[AccessD] Data Export Spec - Rev1

> I've found that most clients don't have a clue
> on what and how things are programmed.
Hi Gustav,

Yes, I know, and I'm constantly trying to educate them, it works sometimes,
sometimes fails.
I'm trying to involve them in software development process.
I'm trying to explain them that going ahead without planning and taking some
additional actions to be ready for future changes is a risky and expensive
"adventure" not serious modern business.
Why should I do that education for free?
I should be fair with my customers and explain why I do this or that and how
much this or that work costs and how much it could cost them if we skip some
work I think is important. And then they decide take the risk on themselves
or pay me more now and put the risks of future changes for relatively low
costs on my shoulders.

As far as I see mainstream modern development is based on the sentence "the
World of software is the World of constant change". My customers should know
that and understand that these changes can be very costly if do not take
preventive measures.

I'm a kind of tired on constant redoing because of "silly impatient
customers" or my own impatient silliness. Customers pay for that work but
this kind of work is so boring - and it's like building a "Tower of
Babylon"...

I'm trying to change with my customers that widespread situation in software
development for small- and middle- size businesses.

Yes, there are situations when customers need a "quick&dirty" work done
today to use it immediately - in such situations I just quickly program
requested solution and let them use it.

Shamil

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
To: <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2005 3:34 PM
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Data Export Spec - Rev1


> Hi Shamil
>
> I've found that most clients don't have a clue on what and how things are
programmed. They are only interested in results and working apps.
>
> Thus, programming anything "for the future" we do on our own, either for
fun, for testing new techniques or for being prepared for the client's next
step. Should he take this next step, we charge in full even though it can be
programmed in a fraction of the time for programming the first step.
>
> /gustav
>
> >>> shamil at users.mns.ru 21-10-2005 23:42:19 >>>
>
> <<<
> Clients are very pragmatic.
> >>>
> Yes, I know.
> And I saw it many times and I'm continuing to see how this client's
> pragmatism results in bad software and then they blaim bad developers.
> I'm pragmatic too I think - let's try to educate clients step by step? IT
> industry is mature enough now for this clients educatiion work. (Yes, I
know
> I sound too optimistic, real life isn't like that, Been there, seen that.
Or
> I'd better say I'm still there and see that everyday troubles in my own
work
> with "badly educated in software development" customers. It's not easy to
> convince clients to wait a little bit more for end results they needed
> "yesterday". It's even more complicated to convince them to pay today for
> additional work, which results in their own savings in long run. It's
often
> necessary to invest our own time. But when customers see good final
> results then the next steps for the next projects are easier...)
>
> It's just silly (as John said) to see how resources are wasted when
> relatively small additional efforts used on project envision and solution
> architecture design phase result in savings in short and long runs and in
a
> flexible ready for future changes solution, which may find application in
> the areas, where "quick&dirty" will never find....
>
> Recap
> ======
> 1. I'm not pretending to develop a universal solution.
> 2. I'm pragmatic
> 3. I believe(I see) that IT industry is mature enough for simple but
> flexible, ready for future changes, mature software design and development
> solutions.
>
> Shamil
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Gustav Brock" <Gustav at cactus.dk>
> To: <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
> Sent: Friday, October 21, 2005 2:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Data Export Spec - Rev1
>
>
> > Hi John and Shamil
> >
> > Interesting to follow this thread. It demonstrates what happens when you
> move from a fixed to-the-point solution (like my example) over a generic
> solution as John is suggesting to a universal solution as Shamil has in
> mind - and all the considerations that move causes.
> >
> > I'm pretty much in line with Shamil on this. However, time has shown me
> that such thoughts most often are over the head and/or pockets of the
client
> and you'll have to compromise. Clients are very pragmatic. But during this
> at least you have a nice intellectual time with yourself realizing that
you
> are ahead of the client!
>
>
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