[AccessD] Web Applications

" If IE8 provides developer tools superior to FireBug, I'll consider 
switching, too." Ken

...I'm not knocking FF itself, just the Mac like cult that has developed 
around it :)
...as for IE8 developer tools see: 
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dd565628(VS.85).aspx

...IE8 Developer's Tools is actually a pretty good port of FireBug to IE8 
and comes with every install.

William

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Kenneth Ismert" <kismert at gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, April 06, 2009 12:41 PM
To: <accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
Subject: Re: [AccessD] Web Applications

> Hi, All,
>
> Some further responses:
>
> Mark,
> "I challenge anyone to be proficient in all of the below with development
> via text editor."
> I did it for two years using just creaky old Notepad++, and a GREP tool. 
> Of
> course, I was using PHP/Apache/MySQL, which is suited to this development
> style. I even took a shot at writing an MVC web framework in PHP, which,
> while not ready for production use, showed promising results. Almost the
> whole Ruby on Rails community uses Textmate.
>
> Drew,
> "If someone really wanted to learn to fly, I wouldn't recommend they start
> with an SR-71 either! ;)"
> I have to agree with you on this one. The opinion of certain local
> developers who I respect is that ASP.NET is overkill. My 
> 'over-the-shoulder'
> view of the large ASP.NET project I was doing CSS consulting for was that
> the group of young, talented developers where creating more mess than they
> were solving. Using a super-fancy IDE doesn't absolve you of the 
> discipline
> required to make a successful project. And if you have the discipline, you
> can do it without the super-fancy IDE.
>
> William,
> My "minimum effort" web development strategy is:
> * Use the subset of CSS 2.1 that IE7 supports
> * Develop the site in FireFox/FireBug (see "Browsers of 2009" link ... it
> really is less effort to do it this way)
> * Tweak the site to work in IE7 (this requires *very* few changes from
> standard CSS)
> * Work in IE6 to ensure the site is functional, and achieve 80%-96% of the
> look of the site in the top-tier browsers
>
> "...but less a few plug-ins I find useful for web work, IE8 is my
> development browser for the moment ..."
> I can't help but wondering whether the "few plug-ins I find useful" is
> FireBug under FireFox. If IE8 provides developer tools superior to 
> FireBug,
> I'll consider switching, too.
>
> "...I find the FF devotees akin to any other cult group .."
> Without the FireFox gadfly, Microsoft would never have developed IE8. This
> forced forward progress is good for all. It remains to be seen whether IE8
> will staunch the losses Microsoft continues to suffer in the browser 
> arena.
>
> "...the practical matter is that IE remains the defacto user standard..."
> The fact is there are real standards, maintained by the W3C. When you look
> at compliance to *actual* standards, FireFox/Safari/Opera/Chrome are far
> better than IE, although 8 closes the gap considerably. This is the
> overwhelming consensus of the standards-based web development community.
>
> -Ken
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>