me back. I designed and co-wrote one of those, SomethingOrOtherCalc it was called - originally. (I don't mean that literally I just can't recall - you get the picture.) Was going to make my fortune but unfortunately these things called IBM PC's came along and somewhat destroyed the market. That's why I'm scratching a living with Access. Aah well. -- Andy Lacey http://www.minstersystems.co.uk > -----Original Message----- > From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com > [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Hale, Jim > Sent: 21 May 2004 18:41 > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: RE: [AccessD] On DB Bloat, Bad DB Design, and various > > > Charlotte, > I guess we all have our own prejudices based on our unique > experiences but I had to grin at your "rant" because I had > almost a mirror image experience. As it happens, I joined a > major bank holding Co approx 30 years ago with a newly minted > MBA, and the first major dragon I had to slay was designing, > programming and implementing a financial reporting and > planning system. This task fell to me because the IT dept was > incapable of making it happen with the personnel and tools at > their disposal and in any case was backlogged 2 years with > requests. My recollection of this pre-PC period was a lot of > IT shops were swamped because COBOL and FORTRAN were about > it. I was able to succeed with a primitive spreadsheet > program which ran on an IBM 370, a lot of late nights and a > TSO partition (remember those?). I was dangerous with JCL > because the system at the time was wide open, but that is > another story :-). BTW of the MBAs at the time who worked > with and for me, one started a successful NYSE listed > company, several have risen to the top of their companies, a > couple were indeed congenital idiots and one (Jeff Skilling) > was a crook. > > Regards, > Jim Hale > > -----Original Message----- > From: Charlotte Foust [mailto:cfoust at infostatsystems.com] > Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 10:09 AM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: RE: [AccessD] On DB Bloat, Bad DB Design, and various > > > Arthur, > > Certification isn't the answer. About 30 years ago all the > major banks decided that they absolutely had to have MBAs in > their management structure because these guys must know what > they were doing. So they brought in a bunch of whiz kids who > lasted a year or two before their employers got wise to the > fact that getting a degree didn't mean you knew how to do > anything except take tests and defend a thesis in an academic setting. > > Programming is something of an art, or at the least, a craft, > and it takes time and practice to perfect it. Most of the > bad stuff you see is because Access has always been marketed > as an end user tool, so everyone who can use a wizard thinks > of themselves as a developer. I once worked on overhauling > an Access project that a major company had paid $250,000 to a > "developer" to write. I told them I would have been happy to > give them a program that didn't work for a tenth of that! > <VBG> The guy > *may* have know VB, given the way some of it was written, but > he knew sweet damn all about Access/Jet and SQL. > > Charlotte Foust > > -----Original Message----- > From: Arthur Fuller [mailto:artful at rogers.com] > Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 4:32 PM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: [AccessD] On DB Bloat, Bad DB Design, and various > > > Just a note on this bloat subject. I acquired a new client > recently, whose DB was 220 MB. They burned me a CD containing > same last weekend, so I could work on it while they were > closed. Dumbass previous developer hadn't even split it into > FE-BE! Everyone was loading the same instance of the whole > thing across the net! > > They had a problem which I fixed. I estimated a day but once > I got into it, 3 days elapsed. I split the difference and > billed for 2 days. > > Upon inspection of said database, I discovered some > incredible and bizarre anomalies/stupidities. Several tables > of critical importance had no PKs and no FK indexes! Unbelievable! > > Anyway... I split the datbase, then made some mods to the BE > which in theory ought to have almost doubled it (i.e. I made > copies of every transaction table, but not the static lookup > tables). Then I ran compact/repair, and the db came down to > (gasp) 40 MB. This includes the doubled tables and the new PK > and FK indexes that I added. From 200+ MB to 40 MB -- and > this with doubled transaction tables. Once we get the s**t > sorted out, I expect that it will come down to 25 MB. > > I have never programmed in an automatic compact/repair before > -- I suppose because I tend to be available and do it as a > matter of course. But this app has caused me to rethink that. > > More seriously, this app has caused me to rethink the virtues > of certification. No BE! No PKs! No FK indexes! No wonder the > bloddy app was slow with only 20 users on a net! > > The up side is, it's really easy to look good in a situation > like this. The performance gains were spectacular. I got > high-fives from all directions :) > > This is a strange business :) > > Arthur > > -- > _______________________________________________ > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/a> ccessd > Website: > http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > > _______________________________________________ > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/a> ccessd > Website: > http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > > _______________________________________________ > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/a> ccessd > Website: > http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- _______________________________________________ AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com