Salakhetdinov Shamil
mcp2004 at mail.ru
Sat Feb 28 19:07:45 CST 2009
Hi Mike, Thank you for joining us. We're going to make Northwind MS Access conversion to .NET Winforms application. We wanted to make it SCRUM-way. << SCRUM in 100 words - Scrum is an agile process that allows us to focus on delivering the highest business value in the shortest time. - It allows us to rapidly and repeatedly inspect actual working software (every two weeks to one month). - The business sets the priorities. Teams self-organize to determine the best way to deliver the highest priority features. - Every two weeks to a month anyone can see real working software and decide to release it as is or continue to enhance it for another sprint. >> You can start by reading these sources: http://www.mountaingoatsoftware.com/scrum-a-presentation http://agilethinking.net/scrumdocs/Essence_Of_Scrum.pdf Scrum and XP from the Trenches - it's a big book - we can use it as a reference later. Just glance it for now (you can download a free copy). I must say I didn't read it yet but I was told it's very good source for SCRUM projects, it has a lot of real life samples and experiences: http://www.infoq.com/minibooks/scrum-xp-from-the-trenches All in all we're getting self-organizing now: I plan to prepare some public infrastruture within coming week - when that ready, and even if not ready - we can start - currently planned date is 9th of March. FYI: If that would have been a real project for money with all of us working on it fulltime or something like that then we could have started immediately... -- Shamil -----Original Message----- From: "Mike Mattys" <mmattys at rochester.rr.com> To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving"<accessd at databaseadvisors.com> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 19:09:45 -0500 Subject: Re: [AccessD] Scrum (was: Find First in an Array? ...) > Hi Shamil & Gustav > > Not of William's or Stuart's caliber, but willing to try. > I've fallen behind on reading AccessD > > Let's see - I signed up to Shamil's site > What should I be downloading / reading? > > - > Mike Mattys > - > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Stuart McLachlan" <stuart at lexacorp.com.pg> > To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" > <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 6:30 PM > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Scrum (was: Find First in an Array? ...) > > > > strTemp = Replace(strWilliamComments, "62", "60") > > strTemp = Replace(strTemp,"15","16") > > strTemp = Replace(strTemp, ""building our home"","getting a new joint > > venture business > > off the ground") > > > > strStuartComments = strTemp :-) > > > > -- > > Stuart > > > > On 28 Feb 2009 at 15:25, William Hindman wrote: > > > >> Shamil > >> > >> "May I ask you all why Gustav and myself can't get a group of 5 team > >> members?" > >> > >> ...I'm 62 yo and have worked as a single developer for the past 15 years > >> ...SCRUM is focused on something I'm very unlikely to ever use ...and > >> fortunately, I'm still so loaded down between development work and > >> building > >> our home that I simply have no time available for anything that I don't > >> foresee using myself ...I do wish I was 20 years younger and could find > >> the > >> time and energy to learn something new from people like you and gustav > >> just > >> for the hell of it ...but I'm not and that's the long and short of it. > >> > >> William > >> > >> -------------------------------------------------- > >> From: "Salakhetdinov Shamil" <mcp2004 at mail.ru> > >> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 2:48 PM > >> To: "Access Developers discussion and problem solving" > >> <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > >> Subject: Re: [AccessD]Scrum (was: Find First in an Array? ...) > >> > >> > > >> > Hi Gustav, > >> > > >> > Thank you for registering. > >> > > >> > Yes, I agree that at this moment 5 users limitations seems of no > >> > importance. > >> > > >> > Anybody else wanted to join me and Gustav to try MS Access Northwind to > >> > .NET Winforms Northwind conversion project? > >> > Project is currently planned to be started at 9th of March 2009, and is > >> > expected to be finished in max 1 man month of common efforts. > >> > Conversion is planned to be done using SCRUM/agile development > >> > methology. > >> > It will be public open source project with project progress information > >> > and final converted application published on AccessD. > >> > This is planned to be as simple as possible project - the only > >> > knowledge > >> > of VS2008 that would be needed at the beginning is how to design .NET > >> > WinForms by dragginbg and dropping controls and settings some > >> > properties. > >> > And this development activity is simple - my seven years old kid > >> > started > >> > to "design" WinForms after 2 minutes of my introduction, and he even > >> > "programmed" buttons' click events reaction etc. Really easy and very > >> > much > >> > alike to the usual MS Access forms development. > >> > > >> > .NET ReportViewer Control reports' design experience would be a plus > >> > but > >> > not necessary as it's also rather straightforward to get acquanted with > >> > for experienced developers whatever else Report Designer they used > >> > before... > >> > > >> > Folks, if you can't join this project because you're very busy maybe > >> > you > >> > can at least participate in the "planning poker game"? There is a free > >> > online tool to play it: http://www.planningpoker.com/ > >> > > >> > May I ask yuu all why Gustav and myself can't get a group of 5 team > >> > members? > >> > > >> > If you do not want to answer on this question here please send me > >> > private > >> > e-mails with your reasons - just one most important reason or several, > >> > and > >> > I will collect them and publish here anonymously. And I can make an > >> > anonymous online poll based on that reasons to vote and see what are > >> > main > >> > reasons, which stop such projects. Please write and send ANY reasons > >> > which > >> > stop you from participating in this discussion/project. > >> > > >> > I will wait for your votes/e-mails till next Wednesday as it's weekend > >> > now > >> > and not all listers work over weekend. I do hope somebody will join us > >> > during the next week. > >> > > >> > In the meantime I will be preparing infrastructure, and some simple > >> > tools > >> > to patially automate this conversion, and I will have also to work for > >> > my > >> > customers of course... > >> > > >> > Thank you. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > Shamil > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > -----Original Message----- > >> > From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk> > >> > To: <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > >> > Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 19:43:11 +0100 > >> > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Scrum (was: Find First in an Array? ...) > >> > > >> >> Hi Shamil > >> >> > >> >> OK, I signed up. > >> >> > >> >> As for the software, the TargetProcess "community edition" will only > >> >> do > >> >> be free for 5 licenses. If more users, it is USD 249 for each and > >> >> every > >> >> user: > >> >> > >> >> Q. What if I need 6 users pack? > >> >> In this case it will be required to purchase 6 full licenses. > >> >> Community > >> >> Edition allows to have 5 licenses, if you need more, you have to > >> >> migrate > >> >> to On-Site or On-Demand Full Edition. > >> >> > >> >> However, at this moment this limitation seems of no importance. > >> >> > >> >> /gustav > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >>> mcp2004 at mail.ru 28-02-2009 15:43 >>> > >> >> > >> >> Hi Gustav and Fellow Listers, > >> >> > >> >> Yes, the response on my proposal is a bit discouraging but I'm > >> >> continuing > >> >> preparation here for the conversion project of MS Access NorthWind > >> >> sample > >> >> app to .NET WinForms. > >> >> > >> >> Yes, Gustav, we can try to do it just with you but SCRUM/agile process > >> >> needs a little bit more team members - at least 4-5: if doing this > >> >> project by using just your and mine efforts it can be done agile way > >> >> but > >> >> not SCRUM, and it will take more time, and what is most important it > >> >> will > >> >> not show advantages of working as a team - and the advantages in this > >> >> case is not only joining the efforts and skills - the main advantage > >> >> is > >> >> to experience how teamwork influences one's own views and insights - > >> >> and > >> >> it does influence then very effectively - I mean that - I have just > >> >> experienced that during CSM course in Helsinki. Even participating for > >> >> years in great dicussion lists as this AccessD one do not change one's > >> >> stereotypes and (conservative) ways of thinking as SCRUM/agile > >> >> teamwork > >> >> does... > >> >> > >> >> I plan to keep preparing SCRUM/agile infrastructure for the Northwind > >> >> conversion project within the next week - in my plans is to setup DNN > >> >> site - first step is done: > >> >> > >> >> http://shamils-4.hosting.parking.ru/dnn49 > >> >> > >> >> nothing except registration there yet but it's up&running - I "just" > >> >> need > >> >> to add some DNN modules - do not know how to do that yet - plan to do > >> >> that within the next week - I can keep posting SCRUM related info on > >> >> this > >> >> site as well as we can have wiki board on it to have "daily stand-up > >> >> meetings" as well as I can setup newlist on it to have everybody > >> >> registered and subscribed to this newlist informed on what is > >> >> happening. > >> >> Of course it will be forwarded here - the best woudl be to have > >> >> separate > >> >> SCRUM%Access-D list but it's probably too early? > >> >> > >> >> I'm also evaluating this software > >> >> > >> >> http://www.targetprocess.com/Product.aspx > >> >> > >> >> to have our project tasks and their completion progress status easily > >> >> manageable and viewvable by every team member. I also expect (they > >> >> talk > >> >> about integration with CVS but I haven't yet evaluated how it's done) > >> >> this software will allow to keep distributed source control for the > >> >> team. > >> >> This software seems to have a free community edition and if that is > >> >> true > >> >> then I can install it on my ASP.NET hosting web site. > >> >> > >> >> Please everybody interested help me to evaluate how useful it is for > >> >> our > >> >> purposes. > >> >> If you can find any better ASP.NET alternatives that woull be very > >> >> useful. > >> >> > >> >> I persoally like a lot this Team Taskboard of SCRUMWorks software: > >> >> > >> >> http://danube.com/sw_flash/feature/features-team_taskboard.html > >> >> > >> >> but this software is JAVA based and a "black-box" for me - I'd not use > >> >> it > >> >> because of that. > >> >> > >> >> I'm currently spending considerably more than one hour here to prepare > >> >> all that - I can't ask to spend that much time you or other AcceessD > >> >> members but when everything ready I'd propose to strickly keep the > >> >> context of spending not more than one hour (5 hours total per week) > >> >> for > >> >> this project. Well, maybe some more time discussing here how it will > >> >> be > >> >> proceeding... > >> >> > >> >> I'd set 9th of Macrh 2009 as the start date for this project - OK? - > >> >> if > >> >> nobody will join us by that date we will try to do it together with > >> >> you. > >> >> Everybody are welcome! If to not participate in this project by doing > >> >> some simple .NET forms design/program then at least to help us to > >> >> evaluate how much this or that feature/task will take to get > >> >> implemented. > >> >> This is so called "estimation using planning poker cards" - > >> >> http://www.crisp.se/planningpoker - doing such an estimation by two > >> >> people could result in not so good results as when it's done by 5 or > >> >> more > >> >> people. > >> >> > >> >> Here are some links on SCRUM/agile and related issues - I will keep > >> >> posting links like that to get convinced some more AccessD members to > >> >> join our project: > >> >> > >> >> Tobias Mayer - my facilitator during SCRUM course there in Helsinki: > >> >> http://www.danube.com/blog/tobias_mayer/ > >> >> > >> >> Agile software development info: > >> >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agile_software_development > >> >> > >> >> Scale Back: Small is Beautiful - how group evaluation/planning results > >> >> in > >> >> simple but very good results: > >> >> http://agilethinking.net/blog/2008/08/18/scale-back-small-is-beautiful > >> >> > >> >> Extreme Scrum (154KB) > >> >> https://www-927.ibm.com/ibm/cas/archives/2007/data/Agile/Extreme_Scrum.pdf > >> >> > >> >> What happens when we are all connected - Future Views > >> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqPs0xuG39Q (~6 min) > >> >> > >> >> "Only 3% of the world is on broadband today, and it's neither cheap, > >> >> fast > >> >> or mobile enough. This will change in the next 2-3 years, and the > >> >> implications are huge: everyone shares, everyone networks with > >> >> strangers-like-me, everyone co-creates, everything is connected. A > >> >> video > >> >> by Futurist and Author Gerd Leonhard" > >> >> > >> >> Working on SCRUM/Agile infrastructure here/expecting for more AccessD > >> >> to > >> >> connect this project... > >> >> > >> >> Please comment on this my posting - all and every comments and > >> >> contributions are very welcome! > >> >> > >> >> Thank you. > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> Shamil > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- > >> >> From: "Gustav Brock" <gustav at cactus.dk> > >> >> To: <accessd at databaseadvisors.com> > >> >> Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2009 08:10:00 +0100 > >> >> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Scrum (was: Find First in an Array? ...) > >> >> > >> >> > Hi Shamil > >> >> > > >> >> > Not much response to your proposal ... I guess our fellow listers > >> >> > are > >> >> > too busy or just don't feel the need to experience how to work in a > >> >> > group. > >> >> > To be honest, neither do I have currently that need but as "you > >> >> > never > >> >> > know" I am prepared to allocate the time you suggest. That makes > >> >> > two. > >> >> > But two? Doesn't it require three "to make a crowd"? > >> >> > > >> >> > Your adjusted description of the project fits me very well. > >> >> > > >> >> > /gustav > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> AccessD mailing list > >> >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > >> >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > >> >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > >> >> > >> > > >> > -- > >> > AccessD mailing list > >> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > >> > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > >> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > >> > > >> > >> -- > >> AccessD mailing list > >> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > >> http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > >> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > > > > -- > > AccessD mailing list > > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > -- > AccessD mailing list > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com >