Tydda Jon - Lonza Slough
jon.tydda at lonza.com
Tue Aug 26 09:22:46 CDT 2014
I have a Corsair water cooling unit in my PC, I only got it because I failed to notice that the processor I'd ordered didn't come with a heat sink & fan, so I had to go out and buy something if I wanted to use it that day... Happened that the only thing they had was a water cooling system. I'd always been dubious about introducing water to my computers, but as it's covered by the house insurance, I figured I should try everything once :-) I know the computer is quieter than my previous one, but that could be due to a better design (in terms of air-flow), the newer components are more efficient and don't heat up so much, and they're not old and full of dust. It's hard to compare a new system with a 7 year old one, and make any decent conclusions in that way, but it's definitely quieter and faster, and that's all that really matters to me. Jon -----Original Message----- From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto:dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Mark Breen Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2014 10:41 AM To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] How to revive an XP POS PC Hello Jim, Have you built any water cooled units yourself? Can you tell us what units you have used? First comment I have to make is if the processor is sitting quietly at 38 - 40 degrees Celsius, why would anyone need to make it cooler. They will happily work at even 80 degrees C, so when it is below 40, absolutely no need for water. I did some experimentation with them a few years ago. I built a machine with a cheap €15 - €18 passive heatsink with a fan and compared various tests. I then did more tests with a high quality passive cooler and fan (approx €25 - €28). It was one or two degrees cooler after running for a few hours. I also tested with Prime 95 and the passive cooling was ok. Finally I installed an expensive water cooler and ran that for over a year. Result: 1) Not any cooler at all 2) You can hear the pump running if you listen carefully. It is not silent. 3) Once the radiator became dusty, the air blowing through it started to whistle slightly because the opening were slightly more narrow. In summary, I saw no benefit what so ever with water cooling. Nowadays, I just use a simple passive air cooler with a fan. Total kit costing €15 - €18. For my own machine I usually disconnect the CPU fan and convection alone takes of dissipating the heat from the CPU. When I do that, my PC has no moving parts at all. Mark On 24 August 2014 23:50, Jim Lawrence <accessd at shaw.ca> wrote: > The only comment I could make of that fine selection of hardware is to > put in a good water cooling unit. They are not as complex as they use > to be, in fact I was shown one where it just snaps in. Water cooling > has a couple of advantages; one, you can over-clock the CPU, with no > heating concerns and two, the water cooling unit is much quieter than > multiple fans needed for a real beast with its high-end video card. > > That seems like a great store for parts and pieces...hard to drive > there though. > > Jim > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Breen" <marklbreen at gmail.com> > To: "Discussion of Hardware and Software issues" < > dba-tech at databaseadvisors.com> > Sent: Friday, August 22, 2014 2:55:49 AM > Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] How to revive an XP POS PC > > Hello All, > I have mentioned it on here before, but because I love it so much, > please endure me commenting again ;) > > A few years ago, I listened to a Joel Spolsky and Jeff Atwood podcast. > They were discussing the ultimate developers machine. After almost > an hour of discussion, they finalised it by saying "Jedi warrriors > build their own light sabres". > > Well I am not quite a Jedi warrior but I decided to build a machine anyway. > Had not built a PC in 20 years. Until then, I had presumed that > buying Dell was good enough. I have since built about 20 - 50 > machines for various friends, family and a very limited few customers. > > *Speed* > The first thing that I did not know was that Intel sell their chips > with a marked speed, eg i7 *3.5Ghz*. All the PC manufacturers supply > motherboards that accept that speed and do not allow you to modify it. > By purchasing an OEM motherboard, you can simply go into your bios and > change the speed up to 4.3, 4.4, 4.5 and even 4.8GHz. Each chip has > its own limits. These machines then become extremely fast. Here are > some examples of processor costs just approx to give you a sense of > the scale > > i3 €88 > i5 €180 > i7 €233 > > There are other overclocking tricks you can do to get even more, but I > ignore them all. My overclocking process lasts not more than 30 seconds. > > > *Quality* > There are cheap and nasty cases and powersupplies. eg a case for €25 > and a PSU for €15. There are even case and PSU combined for €25. > However, there are cases for €50 - €60 and beautiful power supplies > for €50. These are a pleasure to work with, to assemble and to own. > > *Silence* > The higher quality components are virtually silent. That means, in a > silent office, you cannot, or almost cannot hear the PSU fan moving. > To add to that, I then use only SSD disks. My PC is then as noisy as > my pencil. > > *Time Required to build a machine* > Choosing components - Hours and Days > Unpacking cardboard - 20 - 30 mins > Building the machine 20 - 60 mins > Fiddling with the cables to make them .1 % tidier - hours if you wish > Looking at it afterwards with the love a father had for his son - a > lifetime > > > *Cooling* > There is a lot of talk about cooling. I usually install a CPU cooler > that costs approx €20. My processor almost never rises above warm. > When I build silent machines, I disconnect the CPU fan and then monitor the temp. > It usually rises a few degrees and then settles down and convection > cooling works fine. With no fan connected, my CPU still never rises > above > 50 degrees Celsius. This is quite cool for a CPU. The limit is 100 > Degrees Celsius. > > > > The formatting of the following text is horrible, but it is simple > three tab separated columns. > > Examples of Costs > *A budget machine* > Ecomony Case Antec VSK-3000E Micro-ATX Black Case No PSU €25.06 > Corsair High Quality PSU Corsair Builder Series 80+ Bronze > CMPSU-430CXV2UK 430W Power Supply (PSU) €38.22 AMD Six Core Procerror > AMD FX 6300 Black Edition Six Core Processor Socket > AM3+ €80.04 > Asus Motherboard Asus M5A97 R2.0 AMD 970 AM3+ Motherboard Socket AM3+ > €68.79 > 8GB RAM 8GB (2x4GB) Corsair DDR3 XMS3, PC3-10600 (1333), Non-ECC > Unbuffered, CAS 9-9-9-24, 1.50V €68.57 > 1 TB Seagate Traditional Disk 1TB Seagate ST1000DM003 Barracuda > 7200.14 SATA 6Gb/s 7200rpm 64MB Cache 8ms NCQ OEM €42.18 CPU Fan > Arctic Cooling Freezer 7 Pro v2 S775/115x/1366/AM3/AM2+/AM2/939 Up to > 130 Watts €19.09 Case Fan 120mm AKASA AK-191BL near Silent Imperial > Blue value case fan > €5.17 > Wired MS Wired Keyboard 200 for Business, USB Port, Black €7.61 Wired > (option for Wireless) MS Basic Optical Mouse for Business Black 3 > Button with Scroll Wheel PS2/USB PC/MAC €8.30 DVD Read/Write Samsung > SH-224DB/BEBE 24x DVD±R, 8x DVD±DL, DVD+RW x8/-RW x6, x12 RAM Dual > Layer SATA BLACK OEM €14.29 Total €377.32 > > > *A large machine* > High Quality Case Corsair Carbide 300R Mid Tower Gaming Case Black No > PSU > €63.21 > Corsair High Quality PSU 750W Corsair Builder Series CX CP-9020015-UK > Non-Modular, 80 PLUS Bronze, Single Rail, 1x120mm Fan, ATX v2.31 PSU > €71.47 > Top of the range Intel Intel Core i7-4790K Socket 1150 'Devils Canyon' > (22nm) Quad Core Processor Retail with Heat Sink Fan €265.38 Asus > Motherboard Asus Z87-K Intel Z87 Socket 1150 Motherboard €87.01 > 16 GB Ram Corsair Memory XMS3 16GB (2x8GB) DDR3 PC3-10666 (1333) Dual > Channel Desktop €133.54 > 4 TB x 2 4TB Seagate ST4000DM000 Desktop HDD.15, 3.5" HDD, SATA III - > 6Gb/s, 5900rpm, 64MB Cache, 8ms, NCQ, OEM €114.62 CPU Fan Cooler > Master Hyper 212 EVO, 4 Heat Pipes Direct Contact, with 120mm Quiet > Fan LGA775/1155/1156/1366/AM2/AM2+/AM3/FM1 €27.19 Case Fan 120mm > AKASA AK-191BL near Silent Imperial Blue value case fan > €5.10 > DVD Samsung SH-224DB/BEBE 24x DVD±R, 8x DVD±DL, DVD+RW x8/-RW x6, x12 > RAM Dual Layer SATA BLACK OEM €14.10 Total €781.63 > > Source of components www.scan.co.uk > > You can see how you can tweak the values to build the machine you need. > > I hope it is interesting to you. > > Mark > > > > > > > > > > > On 21 August 2014 09:55, Gustav Brock <gustav at cactus.dk> wrote: > > > Hi Arthur > > > > I don't, but I do buy non-expensive workstations with Xeon > > processors and > > 12+ GB ram. The trick is, that the built-in Intel P6000 graphic > > 12+ processor > > is fast enough for me (no gaming), thus I can save the cost of an > optional > > graphics adapter and buy SSD drives. A marvelous combo - life it too > short > > for slow machines. > > My home machine always runs the latest Windows preview (soon Windows > > 9) while my office machine runs the latest official Windows (currently 8.1). > > > > /gustav > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com [mailto: > > dba-tech-bounces at databaseadvisors.com] On Behalf Of Arthur Fuller > > Sent: Thursday, August 21, 2014 9:08 AM > > To: Discussion of Hardware and Software issues > > Subject: Re: [dba-Tech] How to revive an XP POS PC > > > > Good advice in general, Jim. Just one question: who spends $2k on a > > PC these days? I bought a pretty serious laptop (Dell, with 8GB RAM > > and 1TB hard disk) for $750 and that was almost a year back, so the > > same machine should cost less now. I plugged in an old 22" monitor > > so it now has two screens when it's at home, which is almost always. > > When I go out, I take the Acer Iconia, which is also more than a > > year old but back when it was new it was slightly more than $200. > > > > Arthur > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > dba-Tech mailing list > > dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com > > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech > > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > > _______________________________________________ > dba-Tech mailing list > dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > > _______________________________________________ > dba-Tech mailing list > dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com > http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech > Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com > _______________________________________________ dba-Tech mailing list dba-Tech at databaseadvisors.com http://databaseadvisors.com/mailman/listinfo/dba-tech Website: http://www.databaseadvisors.com ________________________________ This communication and its attachments, if any, may contain confidential and privileged information the use of which by other persons or entities than the intended recipient is prohibited. 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