[AccessD] Better Access GUI

Sun Nov 12 09:33:46 CST 2023

Funny (but true) story.  StarRing in 2004 I spent 5 years building a
complete call center, by myself, for Disability Insurance Specialists in
CT.  They started a company to handle disability claims for the big
insurance companies. I started with a single denormalized spreadsheet with
about 20 tables of claim info for 5000 claims, exported from the insurance
company mainframe.

I billed around $300k over those 5 years, ending with about 180 tables,
with forms and reports, taking claims from the initial claim phone call to
exporting payment info to the banks, handling everything to the doctors,
private investigators, lawyers and so forth.

DIS would have the bigwigs of the insurance companies come in for sales
presentations.  One time the visiting bigwig told the VP that I worked for
that his company had contracted with a company to build "pretty much what
we were doing" directly on their IBM mainframe.  Three years and three
million dollars later they canceled the project because it just never
worked.

And of course they were contracting with DIS to be their call center,
running about 40 work stations on PCs, and at that time, a JET BE on a
server.  They later moved the BE to SQL Server.

So there ya go, another Access success story.  Five years and 180 tables
(with forms and reports) is a lot of work and a somewhat large system, but
Access handled it with aplomb.

On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 9:44 AM James Button via AccessD <
accessd at databaseadvisors.com> wrote:

> I have used Access, DB2, Oracle and several other database management
> systems ,
> but stopped developing apps a while ago.
>
> However -
> Main selling point for Access is it works on general office (Windows)
> desktop and portable (laptop) systems without requiring installation per
> device licences of the DBMS
> Also:
> The Access facility is fairly easy to manage and tweak as changes are
> needed.
> With training of in-house support staff also being relatively cheap
> It uses SQL for queries, and can have the back-end data store switched
> from Access to SQLServer (etc.)
>
> DB2 is, my consideration, more for massive corporate -, multi server,
> international data management,
> needing a relatively highly skilled DBA and IT systems manager  for its
> basic admin and maintenance,  note the DBMS that is,
>
> Oracle is a more web screen oriented facility -
> still needing well experienced staff to manage it.
>
>
> I am currently doing UAT and VVT failure reports on the new council
> library facility - unpaid, I'm just trying to manage my borrowings using it!
> Apparently it has already had a year's testing, and seems to need at least
> a couple of months to do something as simple in Access as add a sort (ORDER
> BY) to the data presentation.-
> Old system was basically text based - as in scrollable lists
> New system is "pretty" and visually enhanced facility -
> But, the design being visually based means that response is (relatively)
> abysmal - as in several minutes needed to present a HD screen of data, and
> updates now being done on an overnight ( if we are lucky) basis.
> ( getting the graphics from the server, and transmitting them to the user
> sure is using a lot of bandwidth)
> with a page-down action needed for each subsequent next half-dozen items
> with the new page image needing to be transmitted.
>
> So - another benefit of Access -
> Saves a lot of user waiting for their data to be presented.
> Saves a lot of user waiting for adjustments to the App.
> Saves a lot of cost in the hardware needed to run it.
> Saves a lot of cost having adjustments made to the data management and
> storage.
> Saves a lot of cost having adjustments made to the data presentation.
> Saves a lot of cost in the staffing required to manage it, and the storage.
>
> So - maybe for a few $million, they can have a pretty system, and only
> another million or so for the staff to manage the App and the
> infrastructure to use it!
>
> Basically,
> Admit it does not look pretty
> But it is effective and relatively reasonable cost to acquire,  install,
> run and maintain.
>
> Sort of like a McLaren sports car looks great, but for general use maybe a
> Ford motors estate is better for general use, and much cheaper to run, and
> service.
>
> JimB
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: AccessD <accessd-bounces+jamesbutton=
> blueyonder.co.uk at databaseadvisors.com> On Behalf Of John Colby
> Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2023 12:38 PM
> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <
> accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Better Access GUI
>
> LOL. I have to say I think web apps look fugly, but it is the norm now.  I
> would say all you can do is to make the controls flat, make the colors
> washed out.  Make it as ugly as you can figure out how to be.
>
> I would also say that your task is really to sell the app and its
> advantages over a web app.  Sell how quickly you can get things done vs the
> competition.  If the look is going to nix a sale then do you really want to
> sell into that?  You will spend the rest of your life adjusting the look.
> If you can't sell the functionality then sell to the next client.  Or move
> on to java (ick) or some such.  The only advantage of a web app is the
> ability to operate over the web.  And if they need that then Access is not
> the best tool anyway.
>
> On Sat, Nov 11, 2023 at 11:26 PM David Emerson <newsgrps at dalyn.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
> > They are comparing it to web based applications where the text controls
> > have rounded edges, and some drag and drop functionality for interacting
> > with Google maps.
> >
> > Yes, I know they are different beasts but if the users don't like it they
> > are not going to pay for it ☹
> >
> > Yes, I also am looking for something that has the ability to handle the
> > extensive business logic of the database.
> >
> > Ideal would be to be able to do it all in Access (so I don't have to pay
> > someone else to do the programming).  Does anyone have any examples where
> > they have modernised the look of Access forms (we are not interested in
> > Reports).
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: AccessD <accessd-bounces+newsgrps=dalyn.co.nz at databaseadvisors.com
> >
> > On Behalf Of Stuart McLachlan
> > Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2023 11:23 AM
> > To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <
> > accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
> > Subject: Re: [AccessD] Better Access GUI
> >
> > My thought too.
> >
> > An Access FE is not just forms (whcih can pretty much be designed to look
> > like anything you want), what  about the reports and business logic which
> > are part of the FE if you go to another FE technology?
> >
> > On 11 Nov 2023 at 18:51, John Colby wrote:
> >
> > > I would ask to see what they are comparing it against.
> > >
> > > On Sat, Nov 11, 2023 at 6:21PM David Emerson <newsgrps at dalyn.co.nz>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi Listers,
> > > >
> > > > I have an application that is being marketed to large corporations.
> > > > The comment that often gets in the way of a sale is that the GUI
> > > > looks outdated compared to other more modern applications they are
> > > > using.
> > > >
> > > > Apart from the "It doesn't need to look pretty to be functional"
> > > > argument, does any one have any suggestions for alternative
> > > > Front-ends to Access?  I wouldn't be looking to learn how to program
> > > > them myself, but would like some suggestions so that when I seek a
> > > > company to do the conversion I know a bit about what they might be
> > > > offering.
> > > >
> > > > Regards
> > > >
> > > > David Emerson
> > > > Dalyn Software Ltd
> > > > Adelaide, Australia
> >
> >
> > --
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> > AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
> > https://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
> > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
> >
>
>
> --
> John W. Colby
> Colby Consulting
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> Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>
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>

-- 
John W. Colby
Colby Consulting