[AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases

Dan Waters dwaters at usinternet.com
Tue Jun 26 20:31:18 CDT 2007


Hi Reuben,

How do you make the calculation for your flat fee?  A % of the original
price?

Also, where do you find customers who can't stop themselves from wanting to
pay you?  That's what I need!!  ;-)

Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
[mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Reuben Cummings
Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 10:48 AM
To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases

We operate the same way.

Any reasonable client request is simply added to our system and then all
clients have that feature upon their next update.  I don't customize
anything because I HATE working on specific items for specific people.  I
tried this one time and it just never stops.  That client just keeps wanting
more and more ridiculous things.

We have found it easier to charge a flat fee per year for licensing,
support, training, and updates and simply including all changes as part of
those updates.

Reuben Cummings
GFC, LLC
812.523.1017


> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Charlotte
> Foust
> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 11:35 AM
> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
>
> In our company, clients pay for the product license and they pay and
> annual support fee.  The fee is for support, not maintenance.  We do
> maintenance anyway.  Customization is strictly for pay.  If something
> the client requests looks like it could be useful to other clients, we
> may integrate it into the main product in a future release and then
> there is no further customization charge for that feature.
>
> Charlotte Foust
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Dan Waters
> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 5:49 AM
> To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> I would use the income from maintenance to continuously improve the core
> system I use (identical at each customer).  Then when they ask for
> something for themselves as an improvement, it would handled as a new
> project they would pay for.
>
> I don't know about increasing maintenance due to working on something
> that was their request.  I only do maintenance on the core system.
>
> Good Question!
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Christopher
> Hawkins
> Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 10:37 AM
> To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> Dan,
>
> I've heard 20% as the golden number for maintenance contracts.  But
> here's the real kicker - say you're doing a custom system.  You're
> charging the client $x/month as a maintenance contract.  Then you're
> asked to build some new functionality into the system, which of course
> increases the total amount spent on the system.  Do you up your
> maintenance contract price?
> That sounds like a good way to upset a customer.
>
> -C-
>
> ----------------------------------------
>
> From: "Dan Waters" <dwaters at usinternet.com>
> Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 8:08 AM
> To: "'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'"
> <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> Hi Kath,
>
> Kath,
>
> I do charge a user license fee of $500/user/year. These are concurrent
> licenses. If they have 5 licenses the 6th user gets a screen which lists
> the people who are currently logged in, and they are logged out. I set
> up a mechanism where the administrator can change the license quantity
> themselves, and I charge monthly. The amount is based on the highest
> quantity for the previous month.
>
> I've been thinking about a maintenance fee as well. It turns out that I
> do quite a bit of maintenance anyway (improvements/fixes I want to
> implement).
> And, it's much easier overall for your customers to get a maintenance
> budget approved, than to get approval for a series of changes or
> improvements.
> When I started 5 years ago, I thought that managers would take budgets
> somewhat personally, but it's really just a business tool.
>
> I've read that a typical maintenance fee is annually about 15% of the
> original cost.
>
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Kath Pelletti
> Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2007 7:53 AM
> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> I only do custom systems myself and so far have never advertised - all
> word of mouth, and mostly work that originated from friends taking me
> into their workplaces and recommending me to solve problem x or y. I
> agree that the relationship is the thing. But I have my structure wrong
> and am trying to change that. At the moment I quote for all work (and
> charge for analysis to the point where I can quote). But once the system
> is in I get no ongoings and that is where I have made the mistake. After
> talking to otehr consultants over the last few years I am planning to
> approach 3 or 4 of my clients who really rely on the systems I have
> written and discuss maintenance contracts.
>
> I have one or 2 systems which I know could be on-sold but have never
> gone down that route. I enjoy the fact that I work across multiple
> industries - kills the boredom factor, though it won't make you
> rich......
>
> Kath
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Christopher Hawkins
> To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com
> Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:20 AM
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> Anyone else care to share where they get their clients from?
>
> More to the point, has anyone managed to set up a system by which the
> clients manage to find you? I'm trying to automate my business and this
> has been a real sticking point. It seems that if I'm not out there
> soliciting new business, the pipeline dries right up.
>
> -C-
>
> ----------------------------------------
>
> From: "Dan Waters"
> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 6:46 PM
> To: "'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'"
>
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> Thanks Chris - that's worth more than 2 cents!
>
> There are four different groups which I attend regularly, and being at
> one of them has paid off. So, I will keep doing this!
>
> Thanks!
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Christopher
> Hawkins
> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 7:07 PM
> To: accessd at databaseadvisors.com
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> Dan,
>
> The process of getting clients can be tough for small operators like us.
> Right now I have a subcontracted team of 3 devs and it's no easier to
> keep us busy than it was when I was alone. In fact, I'm thinking about
> going BACK to solo dev! But that said, the most effective means of
> getting clients for me has been personal contacts. It requires high
> energy and a decent time investment, but it works.
>
> Basically, people like to do business with their friends. All things
> being equal, a person will steer work to someone they like over someone
> they hardly know. So you need to get yourself out to places and events
> where members of the local business community tend to congreagate. Visit
> those Chamber of Commerce events. Attend those trade shows. Join the
> downtown revitalization committee in your town. Wherever there are
> influentials, make sure you are there interacting and forging
> friendships with them.
>
> See, small operators like us can't hide behind fancy marketing and
> company names and institutional advertising like bigger firms can. When
> someone hires your firm, they're hiring YOU, even if you have a team
> behind you to do the heavy lifting. But in order to hire you, they have
> to be exposed to and believe in you. By all means, make your business
> look a little fuller than it is. But never forget that you are your own
> brand.
>
> That's my two cents, at least. ;)
>
> Respectfully,
>
> Christopher Hawkins
> Chief Developer
> Cogeian Systems
> (559) 687-7591
> www.cogeian.com
>
> ----------------------------------------
>
> From: "Dan Waters"
> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:00 AM
> To: "'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'"
>
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> Hi Reuben,
>
> I also would be happy to sell this for $1, if I had some other source of
> income!
>
> My question is - what did you do to acquire 60 clients?
>
> Dan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Reuben
> Cummings
> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:23 AM
> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
>
> I don't do any custom programming. We have some apps that we thought up
> on our own or requested by clients or potential clients. We create apps
> and sell them to local government (cities and counties).
>
> Now were I differ from a lot of people is I don't care about the sale.
> I'd be happy to sell it for $1. Actually I don't sell anything - I
> license it all. I live on the service contracts for each app. We charge
> anywhere from 600 to 1200 per year based on which app. I have some
> clients paying as much as 4000/year. The average is about
> 1000/year/client. Doesn't sound like much, but with about 60 clients
> it's pretty decent income.
>
> And that doesn't include the consulting part of the business which is
> all done by annual contract. The key is I only assume the 60k as my
> income and everything over that is a "bonus"
>
> On our flagship app which is by far the biggest and has the most clients
> I only spend about 40 hours/year in service work TOTAL - for all
> clients.
> They don't mind the fee because support calls, on site visits, and all
> future upgrades are included in the service contract.
>
> If the client chooses not to pay for the service agreement on an app the
> app gets removed. The can keep the data, but there isn't much to do with
> it without an interface.
>
> Reuben Cummings
> GFC, LLC
> 812.523.1017
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com
> > [mailto:accessd-bounces at databaseadvisors.com]On Behalf Of Dan Waters
> > Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:15 AM
> > To: 'Access Developers discussion and problem solving'
> > Subject: [AccessD] The Business Side Of Databases
> >
> >
> > To Everyone:
> >
> > It's always interesting to see how people who work independently (like
> me)
> > are making money from developing databases or doing something related
> > to databases.
> >
> > This has been my major problem - I can make a great Business Process
> > Management System, but getting companies to pay for it is a real
> > challenge, even though their return on investment is probably 2X to 8X
>
> > in the first year!
> >
> > I do wonder if we could begin an ongoing discussion on the business
> > side of what each of us does. I think we could all benefit!
> >
> > Does anyone have some thoughts or ideas on how we could do this?
> >
> > Thanks!
> > Dan
> >
> >
> >
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> >
>
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