[AccessD] Better Access GUI

[Tina N Fields]

"Access handled it with aplomb."

And with the absolutely amazing talent of John Colby!

T

Tina Norris Fields
231-322-2787
tinanfields-at-torchlake-dot-com

On 11/12/2023 10:33 AM, John Colby wrote:
> Funny (but true) story.  StarRing in 2004 I spent 5 years building a
> complete call center, by myself, for Disability Insurance Specialists in
> CT.  They started a company to handle disability claims for the big
> insurance companies. I started with a single denormalized spreadsheet with
> about 20 tables of claim info for 5000 claims, exported from the insurance
> company mainframe.
>
> I billed around $300k over those 5 years, ending with about 180 tables,
> with forms and reports, taking claims from the initial claim phone call to
> exporting payment info to the banks, handling everything to the doctors,
> private investigators, lawyers and so forth.
>
> DIS would have the bigwigs of the insurance companies come in for sales
> presentations.  One time the visiting bigwig told the VP that I worked for
> that his company had contracted with a company to build "pretty much what
> we were doing" directly on their IBM mainframe.  Three years and three
> million dollars later they canceled the project because it just never
> worked.
>
> And of course they were contracting with DIS to be their call center,
> running about 40 work stations on PCs, and at that time, a JET BE on a
> server.  They later moved the BE to SQL Server.
>
> So there ya go, another Access success story.  Five years and 180 tables
> (with forms and reports) is a lot of work and a somewhat large system, but
> Access handled it with aplomb.
>
> On Sun, Nov 12, 2023 at 9:44 AM James Button via AccessD <
> accessd at databaseadvisors.com> wrote:
>
>> I have used Access, DB2, Oracle and several other database management
>> systems ,
>> but stopped developing apps a while ago.
>>
>> However -
>> Main selling point for Access is it works on general office (Windows)
>> desktop and portable (laptop) systems without requiring installation per
>> device licences of the DBMS
>> Also:
>> The Access facility is fairly easy to manage and tweak as changes are
>> needed.
>> With training of in-house support staff also being relatively cheap
>> It uses SQL for queries, and can have the back-end data store switched
>> from Access to SQLServer (etc.)
>>
>> DB2 is, my consideration, more for massive corporate -, multi server,
>> international data management,
>> needing a relatively highly skilled DBA and IT systems manager  for its
>> basic admin and maintenance,  note the DBMS that is,
>>
>> Oracle is a more web screen oriented facility -
>> still needing well experienced staff to manage it.
>>
>>
>> I am currently doing UAT and VVT failure reports on the new council
>> library facility - unpaid, I'm just trying to manage my borrowings using it!
>> Apparently it has already had a year's testing, and seems to need at least
>> a couple of months to do something as simple in Access as add a sort (ORDER
>> BY) to the data presentation.-
>> Old system was basically text based - as in scrollable lists
>> New system is "pretty" and visually enhanced facility -
>> But, the design being visually based means that response is (relatively)
>> abysmal - as in several minutes needed to present a HD screen of data, and
>> updates now being done on an overnight ( if we are lucky) basis.
>> ( getting the graphics from the server, and transmitting them to the user
>> sure is using a lot of bandwidth)
>> with a page-down action needed for each subsequent next half-dozen items
>> with the new page image needing to be transmitted.
>>
>> So - another benefit of Access -
>> Saves a lot of user waiting for their data to be presented.
>> Saves a lot of user waiting for adjustments to the App.
>> Saves a lot of cost in the hardware needed to run it.
>> Saves a lot of cost having adjustments made to the data management and
>> storage.
>> Saves a lot of cost having adjustments made to the data presentation.
>> Saves a lot of cost in the staffing required to manage it, and the storage.
>>
>> So - maybe for a few $million, they can have a pretty system, and only
>> another million or so for the staff to manage the App and the
>> infrastructure to use it!
>>
>> Basically,
>> Admit it does not look pretty
>> But it is effective and relatively reasonable cost to acquire,  install,
>> run and maintain.
>>
>> Sort of like a McLaren sports car looks great, but for general use maybe a
>> Ford motors estate is better for general use, and much cheaper to run, and
>> service.
>>
>> JimB
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: AccessD <accessd-bounces+jamesbutton=
>> blueyonder.co.uk at databaseadvisors.com> On Behalf Of John Colby
>> Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2023 12:38 PM
>> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <
>> accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Better Access GUI
>>
>> LOL. I have to say I think web apps look fugly, but it is the norm now.  I
>> would say all you can do is to make the controls flat, make the colors
>> washed out.  Make it as ugly as you can figure out how to be.
>>
>> I would also say that your task is really to sell the app and its
>> advantages over a web app.  Sell how quickly you can get things done vs the
>> competition.  If the look is going to nix a sale then do you really want to
>> sell into that?  You will spend the rest of your life adjusting the look.
>> If you can't sell the functionality then sell to the next client.  Or move
>> on to java (ick) or some such.  The only advantage of a web app is the
>> ability to operate over the web.  And if they need that then Access is not
>> the best tool anyway.
>>
>> On Sat, Nov 11, 2023 at 11:26 PM David Emerson<newsgrps at dalyn.co.nz>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> They are comparing it to web based applications where the text controls
>>> have rounded edges, and some drag and drop functionality for interacting
>>> with Google maps.
>>>
>>> Yes, I know they are different beasts but if the users don't like it they
>>> are not going to pay for it ☹
>>>
>>> Yes, I also am looking for something that has the ability to handle the
>>> extensive business logic of the database.
>>>
>>> Ideal would be to be able to do it all in Access (so I don't have to pay
>>> someone else to do the programming).  Does anyone have any examples where
>>> they have modernised the look of Access forms (we are not interested in
>>> Reports).
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: AccessD <accessd-bounces+newsgrps=dalyn.co.nz at databaseadvisors.com
>>>
>>> On Behalf Of Stuart McLachlan
>>> Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2023 11:23 AM
>>> To: Access Developers discussion and problem solving <
>>> accessd at databaseadvisors.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [AccessD] Better Access GUI
>>>
>>> My thought too.
>>>
>>> An Access FE is not just forms (whcih can pretty much be designed to look
>>> like anything you want), what  about the reports and business logic which
>>> are part of the FE if you go to another FE technology?
>>>
>>> On 11 Nov 2023 at 18:51, John Colby wrote:
>>>
>>>> I would ask to see what they are comparing it against.
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Nov 11, 2023 at 6:21PM David Emerson<newsgrps at dalyn.co.nz>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Listers,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have an application that is being marketed to large corporations.
>>>>> The comment that often gets in the way of a sale is that the GUI
>>>>> looks outdated compared to other more modern applications they are
>>>>> using.
>>>>>
>>>>> Apart from the "It doesn't need to look pretty to be functional"
>>>>> argument, does any one have any suggestions for alternative
>>>>> Front-ends to Access?  I wouldn't be looking to learn how to program
>>>>> them myself, but would like some suggestions so that when I seek a
>>>>> company to do the conversion I know a bit about what they might be
>>>>> offering.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards
>>>>>
>>>>> David Emerson
>>>>> Dalyn Software Ltd
>>>>> Adelaide, Australia
>>>
>>> --
>>> AccessD mailing list
>>> AccessD at databaseadvisors.com
>>> https://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/accessd
>>> Website:http://www.databaseadvisors.com
>>>
>>
>> --
>> John W. Colby
>> Colby Consulting
>> --
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>>
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>>
>