Dan Waters
dwaters at usinternet.com
Tue Jun 26 07:48:33 CDT 2007
I would use the income from maintenance to continuously improve the core system I use (identical at each customer). Then when they ask for something for themselves as an improvement, it would handled as a new project they would pay for. I don't know about increasing maintenance due to working on something that was their request. I only do maintenance on the core system. Good Question! Dan -----Original Message----- From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Hawkins Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 10:37 AM To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases Dan, I've heard 20% as the golden number for maintenance contracts. But here's the real kicker - say you're doing a custom system. You're charging the client $x/month as a maintenance contract. Then you're asked to build some new functionality into the system, which of course increases the total amount spent on the system. Do you up your maintenance contract price? That sounds like a good way to upset a customer. -C- ---------------------------------------- From: "Dan Waters" <dwaters at usinternet.com> Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 8:08 AM To: "'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'" <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases Hi Kath, Kath, I do charge a user license fee of $500/user/year. These are concurrent licenses. If they have 5 licenses the 6th user gets a screen which lists the people who are currently logged in, and they are logged out. I set up a mechanism where the administrator can change the license quantity themselves, and I charge monthly. The amount is based on the highest quantity for the previous month. I've been thinking about a maintenance fee as well. It turns out that I do quite a bit of maintenance anyway (improvements/fixes I want to implement). And, it's much easier overall for your customers to get a maintenance budget approved, than to get approval for a series of changes or improvements. When I started 5 years ago, I thought that managers would take budgets somewhat personally, but it's really just a business tool. I've read that a typical maintenance fee is annually about 15% of the original cost. Dan -----Original Message----- From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Kath Pelletti Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 7:53 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases I only do custom systems myself and so far have never advertised - all word of mouth, and mostly work that originated from friends taking me into their workplaces and recommending me to solve problem x or y. I agree that the relationship is the thing. But I have my structure wrong and am trying to change that. At the moment I quote for all work (and charge for analysis to the point where I can quote). But once the system is in I get no ongoings and that is where I have made the mistake. After talking to otehr consultants over the last few years I am planning to approach 3 or 4 of my clients who really rely on the systems I have written and discuss maintenance contracts. I have one or 2 systems which I know could be on-sold but have never gone down that route. I enjoy the fact that I work across multiple industries - kills the boredom factor, though it won't make you rich...... Kath ----- Original Message ----- From: Christopher Hawkins To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:20 AM Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases Anyone else care to share where they get their clients from? More to the point, has anyone managed to set up a system by which the clients manage to find you? I'm trying to automate my business and this has been a real sticking point. It seems that if I'm not out there soliciting new business, the pipeline dries right up. -C- ---------------------------------------- From: "Dan Waters" Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 6:46 PM To: "'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'" Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases Thanks Chris - that's worth more than 2 cents! There are four different groups which I attend regularly, and being at one of them has paid off. So, I will keep doing this! Thanks! Dan -----Original Message----- From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Hawkins Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 7:07 PM To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases Dan, The process of getting clients can be tough for small operators like us. Right now I have a subcontracted team of 3 devs and it's no easier to keep us busy than it was when I was alone. In fact, I'm thinking about going BACK to solo dev! But that said, the most effective means of getting clients for me has been personal contacts. It requires high energy and a decent time investment, but it works. Basically, people like to do business with their friends. All things being equal, a person will steer work to someone they like over someone they hardly know. So you need to get yourself out to places and events where members of the local business community tend to congreagate. Visit those Chamber of Commerce events. Attend those trade shows. Join the downtown revitalization committee in your town. Wherever there are influentials, make sure you are there interacting and forging friendships with them. See, small operators like us can't hide behind fancy marketing and company names and institutional advertising like bigger firms can. When someone hires your firm, they're hiring YOU, even if you have a team behind you to do the heavy lifting. But in order to hire you, they have to be exposed to and believe in you. By all means, make your business look a little fuller than it is. But never forget that you are your own brand. That's my two cents, at least. ;) Respectfully, Christopher Hawkins Chief Developer Cogeian Systems (559) 687-7591 www.cogeian.com ---------------------------------------- From: "Dan Waters" Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:00 AM To: "'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'" Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases Hi Reuben, I also would be happy to sell this for $1, if I had some other source of income! My question is - what did you do to acquire 60 clients? Dan -----Original Message----- From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Reuben Cummings Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:23 AM To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases I don't do any custom programming. We have some apps that we thought up on our own or requested by clients or potential clients. We create apps and sell them to local government (cities and counties). Now were I differ from a lot of people is I don't care about the sale. I'd be happy to sell it for $1. Actually I don't sell anything - I license it all. I live on the service contracts for each app. We charge anywhere from 600 to 1200 per year based on which app. I have some clients paying as much as 4000/year. The average is about 1000/year/client. Doesn't sound like much, but with about 60 clients it's pretty decent income. And that doesn't include the consulting part of the business which is all done by annual contract. The key is I only assume the 60k as my income and everything over that is a "bonus" On our flagship app which is by far the biggest and has the most clients I only spend about 40 hours/year in service work TOTAL - for all clients. They don't mind the fee because support calls, on site visits, and all future upgrades are included in the service contract. If the client chooses not to pay for the service agreement on an app the app gets removed. The can keep the data, but there isn't much to do with it without an interface. Reuben Cummings GFC, LLC 812.523.1017 > -----Original Message----- > From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com > [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Dan Waters > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:15 AM > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving' > Subject: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases > > > To Everyone: > > It's always interesting to see how people who work independently (like me) > are making money from developing databases or doing something related to > databases. > > This has been my major problem - I can make a great Business Process > Management System, but getting companies to pay for it is a real > challenge, > even though their return on investment is probably 2X to 8X in the first > year! > > I do wonder if we could begin an ongoing discussion on the > business side of > what each of us does. I think we could all benefit! > > Does anyone have some thoughts or ideas on how we could do this? > > Thanks! > Dan > > > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com -- AccessD mailing list AccessD at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com