William Hindman
wdhindman at dejpolsystems.com
Tue Feb 20 22:52:24 CST 2007
...lol ...while technically true its not a concern ...my users don't have Access installed and William Hindman ----- Original Message ----- From: "Drew Wutka" <DWUTKA at marlow.com> To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 8:03 PM Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. > Yep..... even in a runtime environment. An .mde only protects the > forms/reports/code. The tables (and querries and the data within) are > still accessible through ANYTHING that can connect to an Access .mdb. > (Access itself, Excel, word, VBScript, heck, anything that can use ADO > or DAO.). > > The only thing that protects an Access table (whether it's an .mdb, or > .mde) is Access User Level Security. > > Don't believe me? Just open an .mdb, and go link a table, find an .mde > to link to, and you'll see ALL of your tables right there.... > > Drew > > -----Original Message----- > From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com > [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of William > Hindman > Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 6:43 PM > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. > > ...not in a runtime environment :) > > William Hindman > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Drew Wutka" <DWUTKA at marlow.com> > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" > <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 6:35 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. > > >> If you aren't using User Level security, what's the point in any >> 'security' within the db anyhow? >> >> Let's say you have a form that only Mr. X should be able to use. This >> form edits tblXYZ. Sure, from the .mde interface only Mr. X would get >> the form, if you design it that way. But any Joe Schmoe can link to > ALL >> the tables in the .mde, and do whatever they want to the data..... >> >> Drew >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com >> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of William >> Hindman >> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 5:25 PM >> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving >> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >> >> ...I'm left dazed by your disparagement of XP security! :) >> >> ...pray tell why in a 12 user office where no personal information is >> available in the app, the xp user logon should not be sufficient to >> determine access rights to forms needing restricted access based upon >> user >> roles? >> >> William Hindman ...apparently a paranoid programmer ...who knew? :) >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Charlotte Foust" <cfoust at infostatsystems.com> >> To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" >> <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 6:09 PM >> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >> >> >>> The primary role of user security IMO has been to allow you to limit >>> ordinary users to working with the interface. It has never been >> robust >>> enough to keep out knowledgeable tamperers. However, I do NOT want >> Joe >>> User going in and mucking about with the interface or code I built >> just >>> because he now has full permissions to do so. I have never been >> wiling >>> to roll my own security system for Access because I object to >>> reinventing the wheel, even if the wheel is a bit crooked and flat on >>> one side. XP security in small business environments?? You MUST be >>> joking! I've never seen a small business environment with any >> security >>> that hadn't been added on by a paranoid programmer or systems guy! > ;o> >>> >>> Charlotte >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com >>> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of William >>> Hindman >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 1:54 PM >>> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving >>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >>> >>> ...again Charlotte, that is heavily dependent upon the environment in >>> which you work ...Access based user security has been a farce since >> '95 >>> ...you cannot build an Access mdb to which I cannot gain access with >>> readily available tools, both free and inexpensive ...so you build >> your >>> own, a number of which are discussed in our archives, or you depend > on >>> XP security in small business environments ...so the decision by the >>> Access development team to remove it from A'07 really has no bearing >> on >>> its continued use in those environments. >>> >>> William Hindman >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Charlotte Foust" <cfoust at infostatsystems.com> >>> To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" >>> <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 4:02 PM >>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >>> >>> >>>>I don't think anyone is casting aspersions, William. But the simple >>>> truth is that without user security in Access mdbs, they become less >>>> than useful for multiuser solutions. That doesn't depend on object >>>> model, it depends on having a mechanism for controlling who gets > into >>>> the application and keeping track of who's there. Without that >>>> capability, Access 2007 becomes a desktop database for power users > or >>> a >>>> RAD frontend for SQL Server. >>>> >>>> Charlotte Foust >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com >>>> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of William >>>> Hindman >>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 11:24 AM >>>> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving >>>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >>>> >>>> Arthur >>>> >>>> ...its not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing ...if you work in an >>>> environment where SS is available and the notwork resources are >>>> available to support it, of course you would use SS in most >>>> applications. >>>> >>>> ...but if you are a consultant working with many small businesses >>> where >>>> you are it, then a well designed dao mdb fe/be can be highly stable >>> and >>>> work every bit as well as an adp/SS combo ...in point of fact with > up >>> to >>>> at least >>>> 15 users a well designed dao based mdb will normally out perform an >>> ado >>>> based fe. >>>> >>>> ...and with A'07 it appears that MS itself is moving back to the dao >>>> model ...what irks me is people declaring that their favorite model >> is >>>> best for everyone ...or casting unwarranted aspersions on Access > be's >>>> and dao when they really don't work in an environment where that >> model >>>> functions best. >>>> >>>> William Hindman >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: <artful at rogers.com> >>>> To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" >>>> <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 1:41 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >>>> >>>> >>>>> While I agree with you, I also fear that you will be flamed from >>>> numerous >>>>> devotees to the MDB BE concept. I have my flame extinguisher ready >> in >>>> case >>>>> you need it. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Arthur Fuller >>>>> Technical Writer, Data Modeler, SQL Sensei >>>>> Artful Databases Organization >>>>> www.artfulsoftware.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>>> From: Robert L. Stewart <rl_stewart at highstream.net> >>>>> To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com >>>>> Cc: BarbaraRyan at cox.net >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 1:09:06 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Code Library, Sample Database, Etc. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Barb, >>>>> >>>>> I think the only way to completely "tie it all together" >>>>> is to use SQL Server and an ADP. Behind the forms and such >>>>> it s completely ADO. MDEs are not if you use a bound form. >>>>> >>>>> Robert >>>>> >>>>> P.S. Besides, I would never use Access for the database any way. >>>>> SQL Server is much better at storing it and being stable. >>>>> -- >>>>> AccessD mailing list >>>>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>>>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>>>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> AccessD mailing list >>>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>>> -- >>>> AccessD mailing list >>>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> AccessD mailing list >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>> -- >>> AccessD mailing list >>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >>> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >>> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >>> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> AccessD mailing list >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >> -- >> AccessD mailing list >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >> > > > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >